Thread Number: 15921
Sanitaire Sc886 Vs. Kirby Sentra 		[Down to Last]

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Post# 169773   2/16/2012 at 12:11 (4,452 days old) by henriquesousa7 (California)        

They're Both Picking Up Rice and Oatmeal.
Sanitaire Won (My Option)

CLICK HERE TO GO TO henriquesousa7's LINK
Post# 169776 , Reply# 1   2/16/2012 at 12:35 (4,452 days old) by joshdonnell ()        
Well

 Yes it did but ive used then and i kirbys better.

Post# 169838 , Reply# 2   2/17/2012 at 03:30 (4,452 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

The scene is so dimly lit--you can't see much of anything---camera users--when filming for youtube or whatever---LIGHT-cameras need LIGHT to work.I can't tell in this video which machine won.I go with the Kirby-the Sanitaire with an ST -NOT F&G bag performs about as well as the Kirby.In reality its almost ---"A DRAW!" as they say in wrestling.The person filming this should redo the video and have some LIGHTS for the camera!

Post# 169842 , Reply# 3   2/17/2012 at 04:17 (4,452 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

I love how people always claim "It's a draw" when a Kirby is tested against a Sanitaire, heck, I've done my own tests off camera (cos apparently I'm "biost" according to one youtuber, so why bother making videos!!) and there were never any "draws" with the different setups I've used (ST, F&G, Shake-out bags for the 'taires, and Poly, Paper and shake-out for the Kirbys), the Sanitaires always cleaned deeper, better and quicker, I used to be a firm Kirby fan until I got a Sanitaire, and now I know better... :)

You just have to look in the archives, and even with 100% proof the 'taires win, a Kirby "draws" when it has less dirt in it's bag and the sanitaire has more dirt in it's... :\

I still like my Kirbys though, even though I'm planning to sell a two or three off, I just don't see them in the same blinkered light any more... :)

Post# 169849 , Reply# 4   2/17/2012 at 06:29 (4,451 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

I'll still take the Kirby over the Sanitaire-Remember Sanitaires are designed for commercial-not home usage.Most commercial carpets in the US are low pile.the Kirby does better in the deep pile carpets homes often have-like mine-and Sanitaires cannot be height adjusted properly to work in deeper carpets-the brushroll bogs down too much.I do have Sanitaires in my collection-they are good machines but just find for my place a Kirby or a Royal upright for that matter is better.I have my Sanitaires at their HIGHEST floor nozzle height and the brushes bog down.But they will clean-just not as good as the Kirby in my place.

Post# 169910 , Reply# 5   2/17/2012 at 18:09 (4,451 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

So, tell me, if you used a domestic Eureka upright of the exact same design and the same brushroll, and it beat a Kirby at cleaning, would you say the Eureka had won, or just make up some excuse to back up the Kirby even with proof put right infront of you that the Eureka did better?

Cos frankly, your logic is pretty flaky, the Sanitaire was derived from a Domestic vacuum cleaner, and it cleans better in many situations, after all, there are more houses and carpet types than just "yours", and regardless if something didn't work for "you", if it works for others, and DOES outclean a Kirby, you cannot deny it, and just makes you look like a complete fool when you do try...

Remember a few of years ago and the 2-week challenge between a G3 and an S670? The Kirby had a metal fan fitted which improved it's performance, but the stock Sanitaire with F&G bags outcleaned it on both weeks, and you claimed it as "a draw", even when the G3 had picked up LESS from the same carpeting in the same house, and even with photo evidence, you still claimed it as a draw, and you made yourself out to be a fool back then, and you're doing the same now, so face it, a Kirby will not perform at the same higher level of a Sanitaire, and the more you claim otherwise, well, I've already said what it makes you look like...

And just to remind you, here's the said 2-week test, pay attention to the responses to your posts:



CLICK HERE TO GO TO twocvbloke's LINK
Post# 169956 , Reply# 6   2/18/2012 at 00:55 (4,451 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

I don't have a "Domestic" Eureka to use.And the present Sanitaires are marketed to commercial usages.They are not sold for home usage.Again,I will pit the Kirbys to them anytime.I am just saying the Kirbys work better on my carpeting--your results may vary.We(Other vac dealers in my area) have noticed this.And in those torn open bags--I see more fluff in the Sanitaire bag-but NO grit-like the Kirbys pick up-and fine debris.The Saniatires don't pick that up-Remember in some cases vacuums may perform better or not-just so happens in tht test the Sanitaire worked best for that user-but not for me.No ones "logic" is really flawed-just what vacuum works best for you.The Kirbys and Royals work best on my carpets.And the Sanitaire I have was a RETURN-a customer ordered it thru the local dealer.The user tried it-didn't work for him.I bought it to add to my collection.It is a nice machine-the Kirby is better for me.I don't know what vacuum the former Saniatire owner had-he had shag carpet.He tried the Sanitiare-its a TOL "Contractor" model with the ST bag system.The dealer in my area does not stock Sanitaire uprights-he will order them if a customer wants one.

Post# 169970 , Reply# 7   2/18/2012 at 08:51 (4,450 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

I'm not arguing about what is best, I'm getting the point across that with every single test where a Kirby is involved, you always claim it to be a "draw" when the given proof dictates otherwise, and when someone points out that you are wrong to say that, you blither on about you you you, in THIS test here in THIS thread, the Kirby lost, that's L-O-S-T, there was NO draw...

But yet again, like in that older thread, you're coming up with very weak excuses to say that the Sanitaire did not clean as well as the Kirby because "Kirbys work better in my place", when the fact of the matter was that the modified G3 with a more powerful factory-fitted motor, it failed to clean as well as a *stock* F&G Sanitaire, the same in this test here in this thread, Sanitaire vs. Kirby, Kirby loses to Sanitaire, someone can't get over the fact that their favourite brand has not performed as per their experiences in their own environment...

And of course, the dealer thing crops up, "We the people selling things say brand A is the best and brand X is no good", having worked in a retail environment myself, I know that there are incentives to sell more of a specific brand of item, either from the employer or the suppliers, casting aspersions onto other brands to get the customer to buy the one you're selling, so, think of it this way, you live in the retail world, and everyone else lives in the real world, if you want to sell more Kirbys, or other brands, in your store where you have incentives to do so, you go right ahead, but when people post videos or pictures of demonstrations on here, youtube or wherever, and they find that your favourite "sell more of these" brand loses, don't say "It's a draw" when it is not or "That vacuum won cos it works better on my carpeting" when it's not even being shown tested ON your carpeting, if you can't accept that others have found that their vacuums did not work in your favour, then that's your problem...

Just so you know, once upon a time, I used to be a hardened Kirby nut, nothing could ever beat it in my eyes, then I saw the light when I bought my first Sanitaire, the ZC-880, and since learned that there's more to vacuuming than just Kirbys, and is why I spent the best part of a day riding trains and walking 8 miles to collect my third Sanitaire, the Electrolux C12...

Hmm, now there's a thought, You're not an Aerus dealer are you? Thus having resentment to Electrolux AG which owns the Sanitaire and Eureka brands and took the Electrolux name away from the US company? That would explain a lot if it is so...

Post# 169998 , Reply# 8   2/18/2012 at 13:03 (4,450 days old) by kirbymodel2c (Nottingham, England)        
I ..

 kirbymodel2c's profile picture
I could through my 2 cents worth in... But I don't think I need to lol;o)

James:o)

Post# 170198 , Reply# 9   2/20/2012 at 06:37 (4,448 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

i am NOT a dealer for any vacuum.Are you a Sanitaire dealer by any chance?Again will repeat-the Kirby works best for me-I am going to leave it there.Will drag out my Contractor model and try some more-and another thing for the Sanitaires on my carpets-their belts don't last long.another reason I stick with Kirbys and Royals.

Post# 170233 , Reply# 10   2/20/2012 at 13:37 (4,448 days old) by henriquesousa7 (California)        

I Really Don't Have To Replace The Belt On It Alot. Unless If It Pick Something Up Such As A Staple Or Paperclip It WILL Shreds The Belt But I Always Have A Back Up!
NEVER REALLY HAVE PROBLEM WITH IT!

Post# 170324 , Reply# 11   2/21/2012 at 00:36 (4,448 days old) by twocvbloke ()        
"Are you a Sanitaire dealer by any chance?"

 Let's see now, Electrolux have not sold any Sanitaire models in the UK for s few years now, so, that would mean, goodness me, there's no Sanitaire dealers in the UK at all!!! :O

(Sarcasm, incase it goes right over your head)

I guess living in ignorance must be bliss, cos the way you describe your "issues" with Sanitaires, you're not adjusting the height of the vac properly, too high and it doesn't clean effectively, too low and it burns out the belts, my C12, which has the 6-position height adjuster, can even be set with ease, it's like how you do it on a Kirby, lower it to the carpet until the tone changes, then drop one more and off you go, get it wrong and it doesn't work...

But what is really pissing me off is your insisting that because something doesn't work for you, therefore it must never ever work for anyone else and god forbid anyone ever correct you, as I am doing, and when they do, you still claim you're right when you're just making yourself out to look like a complete idiot!!

But, like I say, living in ignorance must be bliss...

Post# 170332 , Reply# 12   2/21/2012 at 03:50 (4,448 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Yes,I have my Sanitaire set at the right height.YOU are the IDIOT!!!And I am not saying the Sanitaire or any other vacuum works or doesn't work for someone else.You are completly ignorant of what flooring I have in my house.Deep pile carpets are common in US homes-and low pile carpets are commonly used in US commercial places.The Sanitaires work well on these.It is the most commonly sold commercial upright in the US.YOU are pissing me off by saying the Sanitaire works better than the Kirby in my own home when you aren't here to try it!!And I don't intend to walk 8 miles to buy ANY vacuum-did you carry it back all of those 8 miles?

Post# 170333 , Reply# 13   2/21/2012 at 04:40 (4,448 days old) by twocvbloke ()        
"did you carry it back all of those 8 miles?"

 Actually it was half that, you know, walking from the train station to the seller's home, 4 miles, the C12 was dismantled and placed in my rucksack and I walked the 4 miles back to the station. You should try it, it's called "exercise", and gets you out of the house more...

So, I'm the idiot, okay, so, who was it who said in this thread that the test posted by someone else was "a draw" when you weren't in the same room as the tested vacs?

That was you.

Who was it on many other threads on this site who claims that any Sanitaire is outcleaned by a Kirby, no matter who it belongs to or where it's located or what carpet it's used on, because that's how it is for you?

That was you.

Who is it who argues the toss over any forthwith discussion on said vacuums when people do not back up your opinion which is based on your limited experience?

That is you.

Fine, it doesn't work "for you", that is not my problem, that is not Henrique's problem, it's not the problem of anybody who was a member on this forum past or present, it's yours.

If the people who test their vacs in their homes or businesses decide what is best and what won, don't contradict them, those results are "their" findings. If you want to contradict them, start booking airline tickets and taking your machines to their houses so you can say whether or not that one thing or the other cleans better, cos unless you have the proof to back up your "it's a draw" statement, then you're just talking utter rubbish...

I haven't seen you do any video demonstrations, using measuring tools (Waterlift gauges, Airflow meters, demonstration tools to show how much has been picked up, and more powerful vacs to pick up what has been left behind), so can you blame me for not believing your "facts"? When you start showing such demonstrations and measurements, maybe I'll take an interest in what you find, but until then, I'll just say, "Prove me wrong"...

Post# 170336 , Reply# 14   2/21/2012 at 06:30 (4,447 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

I haven't seen you use any test instruments on vacuums.This is getting pointless.I do my "exercise" thank you.I can see you don't have any experience,either.And what videos I see-you really can't see what the vacuums involved in the films have picked up.I have worked in the vacuum shops in my area,and have made comparisons there.Not just in my house.

Post# 170338 , Reply# 15   2/21/2012 at 06:42 (4,447 days old) by Trebor ()        
The vac shop...

 where I am employed sells a LOT of Sanitaires. The problem with them deep cleaning is not lack of airflow, or suction. The 'bogging down' as described above is due to the machine sucking the carpet so tightly that little air can pass through.

We routinely make a small modification to the unit when we assemble it. We drill a 1/8" hole in the housing behind the brushroll on each side of the fan opening, thus allowing greater airflow, which keeps the fan turning, and the brush spinning. The distance to the fan from the nozzle is slightly longer on the Sanitaire, but it is horizontal, not vertical, as it is with the Kirby, so it requires less force to carry it to the fan chamber.

This small modification vastly improves the machines performance and eliminates that troublesome "#4 is too high and #3 is too low" problem.

Testing of vacuum cleaners outside of a laboratory is problematic at best. The machines need to be in equal condition, not only bags, belts, brushrolls, but carbon brushes as well. And the operator unconsciously makes minor adjustments in his or her vacuuming technique to favor the machine he/she hopes will win: Slower movement, more overlap on the passes, pressure on the handle. It all makes a difference, which is why consistent results are obtained only with measured amounts of dirt, and automated pushing and pulling of the cleaners.

All things being equal, the modified Sanitaire with the VG1 will outclean the Kirby in soil and sand removal.

Post# 170339 , Reply# 16   2/21/2012 at 07:23 (4,447 days old) by twocvbloke ()        
"I haven't seen you use any test instruments on vacu

 Really? Well blow me, what a shock, cos that appendage I used on the Miele and the Tristar to demonstrate and compare them must have just been a random plastic tumour that must have gone completely unnoticed by me!!! I may have to go lie down after such a shock... :O

(More sarcasm, incase you missed it again)

I have plenty of experience with using, testing and repairing my vacuums, and I have seen many vacuum tests with the same models (and even the same vacs I now own that were sold or given to me), I may not have all the measuring tools I mentioned, but, I have friends who do (who are not part of this forum for this very reason, ignorant people who can't see past their favourite brand being beaten), and they test the same models, parts, peripherals and other nuances about vacuum cleaners, and using this thing I have in my head called a brain, I process the information into results, and am either impressed or dismayed when I do my own tests in relation to those results...

I used to work in an independent computer shop, I built, tested, repaired and dismantled many computers, but I don't claim to be an expert in them, I know what to do with them and how to get the best out of them, but I don't go round stating that "I'm a computer engineer and you must do this because that is what I say you should", because that is just plain ignorance, which is what you are showing, and have shown many times, and will probably continue to do until you either learn to accept other's findings and experiences, or you end up crossing someone who may not be as polite as I am being here (just ask Petek what I can be like when someone gets on my bad side)...


Okay, I'm going to end this here, I apologise to Henrique for this "discussion" ruining your thread, but I do prefer accuracy over favouritism...

Post# 170362 , Reply# 17   2/21/2012 at 14:18 (4,447 days old) by kirbymodel2c (Nottingham, England)        
Umm

 kirbymodel2c's profile picture
As you all know I firmly come down on the Kirby side.(No matter if a Sanitaire has a VG1 or a BJ2 lol;o)But understand what Robert is saying about testing.

I think the only thing we all will probably agree on is that we all won't agree on everything all the time. Esp when one make/model vs another.
I bet the samething would happen if we was all in to cars,bikes or even comic book...

I wonder what other clubs and there members disagree about??

James:o)

Post# 170478 , Reply# 18   2/22/2012 at 10:59 (4,446 days old) by Sanifan ()        
Sanitaire Modification....

 "We routinely make a small modification to the unit when we assemble it. We drill a 1/8" hole in the housing behind the brushroll on each side of the fan opening, thus allowing greater airflow, which keeps the fan turning, and the brush spinning. The distance to the fan from the nozzle is slightly longer on the Sanitaire, but it is horizontal, not vertical, as it is with the Kirby, so it requires less force to carry it to the fan chamber."

Trebor, very interesting modification. I own and handful of Sanitaires and would be very interested in trying out this modification. I think I can visualize what you're doing, but any chance of posting a pic or two so there's no confusion?

Thanks!

Post# 170491 , Reply# 19   2/22/2012 at 12:50 (4,446 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

I was looking at my ZC-880 and S663 today (I say looking, I was swapping the motor in preparation for the 120v one arriving once the HMRC stop poking their noses in my box), and I'd think that drilling holes is a good ideal, but, I would put a row of several small ones along the front of the nozzle just below the bumper, just as a Tristar's PN has a row of small holes to blast air onto the top of the carpeting it's cleaning, but that's one of them complete boredom on a rainy day projects I think, for now I just want all three running... :)

I even thought about trying the same on one of my Hoover Juniors, but there's too much metal in the way, and the bumper gets in the way too, so I gave up on that idea...

Post# 170559 , Reply# 20   2/22/2012 at 21:03 (4,446 days old) by broomvac (N/A)        
"I wonder what other clubs and there members disagree ab

 broomvac's profile picture
Debate does happen in other clubs, trust me! Frequently worse than on here with these petty vacuum catfights.

How about the old Dodge w/Cummins diesel vs Ford w/Powerstroke diesel vs GM w/Duramax diesel? You guys should try visiting those forums at some point. Talk about debate!

Granted, pickup trucks are a much more widespread hobby than vacuums, plus the complexity and engineering involved with these trucks are so much greater that the room for debate over which functions the best is also much greater. Still, it does happen a lot.


Post# 170560 , Reply# 21   2/22/2012 at 21:06 (4,446 days old) by powermate1970 ()        
my 2 cents

 I've been a kirby lover for many years, and own several. My G5 and G6 are both equipped with sentria brushrolls, and I thought, for grooming/cleaning, they couldn't be beat, but.....my old sanitaire S648B with a 6.5 motor and a VGII, out cleans and out grooms the kirby hands down. You talk about sanitaire being "commercial"...let me tell ya. I also have a eureka ESP, 2068A from the early 80's. Same set up. 6.5 amp, VGII, etc...same outcome as the sanitaire, and the ESP was a consumer product NOT commercial. My opinion, eureka/sanitaire takes it, especially with the price of a new kirby!

Post# 170564 , Reply# 22   2/22/2012 at 22:02 (4,446 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        

I was going to add my two cents worth, but I can't afford it.

Post# 170579 , Reply# 23   2/23/2012 at 00:48 (4,446 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

another website I visit prohibits product comparisons-the Candlepower Forums-a website for portable lighting and flashlight collectors.I have a collection of lights,too.
Now- for the vacs-dragged out my Sanitaire SC883 vacuum and currently giving the machine a try-its working well.Got the floor nozzle to a better height for my deep carpets-its at pos#6.-all the way up.The brush and fan are turning without stalling.Don't feel it needs the hole modifications.My other Sanitaires may need that.The SC883 Contractor model must have more nozzle height settings.The SC883 Contractor machine I have uses the ST Filtrete bags-like the Kirbys,7A motor(120V)and was built in Mexico.Sanitaire has been building their machines in Mexico now,The quality of mine is very good.I am using it for awhile to see how it does.So far-very good-Grooms very well.And like the Kirby-the flooring around it vibrates as the Sanitaire is run over it-and the Carpet "Airlifts"to the Sanitaire nozzle like with the Kirby or Royals.to put it this way the Sanitaire gives Kirby performance or maybe better-but at a lower price.and the Sanitaire would be easier than a Kirby to service. Now,I wonder why the orig buyer of this machine returned it?It works Supurb for me.Its presently getting a daily workout.and the more i use it-like the sound of it.

Post# 170601 , Reply# 24   2/23/2012 at 08:04 (4,445 days old) by powermate1970 ()        
Trebor

 I also would love to see a pic of the sanitaire modified. This is the only "problem" I've ever encountered with mine. It has 6 settings. Low, normal and high. Deep, medium and low shag settings. High is just a little too high, and normal is just a little too low

Post# 170735 , Reply# 25   2/24/2012 at 08:19 (4,444 days old) by Trebor ()        
Don't have a camera...

 on my cell phone, so I will make an attempt to describe the modification as if one had no knowledge of vacuums whatsoever.

1)Turn the machine upside down on a work bench so it rests on the hood and the handle is pointing down.
2)Remove the bottom plate

The housing has an opening in the shape of an upper case 'T' enclosing the space of the nozzle and the fan oprnings. The bottom plate rests on the perimeter of this opening.

3)Locate the center of each side of the nozzle opening between the outer edge and the fan opening along the rear edge of the nozzle opening.

4)Drill a 1/8" hole through the housing at a distance of 1/2" from the edge of the opening.

5)Replace the bottom plate

Occasionally, the carpet is so thick that this modification is insufficient. A 1/16" hole may be drilled in addition to the 1/8" hole on each side, or three equally spaced 1/16" holes on each side. No more than this, because it begins to decrease rather than enhance the cleaning performance.


Post# 170772 , Reply# 26   2/24/2012 at 13:14 (4,444 days old) by powermate1970 ()        
Trebor

 I just got home from work and I'm either really tired, or having a "dense" moment, or it could be a combination of both, lol but I don't get it! Are you talking about drilling into the fan chamber, 1/2 inch from the edge of the fan opening, kind of in the area of the "belt guides"? I took a pic of the area I think you are talking about. Is this it? I am really anxious to try this, as this vac literally will "clamp" to the carpet and suck it right off the floor! thanks, Bill

Post# 170778 , Reply# 27   2/24/2012 at 13:20 (4,444 days old) by sanitaire (anchorage, alaska)        

I have many kirbys and 1 sc899 sanitaire in my collection. for easy of maintaince and repairs the sanitaire wins. the kirby is a bit better for convience with being able too add a hose and dust and clean hard too reach areas. the way the carpet vibrates when sanitaire goes across it the dirt doesn't stand a chance. when I clean a carpet I pre vacuum with my sanitaire and at first the customer says how old is that vac.....then they are like WOW that machine really cleans.

Post# 170816 , Reply# 28   2/24/2012 at 17:59 (4,444 days old) by Trebor ()        
One more time...

 The front edge of the nozzle opening is a continuous line from one side of the brush roll to the other. The back edge of the nozzle opening is three distinct parts, right, left, and center, which is the fan opening. On the right side and on the left side find the center of the distance on the back edge of the nozzle BETWEEN the far brushroll side and the opening of the fan chamber. 1/2 in away from the nozzle plate (down if you consider the machine is upside dow,) up if you consider normal operating position) drill the 1/8" inch hole. The fan chamber is mentioned for purposed of orientation only. The holes are drilled into the housing on the back side of the nozzle opening, to the right, and to the left of the fan chamber, NOT in the wall of the fan chamber, just 1/2 vertically from the edge of the nozzle opening.

Ok?

Post# 170826 , Reply# 29   2/24/2012 at 19:58 (4,444 days old) by Sanifan ()        
Instructions...

 Thanks for the description, Trebor. I know what you are saying with 98% certainty, but this really is a case where a picture is worth a thousand words.

If I am getting it correctly, you are drilling one 1/8" hole on each of the two walls that form the air intake channel. Each one located half way between the front of the respective wall (a point starting at the edge brushroll opening, near either the very left or very right side of the vacuum), and the back of the respective wall (a point just before the opening of the fan chamber). If the vacuum were standing upright, the holes themselves are situated 1/2" up vertically from bottom edges of the air intake chamber walls.

My description may be confusing, as well, but maybe it helps.

One question: would drilling the two holes at the front, right through the rubber bumper, be more effective as the extra airflow would then come through the front of the brushroll instead of behind it?



Post# 170834 , Reply# 30   2/24/2012 at 20:41 (4,444 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)        
I would think

 kirbyloverdan's profile picture
it would be better to drill holes in the fron of the Nozzle .

That is where rainbow and Tri Star and Patriot have their holes for the air flow .

But not through the bumper .

Post# 170841 , Reply# 31   2/24/2012 at 21:10 (4,444 days old) by Trebor ()        
I don't know...

if the drilling of the holes on the front would improve performance or not. This arrangement seems to be quite effective. The additional air seems to carry the debris loosened bu the brush roll right into the fan. There is almost no debris in the nozzle plate, even when vacuuming heavy sand.

The modification is done surreptitiously, the customer never knows, and is better off for it. The belts last longer, and because the carpet is held up and shaken, it gets cleaner.

It all started with a customer being very disgusted with her 677, when she previously was quite happy with it. She had recently had very thick plush carpet installed. The belts were burning up quickly, and it was hard to push. Raising the nozzle to #6 did not allow consistent contact with the carpet. I had heard of drilling holes in the nozzle before on Riccars and similar vacs, so I thought "What the heck?" It worked. I just told the customer I made a small adjustment for her luxurious carpet. I found out later that it was done frequently, and seemed to improve performance and belt life. I wonder why it is not a permanent change to the mold.

Post# 170848 , Reply# 32   2/24/2012 at 21:36 (4,444 days old) by powermate1970 ()        
Trebor........ GOOD GOD!!!

 I am dense!!! LOL I'm drilling into the "wall" of the air chamber/tunnel! If I'm thinking/figuring right, the holes should be almost right above (with the vac upside down) the rugplate fasteners, only in the air chamber wall. Am I still "dense", or have I got it?

Post# 170869 , Reply# 33   2/25/2012 at 02:02 (4,444 days old) by Sanifan ()        
Front of nozzle...

 Dan, if not through the bumper, then just above it?

I haven't looked too closely, but I don't see any holes on front edge of my Tristar CXL turbo brush. Just that weird switch on the top that says: low, normal, and high. I understand that it adjusts a port to let more or less air through depending on the carpet's loft. Is that the hole you were referring to? Or are you referring to the later model power nozzles?

I guess one reason not to go through the bumper: don't you slide the magnet bar between the bumper and the body? If so, the magnet bar would obstruct those holes.



Post# 170871 , Reply# 34   2/25/2012 at 02:11 (4,444 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

On the Tristar PNs, the holes are in the rugplate, rather than the plastic, at least they are on the in-house made PNs (the 2-101 (Geared belt) and 2-102 (Flat belt) models) rather than the Eureka-made PNs...

You can see the design in this parts breakdown PDF file:

CLICK HERE TO GO TO twocvbloke's LINK
Post# 170892 , Reply# 35   2/25/2012 at 09:17 (4,443 days old) by Trebor ()        
OK....

 Turn the machine upside down and remove the plate.
Look at the shape as a large upper-case 'T'. The center of the cross of the 'T' is where the fan chamber is located at the bottom of the stem of the 'T'

The brushroll fills the nozzle cavity, (the crossbar of the 'T') and the belt goes around the roller and extends down the stem of the 'T' to the pulley on the fan You are not going to drill into the walls of the stem of the 'T' surrounding the fan chamber.

The long edge of the nozzle is along the bumper, (the front)

The opposing edge, (the back, or the edge nearest your feet when you vacuum) has three distinct divisions, 1)left edge to the wall of the fan chamber, 2)the opening of the fan chamber, 3)and wall of the fan chamber to right edge.

Not in the long upper edge of the nozzle opening where the bumper is, and not in the walls that extend down to form the fan chamber, but in each side of the crossbar of the 'T' (sections 1 and 3) in the back side of the nozzle opening you are going to drill a 1/8 in hole, 1/2" away from the edge of the nozzle opening on a vertical axis.

I tried constructing a diagram using the keyboard symbols, but the server wiped out all the spaces. Sorry. I don't know how to make it any clearer.



Post# 170895 , Reply# 36   2/25/2012 at 09:27 (4,443 days old) by twocvbloke ()        
"Sorry. I don't know how to make it any clearer. 

 A doodle in MS Paint?

Post# 170905 , Reply# 37   2/25/2012 at 12:45 (4,443 days old) by Sanifan ()        
Got it...

 It's clear, at least to me. The holes go into the two short walls behind and parallel to the brushroll. The walls that form the bottom of the "T"'s crossbar.

So you drill the hole exactly in the center of the respective walls? Any offsetting left or right, closer to the intake nozzle or to the outer edge of the vacuum, or would it be exactly centered in the wall surface in question?

I will try it this weekend.

Post# 170909 , Reply# 38   2/25/2012 at 14:09 (4,443 days old) by powermate1970 ()        
OMG!!!

 It's been a REALLY LONG WEEK! LOL You drill a hole in the "wall" directly behind the brushroll, 1/2 inch down from the rugplate.(when rugplate is attached) One hole on each side. Thank-you Trebor for bearing with me! lol I can't wait to try it.

Post# 171397 , Reply# 39   2/29/2012 at 19:20 (4,439 days old) by Trebor ()        
Sorry I have slow to reply but I have been...

 drinking and partying, Ahem, I mean working my ass of for my employer, in New Orleans.

I have never tried positioning the holes other than centered, or equally spaced on each side. The nozzle distributes air flow pretty equally, so the small boost provided by the holes is enough to keep the fan turning, which keeps the brush spinning, and the spinning brush transfers torque back to the fan to keep it turning. The spinning agitator allows the nozzle to take in more gulps of air as the carpet is pushed down and sucked back up. It is such a small change that makes such a huge difference.

Post# 171729 , Reply# 40   3/3/2012 at 07:46 (4,436 days old) by Trebor ()        
So how did the modification go?

 Has anyone drilled the holes? What is youir opinion of performance before and after?

Post# 171757 , Reply# 41   3/3/2012 at 12:10 (4,436 days old) by sanifan ()        

Despite the will and motivation, I have not found the time to modify it yet. Hopefully this coming Monday or Tuesday. I'll post here once it's done!


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