Thread Number: 35070  /  Tag: Brand New Vacuum Cleaners
Miele C3 or Sebo Airbelt E3 or D4
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Post# 377971   9/6/2017 at 12:53 (342 days old) by Jumby75 (Los Angeles, CA)        

Howdy!

First post here and I'm hoping I can get some help deciding on a new vacuum. Recently, I purchased a Kenmore Elite 81714 Ultra Plush vacuum. It's great, but I'm worried about the reliability and the filtration. Not to mention, I feel like there are a lot of parts on there that could break. I've had Kenmores in the past (this would be my 3rd Kenmore canister in 20 years) and while I love them, they inevitably crap out. So with that said, I'm focusing on three models and am thoroughly confused which will be the best for me. They are:

1. Miele C3 Marin (possibly the Brilliant if there is a good reason to spend more)
2. Sebo Airbelt E3
3. Sebo Airbelt D4

I've tried all the vacuums and I'm stuck, although I'm leaning towards the Sebo brand mainly because I feel the wands on the Miele are much heavier than the Sebos and the brush roller is easily accessed. But I like the fact the Miele's have the headlight and they seem a bit more user friendly. With that said, I'm focusing on the following (no particular order):

1. Reliability - If I'm spending this much, this needs to last A LONG time.
2. Air Filtration - I would like the best filtration possible
3. Warranty - Who offers a better warranty
4. Quality - Needs to be well built with quality parts.

One thing I'm stuck on is the fact it doesn't seem any of these vacuums have a 360 degree swivel hose where it connects to the vacuum. Actually, I have no clue about the Miele because the model I tested was just below the C3 (can't remember which one), but I know the E3 does not. Has anyone found this to be an issue?

Anyway, any help would be great and apologies for the scattered post. I'm open to suggestions and if anyone thinks there's a better alternative, feel free to let me know.

Thanks!





Post# 378004 , Reply# 1   9/6/2017 at 18:01 (342 days old) by blackheart (North Dakota)        
Well

Here's my 2c between Sebo and Miele I'd usually take Sebo? Why? Warranty! Most miele models have a 7/7/1 warranty meaning the motors and body casings have a 7 year warranty while the other components like your hose and wands have a 1 year warranty. There are two exceptions to this which would be the brilliant and the C3 homecare+ which is a dealer exclusive both have a 10/10/5 warranty. But the brilliance runs at 1499. Sebo's warranty is 7/5/5 7 years on the motor 5 on non-wear parts 5 on labor. The marin has the 7/7/1 warranty. So comparing the two Sebo has the better warranty. The cost of bags and filters will be less and the hose is longer on the Sebo.

In terms of filtration i'd give the edge to Miele. Hepa filtration is slightly better than S class filtration, but either would be just fine.
Quality? Sebo definitely feels more solid.

I think you should also take a look at the Riccar Prima or Simplicity Wonder tandem air canisters. They have a 10/5 warranty 10 on the body 5 on components I also feel their performance, on carpet, is better than Miele or Sebo. Plus unlike Miele or Sebo you can purchase a handheld electric brush for cleaning upholstery stairs and cars.

I can't tell you what's right for you, try them out and see what you like. I purchased a D4 a few weeks ago, choosing it over the E3. It's a very nice machine! I do prefer the carpet cleaning performance of my Wonder tandem air premium though. I'll also be getting a Miele in a few months.


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Post# 378024 , Reply# 2   9/6/2017 at 20:19 (342 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada)        

eurekaprince's profile picture
One issue I think you should consider: the very small button on the Sebo power nozzle. With Miele, you can turn on/off the power nozzle at the hose handle with your finger and you don't have to bend down. Sebo really should provide a larger foot-operated power button on their power nozzles.

Post# 378032 , Reply# 3   9/6/2017 at 21:18 (341 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Wichita, KS)        
Sebo

Sebo,very well built, lower cost of consumables, easier to service. Brushroll comes out with a twist. Clean hair and string replace with another twist. You can get a HEPA box for cleaner exhaust.

Post# 378048 , Reply# 4   9/7/2017 at 05:06 (341 days old) by Tseg (World Traveller)        

Miele, quiet, light, many versitile accessories, SEB236 powerbrush has LED light and foot controlled/adjusted, a box of bags will last a year, can be stuffed and not lose suction, zero filtration emissions, 1 touch foot controlled cord rewinder, static shock diffuser strip on handle, timer strip on HEPA filter, just darn good looking.

Post# 378058 , Reply# 5   9/7/2017 at 09:29 (341 days old) by n0oxy (Saint Louis Missouri, United States)        
my suggestion

Both Miele and Sebo are good machines, if you decide to go with the Miele, I would not spend the extra money for the brilliance unless you really want the extra bells and whistles, the next model down will clean just as well. I would suggest going with the Sebo D4, the Sebos are better made than the Miele. The D4 is a full size canister with a 40 foot cord, I have the D1 which is the straight suction model and it's a real beast. While I have not experienced this, I have read several posts about issues with the Miele power nozzles having issues with the neck where it attaches to the wand.
The Prima and Wonder are also great machines, especially if you get the Tandom air model, that will clean better than any other power nozzle canister.
Mike


Post# 378059 , Reply# 6   9/7/2017 at 10:58 (341 days old) by Tseg (World Traveller)        

Before getting my Miele C3, I definitely considered the Sebo D4. The D4 detractors for me: quite large and heavy... I maintain 3 floors (including finished basement) and did not want to consider lugging it up and down steps. Also, I have bad allergies and the exhaust on the Miele was more clean... although certainly the Sebo is not bad. I did not like the idea of having to bend over to adjust the various Sebo controls on the machine and powerhead. I live in an old dark house with a lot of tight spaces to vacuum and greatly value the LED lit SEB236 powerhead. Finally, really liked the Miele accessory options... very long bendable crevice device (SFD10), highly adjustable large duster (easy to dust the tops of my ceiling fans)(SUB20), and mini-turbo - ideal for vacuuming my carpeted stairs (STB101). Beyond the powered hose/nozzle, I also have the non-electric versions which makes the unit super-light for vacuuming stairs and dusting above ground.

Post# 378144 , Reply# 7   9/9/2017 at 10:07 (339 days old) by Jumby75 (Los Angeles, CA)        
Thank you!

Thank you everyone for your recommendations. This is going to be a tough decision, but I have an opportunity to try these out at home, which is great. It's really a toss up right now because there are definitely some pros and cons to both. While warranty and filtration are a concern, the ease of use is also something I want to give a lot of consideration.

Anyway, with that said, I'm trying to narrow this down some more and hoping to get some additional help. I agree with n0oxy that the Miele Brilliant or Homecare is not worth the extra money for the upgraded handle control. I haven't tried it, but I did try out the Marin and was fine with the control. I really do like the ease of turning it on and off, along with the height selector, all with the tap of a toe which is an advantage over the Sebo.

However, I'd like to narrow down my decision between the Sebos and was hoping someone could tell me the difference between the D4 and E3. Other than the larger bag, longer cord, and the fact the hose can swivel 320 degrees where it connects to the vacuum, is there really any other advantage? Is the D4 worth paying extra?

Thanks!


Post# 378158 , Reply# 8   9/9/2017 at 17:41 (339 days old) by n0oxy (Saint Louis Missouri, United States)        
sebo models

The sebo models you mention do have the controls on the handle so they would provide you that feature at a cheaper price than Miele does. The E3 uses a lower watt motor, 700 watts I think and as you said, it uses a smaller bag and has a shorter cord. I'm not sure what price difference you are looking at but I would get the D4 if you can afford it, otherwise, the E3 would also meet your needs, you just might have to change the bag a bit more often.
Mike


Post# 378214 , Reply# 9   9/10/2017 at 19:34 (338 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada)        

eurekaprince's profile picture
Hi Mike,

I don't think you can control the power nozzle from the hose handle on any Sebo. All you can do is adjust the speed of the suction motor in the main canister. It would be great to know that I am wrong, though! But I have yet to read of a Sebo hose handle that has a power nozzle switch.


Post# 378238 , Reply# 10   9/11/2017 at 09:37 (337 days old) by n0oxy (Saint Louis Missouri, United States)        
power nozzle control

Yes, you are correct, I wasn't sure if they were talking about the motor speed or turning on and off the power nozzle. With a Sebo, the power nozzle control is on the nozzle itself and the motor speed is on the hose handle.
Mike


Post# 378262 , Reply# 11   9/11/2017 at 16:20 (337 days old) by jumby75 (Los Angeles, CA)        

I tried out the Miele C3 again today and it is a pretty easy vacuum to use. It's too bad the suction control can't be adjusted on the handle, but since I'm looking at the Marin model, the suction is automatic as well as manual. The vacuum itself is pretty lightweight and quiet. The SEB-236 powerhead performs pretty well. I thought it might have a problem with edge cleaning, but the sales guy did a demo and I was pretty impressed.

The Sebo E3 is not altogether out just yet, but the D4 is probably out because I think it is really just too big. One of the reasons I didn't like the Kenmore Elite is that it was big and a bit klunky. The D4, while it provides a longer cord, might just be too big. The small on/off button on the SEBO powerhead does concern me because it is small and I can't see how you can use your foot to tap it. But I like ET-1 powerhead with its low profile and the fact I can control the suction on the SEBO handle is a plus. .

I'd like to get the SEBO and MIELE in my house together at the same time to really compare. In the meantime, I'm printing the manuals to read up on the functions.

Also, I wanted to ask if anyone had any experience with evacuumstore.com or bestvacuum.com. While I prefer to go to a dealer, these sites offer some pretty good risk free deals.


Post# 378264 , Reply# 12   9/11/2017 at 16:48 (337 days old) by Tseg (World Traveller)        
Sylvane

I've bought some of my accessories through Sylvane after some bad Amazon purchase experiences. Quick, free shipping, pleasant and no tax.

www.sylvane.com/miele-vac...


www.sylvane.com/sebo-airbelt-e3-...


Post# 378297 , Reply# 13   9/12/2017 at 09:51 (336 days old) by Jumby75 (Los Angeles, CA)        
Bought the C3

So I decided to take the plunge and buy the Miele C3 Marin from an online retailer who offered a 60 day trial period. While I still like the SEBO for the warranty, the the longer suction hose and ease of changing the brush roller, something about the Miele seems more convenient to me at this point. The SEB236 head has a light and foot controls to turn it on and off.

The ONLY downside is I'd rather be able to control the suction from the wand, but since the C3 Marin has the auto suction feature with the option for manual adjusting, I should be fine. Not to mention, the only time I would change the suction is when I'm using attachments and I can manually adjust it when I put on one of the tools.

It's ships overnight, so I'm excited to get it tomorrow and play around with it. I'll let everyone know the outcome.


Post# 378342 , Reply# 14   9/13/2017 at 07:10 (335 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
the blue "Marin"

does everything the top line model does. It has a head light, that the Kona lacks, and only not the canister side bottom led lights of the top line, and the felt lined tool compartment for $200 less.

Not many Miele fans here, but you will like it I'm sure. You are bound loyal to a Miele dealer for bags and filters at the price point premium of course, but hey, you spent about $1,200 for it, and you get the cleanest possible air exhaust in the industry. Is there also not a quieter machine made? Maybe Sebo comes closest at both.
"Spitzenklasse"


Post# 378392 , Reply# 15   9/13/2017 at 20:28 (335 days old) by n0oxy (Saint Louis Missouri, United States)        
evacuumstore.com

Have not heard of best vacuum, perhaps I will check out their site, I have bought vacuums and accessories from evacuumstore.com, a very good company, they're one of the first places I go when I am looking for anything vacuum related.
Mike


Post# 395043 , Reply# 16   7/15/2018 at 22:21 by vacuumdevil (Denver)        
resurrecting an old thread.

vacuumdevil's profile picture
I wonder how many of you own SEBO canisters?

I happen to have a secret love affair with the Sebo E3.






Post# 395053 , Reply# 17   7/16/2018 at 00:17 by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

I am with you,VacuumDevil-I have this Sebo E3 vacuum and very pleased with it.Use it as one of my favorite canisters.I DON'T like the awkward dust brush-but otherwise that vacuum is excellent.Will have to take my IQAir particle meter to my E3-have one of those meters I bought from a vac shop that went out of business.The powernozzle is unique-like how you can replace the beater bar in it yourself-and there are other types you can choose from depending on what kind of carpets or rugs you have.I also have Sebo C and D canisters.Like the D as well.The C not as much.Still a high quality vacuum.The C is uniue that it uses the same bag as the X uprights.Use their Filtrete style bags in mine.

Post# 395071 , Reply# 18   7/16/2018 at 09:19 by Mike811 (Finland)        

mike811's profile picture
Sebo K-series canister here.
I use the ET-1 ph from the Felix (when I am not using the Felix).
Originally motor was 700 watt "EU" motor, but I upgraded it to genuine 1200 watt Sebo motor.
Quality definitely is good, great suction, quiet and very maneuverable.
ET-1 powerhead is the best ph I have used.


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Post# 395079 , Reply# 19   7/16/2018 at 10:36 by vacuumdevil (Denver)        

vacuumdevil's profile picture
@tolivac when I tested it with the particle counter it was" over 9000!" Consistent results between 10,000-50,000 not zero but definitely cleaner than most machines out there. Which would put it at about a HEPA 10 level of filtration not HEPA 13 like a Miele .


@Mike811 do you think there's a big market for upgrading EU vacuum Motors?


Post# 395084 , Reply# 20   7/16/2018 at 11:31 by Mike811 (Finland)        

mike811's profile picture

I think there would be market for a motor upgrades, because people aren't too happy for the 900 watt max limit in the EU.
Most vacuums are 700w or under just because they make the EU-energy label look better.
Problem is, that the new motors are fairly expensive and profit margin would be small. In some cases vacuums designed to have lower wattage motors, bigger motor has caused overheating issues. Sebo K-series has been originally designed to take the high wattage motors and it was safe to upgrade.
In the picture you can see the difference of the 700w vs 1200w Sebo K-series motors. 1200w has turbine with more blades.
1200w motor is noticeably more powerful, but not any louder.


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Post# 395233 , Reply# 21   7/18/2018 at 18:31 by jp10558 (Southern Tier, NY, USA)        

I have a Sebo D4, which I like well enough so far. I think it is very solidly made, and somehow sub $1k (barely) seemed reasonably priced vs Miele. However, I do wish they had a combi nozzle vs the rather bad hard floor tool it came with (it doesn't turn enough ways, so is very uncomfortable to get under things - the ET-1 powerhead almost has the other problem, turns too many ways!)... Though mainly the ET-1 is sufficient, except for the desire I have to not track in whatever gets stuck to the bottom from the hard floors to the carpets. If you don't have that (maybe stupid) worry, you don't need other cleaner heads IMO.

It's a little heavier than I'd like, but the bag size, power (in the US anyway), and performance is very nice. I love the idea of the easy clean and change brushroll - I think that may have been the deciding point for me vs Miele.

I do kind of wish it was as easy to bang around as the Oreck Iron Man (weights almost nothing, and surprisingly resilient for how cheaply it's made / seems made), and the 360 rotation at the handle end helps you not get the hose all tangled up / trying to kink. There's really no replacement for that IMO. But I also think the power head is worth it, and there's not a great reliable way to have a 360 degree electrical connection.

For storage, it would be nice if the bag had a little sealing flap that auto "closed" like the Oreck so you could just disconnect the hose - I feel like that would let the Sebo take up less room.

However, the Sebo is better than the Iron Man on carpets, it saves me from switching vacuums when going from hard floor to carpet (save all work if you only use the powerhead - just press the button on the powerhead - again, it would be nice if this was handle controlled), it's like 50% or less as loud as the Iron Man, and isn't a high pitched whine that hurts your ears after a bit, and the bag doesn't fill up every 3rd time you use it. The filtration is hands down 10x better than the Iron Man, but that's not a huge concern for me - again why I didn't rate that difference higher for the Miele. The Airbelt system works well enough, though even banging around the Iron Man didn't really bother me as I have mostly "soft / plush" furniture, so it wasn't going to mar it. I'm also young enough that the 16lbs or whatever, while noticeable, isn't a problem as much as the potential awkwardness.

It works quite well, but has some noticeable downsides too. I'll probably compare it better soon, but I have to finish off my Iron Man bags (one more to go)...





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