Thread Number: 32624  /  Tag: Other Home Products or Autos
What's your favorite car?
[Down to Last]

Vacuumland's exclusive eBay Watch:
scroll >>> for more items
Post# 357635   8/14/2016 at 13:11 (318 days old) by singerman (MO)        

singerman's profile picture
Relating to my post a 2 weeks ago what is your favorite car and can list multiple cars if you want to. My favorite car is the 1962 Pontiac Bonneville with a 389 engine. as soon as you hit 3500 rpm you go back in your seat! I also like the 1969 GTO

Post# 357651 , Reply# 1   8/14/2016 at 15:46 (318 days old) by s31463221 (Frenchburg, KY)        
That can be a difficult question to answer!

s31463221's profile picture
Being a car nut as some folks call me, I'm pretty sure I could fill up this page with some of my favorite automobiles! I've had the privilege of owning several automobiles and each has been loved and babied until it was passed onto a new home. In the interest of time however, I'll say my favorite (currently, and for quite some time now) is my 1954 Buick Special 2 Door coupe. This one is VERY special because it was a Valentine's Day present from my wife! I love the classic styling of the car, not to mention all of the attention it gets no matter where I take it!

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 357655 , Reply# 2   8/14/2016 at 16:23 (318 days old) by kenkart (Mocksville, NC)        

Chrysler 300 F or a 1956 Desoto Adventurer. The favorite car I actually owned was nothing special to most, but I have never driven anything that fit me as well, a 68 Fury 3 Plymouth.

Post# 357683 , Reply# 3   8/15/2016 at 00:27 (317 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
One that I've never owned but have always loved since I was a small child is the '66 or '67 Olds Toronado (basically the same car with slightly different grille and taillights.

Of the 15 or so cars I've actually owned, my '68 VW Beetle that I built from scrap parts when I was in high school will always have a special place in my heart. You could almost call it a '68/'69/'71 for all the different parts I used.

The funny thing is I often have dreams about the '77 Buick Skylark I had in college and for a year or so afterward but I was never particularly enamored with the car when I owned it. I've been having these dreams where I still own the car or somehow reconnect with it and start driving it again, just for the heck of it.

Post# 357691 , Reply# 4   8/15/2016 at 06:24 (317 days old) by pinkge (Indianapolis,Indiana)        

I have 2,a 1951 Studebaker Landcrusier or a Packard Mayfair.

Post# 357695 , Reply# 5   8/15/2016 at 08:22 (317 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Tough question! I owned many, none are the one!! Miss my 69 Wildcat

Post# 357714 , Reply# 6   8/15/2016 at 14:09 (317 days old) by Vinvac (Dubuque IA)        

vinvac's profile picture
2015 Buick Encore.

Love old cars but hate what they do to the environment.

As a young man, I could have had a 1953 Ford Glide-a-matic. Less than 10,000 miles on it and all original. Clock and radio both still worked.

I let them sell it at the auction and invested the money in a 5 year CD at 14.25%. My how times have changed.


Post# 357725 , Reply# 7   8/15/2016 at 17:59 (317 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Too many

to mention! It is Dream Cruise week here. I will be oogleing and drooling.
My own vintage ride pales in comparison to so many.
I saw a beautifull 1967 Mercury Park Lane brougham last week. It was black, like Steve McGarrets Hawaii Five-O car.

Post# 357730 , Reply# 8   8/15/2016 at 19:40 (317 days old) by cuffs054 (monticello, ga)        

Vac, Steve's was a 68, but I get your point! Dad had a black on gold 68 brougham that I thought was the best looking car he ever brought home. Well maybe for the 62 Starfire convert and the 64 98. Oh, yeah, the Chrysler New Yorker.

Post# 357742 , Reply# 9   8/15/2016 at 20:58 (316 days old) by Compactelectra (Rancho Mirage, CA - New home of the Obamas)        
1961 Lincoln

compactelectra's profile picture
Continental convertible

  View Full Size
Post# 357743 , Reply# 10   8/15/2016 at 21:02 (316 days old) by Compactelectra (Rancho Mirage, CA - New home of the Obamas)        
Favorite Car

compactelectra's profile picture
I owned. 1966 442 convertible.

  View Full Size
Post# 357747 , Reply# 11   8/15/2016 at 21:11 (316 days old) by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        
I have a few too.

gottahaveahoove's profile picture

A '52 T Bird, 59 Cadillac, '60 Lincoln Continental (Pres JFK car), '59 Chevy Biscayne, '83 Lincoln Town Car...........

Post# 357755 , Reply# 12   8/15/2016 at 23:11 (316 days old) by Brando_husky (Omaha Nebraska)        

brando_husky's profile picture
Oh Fred I couldn't think of a better vehicle than the old continental. Incredibly stately car in every way. The body lines were so sleek and straight. Truly ahead of its time.

Post# 357762 , Reply# 13   8/16/2016 at 08:21 (316 days old) by Brando_husky (Omaha Nebraska)        

brando_husky's profile picture
Another beautiful vehicle built right alongside the Lincoln continental at the plant is the ford thunderbird. Here is our old 1961 thunderbird. All original.

Amazing luxuries for the time. Air conditioning. Power windows. Power seats. Effortless power steering and more.

  View Full Size
Post# 357763 , Reply# 14   8/16/2016 at 08:29 (316 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
'62 T-Bird,

oh yes! Love the bullet shape. Either in '62, or '63, an option was a solid rear seat boot that entirely concealed the back seat.
Cuff's, yes Steve drove a '68, as well as all the way up to '74, or whenever the show ended. Me TV shows early episodes of '50 and he drives a '67 2 door in at least one.

Post# 357768 , Reply# 15   8/16/2016 at 10:30 (316 days old) by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        
goegeous car, indeed

gottahaveahoove's profile picture
I love all of the old T-Birds. The 1970s were unkind to them, as, they looked exactly like other cars. a shame. Those Thunderbirds 'say something'.

Post# 357777 , Reply# 16   8/16/2016 at 13:52 (316 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Wichita, KS)        
I agree with John

I do love the birds.  Well up until about 1980, then no-so-much.



Post# 357790 , Reply# 17   8/16/2016 at 16:27 (316 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

yes, the 1980 was a disappointment overall, like the Cougar XR7, if the 302 V8 option didn't move the lighter than '79 cars a bit better. I think a 250 cubic inch six was standard.
I'd rather have a '77 through '79 in midnight blue and chamois.

Post# 357805 , Reply# 18   8/16/2016 at 22:53 (315 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Tough question for a former car 'nut'. Most FUN hands down was a '63 SS Impala Convertible with the 409...four on the floor. Certainly not the fastest car ever made, but it had everything going for it except Then a hardtop '70 'cuda with the 429 Hemi....which arguably was one of the fastest factory cars ever made. Never lost a race and I had all kinds of comers....big money maker, Goat eater, Vette eater and pink slip stealer that car! Changing direction into foreign stuff;60's XKE's and then into military off-road vehicles.  When you have Asperger's, you don't need a segway into anything, you just do it.


Last 24 yrs a '92 4Matic Mercedes estate wagon bought new. I have cars littered all over the country that I'll never get back to...foolish to get into this hobby unless you can stay and commit. My dad had a '67 Lincoln convert that only like three people in the Midwest could troubleshoot the top at that time. Sky blue with a tan/saddle interior....took your breath away...loved that car for what it was...lotta hot guys rode in that He had a T-Bird right before that....nice car...but the Lincoln was in another class IMHO.



This post was last edited 08/17/2016 at 01:33
Post# 357818 , Reply# 19   8/17/2016 at 00:56 (315 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

Always liked Mopars, I still have my 69 Dart I got my license in.
It was my third car, first was a 42 Ford GPW Jeep, second was a 41 1/2 ton closed cab Dodge weapons carrier pickup with winch.
I added it up years ago I had 26 cars and I think I've had a few more since then.
I always liked military trucks and muscle cars. I also had a 70 Duster 340 and a few other interesting cars to me.
I currently have a 95 Neon highline coupe daily and a 78 Dodge 3/4 ton van just because it was dirt cheap dry rolling storage that ran and a lot of new parts, plus the Dart.
Used to hit local junk yards/swap neets collecting parts cheap and sometimes selling desirable peices.
Still have a bunch of stuff for the Dart.

Post# 357821 , Reply# 20   8/17/2016 at 01:10 (315 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Mopars can be really addictive. I still have one military vehicle left;M-43. Been parked over in ID for the last 15 yrs. The arid climate preserves it...I know I could still start it once I got all the stale gas out. Indestructible. I was headed to the Mopar Nationals once to pick up a '70 GTX with the Hemi. Never made it and then had a reversal of fortunes.


Darts were cool and ran always plentiful.


We had a kid in HS whose dad owned the biggest Chrysler/Dodge/Plymouth dealership in St.Louis. He would virtually come to school in a new muscle car almost daily. Some were close to a yellow 340 Duster with a rear spoiler that had graphics down the running board that read; 1/4 mile Duster. Try to find that one in the books. Then one day he hit a bridge in something daddy let him drive..didn't die, but that was the end of his car 'show'.


You're the first person that I've ever heard(besides me) that made a connection between military vehicles and muscle cars...very cool!



Post# 357863 , Reply# 21   8/17/2016 at 16:04 (315 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Dodge Power Wagon???

Well in any case, there are a few around here also. Sold from an air national guard base surplus nearby.
All kinds of cars here. Just yesterday, I saw a '72 Chevelle convertible, a '69 or '70 Boss Mustang, a '77-ish Chrysler New Yorker, '55 Mercury, 3 corvettes, a Buick Grand National--those are very prominent here, a '72 Eldorado, all within five minutes.

Post# 357883 , Reply# 22   8/17/2016 at 23:12 (314 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

Yep, the early Dodge 4x4 military trucks became the Power Wagon when the war ended. The early ones had pretty much the same running gear and engine in a bigger pickup body.
They eventually updated to sometimes getting the early y block 318 then went civilian but bullet proof running gear till probably 72.
Mine was a first gen early 1/2 ton pickup version, built with 3/4 ton parts created so the military couldn't kill it.
They were only built in 41-42, then they beefed em up more and lowered the body and went unique military bodies mostly with a bigger 230 engine. The later ones use bigger 900-16 tires and a flat nose.
The early ones had a rounded nose and most had some sort of civilian cab, many times cut down to work for whatever body it had.
The Ambulance in the beginning of Mash was a 1/2 ton version to give those not familiar a idea what they looked like.
The civilian version also got a 2 speed transfer case, all the early 4x4 military versions had single speed transfer with a granny low and super low gears in the differentials.
4:88-1 for the 1/2 ton and 5:86-1 for the 3/4 ton and they all had a max speed of 55mph.
Always liked that all our trucks were purpose built, could climb a wall, and almost indestructible.
Muscle cars were just built to go fast and try to beat the other manufacturers, and I'm partial to Mopars as I think they had better running gear and engines.

Post# 357884 , Reply# 23   8/17/2016 at 23:15 (314 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

The civilian power wagons that swapped out some drive line and brakes parts, were one ton trucks from the 60's. Everything else on the M-37's and M-43's I had were basically proprietary. Waterproof ignition, funky dist, funky Carter carb with a water trap, oversized shocks. Saw the same basic engine in a 40's something Dodge Bros hearse though. So it had been around



Post# 357920 , Reply# 24   8/18/2016 at 14:15 (314 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I miss my last Park Ave too, the style inside and out, the ride the power and mileage. 93 was a good year there.

Post# 357940 , Reply# 25   8/19/2016 at 00:50 (313 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

Dodge actually was making HUGE 1 1/2 4x4 trucks for the military since 1933. They were the first to use a in/out front drive lever and transfer case. Before that they were always locked into all wheel drive and that was a major advance. The early ones looked like some huge model A pickup or something with a military bed on the back and were very tall with lots of ground clearance.
Other makers were building all kinda of oddball trucks for them back then including early FWD trucks and Ford, plus the early just before war stuff everyone was prototyping like Chevy and GMC with early 4x4 and 6x6 trucks that also used civilian cabs with beefed up running gear and the grill guards/cages on the nose to protect them a bit.
The big thing on the Korean/Vietnam trucks was 24 volt electrical, and water proof everything with provisions for adding a snorkel system so as long as the engine could get air they could drive underwater.
They did it on some of the later WW2 stuff too but most of the early stuff wasn't water proofed from the factory.
So that is probably the main difference from the same engine in civilian use hence the special distributor, carb, and other stuff.
The basic Flathead 6 has been around since probably when Dodge first sold a 6 probably in the twenties and the displacement just kept getting bigger.
My 41 cane with a 218 but had a 56 Plymouth 230 in it which had a lot more power but externally was identical and would bolt directly in, a popular swap to keep em going back in the day.
As far as cars I've had a 69 Sport Fury with a 350 horse 440, the Duster, Dart, another /6 Dart, 72 Satellite a friend and I bought cheap to flip with a 318, a few parts cars mostly to upgrade or repair the Dart over the years and a 50 Dodge Coronet 2 door I never got running with a fluid drive trans and a flat head like the Power Wagon, plus a bunch of forgettable cars I thought I was going to drive or gave up on after wasting money trying to fix em up and drive them.
The Dart I upgraded everything to 340 specs with a 383 nose that was on it when I got it. I put a performer intake, Thermoquad carb, early 340 manifolds, 3.23 sure grip, poly front end bushings and front and rear sway bars.
I also have all the parts to convert to big bolt disk brakes in stock and later police 15" rims. It also came with fast ratio 16 to 1 manual steering which was a rare option and makes steering much quicker but harder to turn.

Post# 357957 , Reply# 26   8/19/2016 at 11:16 (313 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

There were some basic differences/refinement from the MASH type M-37's/M-43 and the series I had from the 60's. All the 60's models were 3/4 ton, but parts that were alike in the civilian market at that time were from 1 ton Power Wagons. Lots of guys ripped out the 24 volt systems and slapped in V-8's. I used the trucks just the way they came from the factory. They are highly supported now in their originality. Back in the early 80's there was only Memphis Equipment and a guy back east who was sending them over to work in the Middle East oil fields. He was an interesting character to deal with, but he always could put his hands on original parts. Memphis Equipment was running out of OE parts and was going the Asian copy route, many times with horrible results. I was glad to see any number of support places spring up after them. 


All my 60's M-37's/M-43's had the two speed transfer case. Some had the Braden PTO winch and I always wanted the SouthWind heater unit that sat on the front tire fender. All had the cut-out for the snorkel. The engine was the T-245 at that point. I even had factory installed single flashers on one M-37.


68 was the last yr of production of that series and I had one. The oldest one I had was '62. After that the Military had contracts with Jeep briefly and produced the 1 ton truck that looks a bit like the M-37, but is not all all the same thing. Had a motor with a aluminum head that warped when overheated and it wasn't uncommon to find the body, electrics and running gear still in, but engine missing. Lots of guys put other engines in them. Then as you say, Dodge got the contract back, but they were basically civilian Power Wagons that had military specs. I was never interested in anything after '68.


I actually think that Dodge Brothers hearse I saw was from the 30's not the 40's...same block as in my M-37's/M-43's far as I could tell. All my vehicles came from rural CO. The Military had a deal with the poorer counties of CO. They could have the vehicles for free, but withheld title for seven yrs. After that, the counties could dispose of them however they deemed fit. That's when I entered the scene and bought them at auction.  I missed out on an M-43 that had 500 original mile on it...looked brand new. Mountain Search & Rescue of Ouray bought that one. I got to see inside was cherry.



Post# 357970 , Reply# 27   8/19/2016 at 14:55 (313 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

Always wanted a m37 as it was the pinnacle of their development and the last ones had all modern updates.
I paid 1300 cash for my 41 in 78. It actually ran and stopped great and did have a heater
The Jeep I paid about a grand and it ran and drove but needed the tranny rebuilt and had no oil pressure at idle when warm but that never seemed to bother it. I guess it was getting plenty of oil just no pressure.
I sold it to buy the pw, I sold that to buy my Dart when I realized I needed a normal car to actually drive daily and the neighbor up the hill had the Dart for sale with a 383 nose and 63k on it for 650. Had a dented drivers rear quarter, bad vinyl top, and a perfect interior.
It ran and drove like a new car but water pump went out on the test drive so talked him down to 550 and drove it home.

Post# 357976 , Reply# 28   8/19/2016 at 18:26 (313 days old) by panasonicvac (Easton, Washington)        

panasonicvac's profile picture
Mine would be a white mid 90's Chevy Tahoe. We used to own a I believe a 1996 model that had some front and tail light covers on, it also came with a VCR, and I believe some extra fog lights because it used to snow alot at both our first and last Cabin we used to own. I don't know why but every time I look at these, it reminds my of a Kirby or a Panasonic vacuum LOL.

  View Full Size
Post# 357986 , Reply# 29   8/20/2016 at 05:56 (312 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
They (Tahoe) were real

workhorses for sure. I still see several around with engines that sound like machine guns from very high mileage. Rust has gotten the better of most by now, if they haven't been restored, painted, or customized.
The white one in your pohto was likely built in Janesville Wi. Now they all come out of Arlington Texas, along with Escalades, Yukons, and Suburbans.

Post# 357989 , Reply# 30   8/20/2016 at 08:59 (312 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Here in CA they are very much still alive. See them daily

Post# 357993 , Reply# 31   8/20/2016 at 10:48 (312 days old) by Brando_husky (Omaha Nebraska)        

brando_husky's profile picture
My roomie just bought an 03 suburban. Nice truck. Got a few issues to sort out. But $2k for a 188k mile vehicle that's to be expected. Comfy leather. Well optioned out. Air ride (which is blown out of course). Power everything.

Good second vehicle to get him around in winter over his new camaro. Plus moving all our server equipment and such all the time. Much more efficient over the camaro

Post# 358011 , Reply# 32   8/21/2016 at 00:38 (311 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        
watch the trans on any gm truck

We have all gm vans at work, two 97 and a 06. all of them wasted their transmissions at 150k on the dot so make sure yours is good or redone recently.
they also have issues with the brake lights not working when the headlights are on due to lousy plastic sockets and wiring that gets corroded after years, and my power windows stopped working too.
The engine still seems fine at 203k though. It's a 5.0 in my 97.

Post# 358020 , Reply# 33   8/21/2016 at 07:53 (311 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
The old cast iron V8's

outlast any newer engines. Light socket corrosion can be cleaned with ketchup, believe it or not! Then put conductive grease on the bulb base.
Those Van door hinges are also problematic.
As for transmissions, find an old Turbo Hydramatic 350 or 400, and rebuild it. I bet at least one aftermarket company makes an adaptable bell housing to the newer aluminum block engines.
Maybe the machine gun sounds I hear are leaky manifolds or exhaust system issues.

Post# 358135 , Reply# 34   8/23/2016 at 22:05 (308 days old) by bikerray (Middle Earth)        

bikerray's profile picture
1939 Packard, 1956 Buick Special 4 door Riviera hard top and a 1946 Indian Chief

Post# 358138 , Reply# 35   8/23/2016 at 23:02 (308 days old) by ryan1994jeep (Georgia)        

ryan1994jeep's profile picture
Im partial to the Jeep Grand Cherokee. I've owned every generation except the current model.

Love me a Tahoe also. My favorite was the 2001-2006 model generation.

Post# 358146 , Reply# 36   8/24/2016 at 09:48 (308 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Grand Cherokee's

are great! So many older ones still on the roads, with many parts still available too.
The newer ones with Pentastar V6 engines are also nice. President Obama toured the plant back in 2011. Very comfortable on trips with good fuel economy. The ZF/Chrysler 9 speed automatic is smooth.
Just don't leave the vehicle running and exit it. They have been recalled for the park problem, but the young Russian actor from Star Trek was killed by his when it rolled down his driveway and crushed him up against his brick mail box.
Put it in park, make sure it is in park, and set the parking brake.
Darn it it's not a perfect world.

Post# 358150 , Reply# 37   8/24/2016 at 10:37 (308 days old) by s31463221 (Frenchburg, KY)        

s31463221's profile picture
I wholeheartedly agree with you on the 56 Buick....I absolutely LOVE my 54, don't get me wrong, but on my bucket list is a 1956 Buick Roadmaster, completely decked out! May never happen, but a guy can dream nonetheless!

Post# 358167 , Reply# 38   8/24/2016 at 17:32 (308 days old) by constellation86 (Roy, UT)        

Old Buicks are cool! I'd take a 52 Roadmaster myself. The newer ones are shorter because they switched to a V8 in 53. While I'm dreaming make it a wagon!

CLICK HERE TO GO TO constellation86's LINK

Post# 358186 , Reply# 39   8/24/2016 at 22:39 (307 days old) by portable (Tucson, AZ)        

portable's profile picture



  View Full Size
Post# 358187 , Reply# 40   8/24/2016 at 22:40 (307 days old) by portable (Tucson, AZ)        

portable's profile picture

Or this....


  View Full Size
Post# 358189 , Reply# 41   8/24/2016 at 22:46 (307 days old) by portable (Tucson, AZ)        

portable's profile picture

No, I think this one....


  View Full Size
Post# 358191 , Reply# 42   8/24/2016 at 22:58 (307 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Buick's str 8 with OHV in the 40's was no slouch. Stay away from the push button tranny and stay with three on the tree.  Wonderful car and what touring was all about. Cartoon smile on the grill, very endearing! Like this one:

1948 Buick Super



Post# 358192 , Reply# 43   8/24/2016 at 23:34 (307 days old) by cb123 (Mobile, Al.)        

cb123's profile picture
This one is my absolute favorite of all time! If you have the courage and see this one, it'll haunt your dreams forevermore, indeed, it's the most perfect, loving car you'll ever cast your eyes upon! Like I said, if you watch this one, you'll fall in love at first sight, because that's just how special she is!!!


Post# 358202 , Reply# 44   8/25/2016 at 07:30 (307 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Being a Buick person, I think the early term Riviera refers to the 2 door hardtop version of the models, starting 49 I think???

Post# 358211 , Reply# 45   8/25/2016 at 10:27 (307 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Yes it does David.

At first, it was the top trim level for Roadmasters. In 1958/59, it was also for the Limited. I don't know if the Caballero had a Riviera trim option in '56/57.
Olds called their equivalent Holiday Fiesta. Those were hardtop wagons and 4 doors.

Post# 358226 , Reply# 46   8/25/2016 at 21:08 (306 days old) by portable (Tucson, AZ)        

portable's profile picture

cb123 - I loved the Suzie cartoon. Couldn't have happened to a nicer car! 

Post# 358232 , Reply# 47   8/25/2016 at 23:10 (306 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

I stop @'48 for the Roadmaster 4dr, Sedanette and convertible. I researched this all out when I was younger....don't remember the reasoning...just to stay away from the push button tranny and '48 was the last year that interested me...maybe the body changed appreciably after that and they lost the cartoon grill? The convertibles now bring the big money....but they do in most collectable cars these days. Usually at about twice the price of the hardtop model, pretty much across the board.


I'd have a tough time deciding between the Sedanette and the 4dr....I'd have to see the interiors of both to see the room difference. If you're gonna own a car like that, you might as well get the most interior room offered. She's a boat no matter what, might as well get the biggest I'm sure the convertible is a lot heavier due to all the stiffening they use to do to make the chassis rigid without the hardtop, A pillars etc. 



Post# 358234 , Reply# 48   8/25/2016 at 23:23 (306 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I do not recall Dynaflow with push buttons, am I missing a special model there?

Post# 358236 , Reply# 49   8/25/2016 at 23:41 (306 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

According to an old car collector book I had, it was a feature in the 40's available on the Roadmasters. I think it even had a pic of it on the steering wheel. I'm certainly no authority, but I remember the caveat about it being mentioned.


Come to think of it(book is in storage) maybe I'm confusing some model yrs....maybe it was just the auto(Dynaflow) versus three on the 'tree'. They said to stay clear of the're probably correct, David.



Post# 358239 , Reply# 50   8/26/2016 at 07:42 (306 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Gosh that sounds like the Edsel.

Post# 358250 , Reply# 51   8/26/2016 at 10:50 (306 days old) by s31463221 (Frenchburg, KY)        

s31463221's profile picture
I was thinking the same thing...that sounds more like an Edsel....of course, Chrylser also toyed with the pushbutton automatics at least in the 50's to 60's (had a 62 Imperial with a pushbutton TorqueFlite)! While I never had any issues personally, I heard they were bad for jamming and giving you all sorts of headaches! I don't recall any of the Buicks having a push button automatic, however don't hold me to that....the Dynaflow (or DynaSLOW as we call them in the Buick club I belong to) is a rather unique transmission, where they build up pressure. I have the Dynaflow in my 54 Buick and it works well, but as far as take off and getting up to speed, my 52 Buick with the three on the tree will leave my 54 sitting in the dust!

Post# 358251 , Reply# 52   8/26/2016 at 10:54 (306 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Right first thing comes to mind is the Chrysler pb drive, I had a 62 Imperial also! Go figure. Only other I can think of is first year Edsel which did give trouble, Telematic? I think? I believe a 58 model. Dyna slow the term heard in this area too and they got warm.Later ones were more efficient and quicker. Mom said our 56 Century would dust anything at the lights.

Post# 358261 , Reply# 53   8/26/2016 at 22:14 (305 days old) by singerman (MO)        
Alright then

singerman's profile picture
Now here comes a bigger question. What is your favorite engine? Mine is the Pontiac 389 V8 engine!

Post# 358262 , Reply# 54   8/26/2016 at 22:35 (305 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
a Trophy for you!

Post# 358275 , Reply# 55   8/27/2016 at 10:23 (305 days old) by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        
John Lucia!!!!!!!

gottahaveahoove's profile picture

You're killing  me.......  (not the 1st time)  Excellent choices. THose American designs....  truly gifted people with visions like that,  never to be duplicated again.

Post# 358276 , Reply# 56   8/27/2016 at 11:03 (305 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
It depends.

For torque and smoothness, mine is the Old's Rocket 350, and 455. Buick mills aren't bad either, and both smoother than the Tiac small and large journal engines, or Chevrolet, turbo fire (small), or turbojet (Mark IV) large blocks once the mileage gets high mind you.
Chevy's used to have lifter tick, and the small block 400 with it's siamesed close together bore cylinders had a sickly exhaust note. Pontiacs were known to snap timing chains.
The Chrysler original Hemi has to be on the list of course, and the old 383's and 440's also, but even a 318 used to move a mid size basic Coronet, Charger, Sattelite Sebring, Volare', or Aspen rather well, and the 360 even better.
As for Ford, the 429, and 390, the 351C (Cleveland), and 352 W (Windsor) mills. The older 390, and 429 were retired by the time pollution control standards required an EGR port, as the former blocks heads had no room to put one in. Fuel economy standards made designing new heads for smog control uneconomical. Enter the 460, which could have been a real performer, but was lower compression from the get-go. Full size Lincolns and T-Birds were very heavy, which used up all that low end torque.
Fords 400 Windsor V8 was prone to valve seal and head leaks.

Post# 358277 , Reply# 57   8/27/2016 at 11:04 (305 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
How could I forget

AMC? Their 304, 360, 390, and 401 V8's were great!

Post# 358279 , Reply# 58   8/27/2016 at 11:19 (305 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Nice checking off the boxes Mike!

Post# 358303 , Reply# 59   8/27/2016 at 18:45 (305 days old) by thevacuumman (Fritch, TX)        

thevacuumman's profile picture
My favorite car isn't a car. It is my daily driver 1997 Silverado 3/4 Ton (Goldie). This truck is a trooper and has never given me any major issues or left me stranded. My favorite car is my old 1966 Ford Thunderbird in Green. It was such a beautiful car but I had sold it to replace my wife's 1999 Grand AM Gt with a 2013 Chevy Sonic.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 2         View Full Size
Post# 358304 , Reply# 60   8/27/2016 at 18:48 (305 days old) by thevacuumman (Fritch, TX)        
2013 Chevy Sonic

thevacuumman's profile picture
I had no experience with any GM car newer than a 2004 Impala. This car I find to be comfortable and great on gas. I also really like that it's Topaz Blue.

  View Full Size
Post# 358314 , Reply# 61   8/27/2016 at 23:03 (304 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I think that T-Bird is Tahoe Turquoise ?

Post# 358317 , Reply# 62   8/28/2016 at 02:58 (304 days old) by thevacuumman (Fritch, TX)        

thevacuumman's profile picture
I can't remember the color. Someone on here told me the color then I for got what it was called.

Post# 358337 , Reply# 63   8/28/2016 at 19:23 (304 days old) by Brando_husky (Omaha Nebraska)        

brando_husky's profile picture
Beautiful 66 tbird. I love that shade of green.

Post# 358341 , Reply# 64   8/28/2016 at 22:17 (303 days old) by panasonicvac (Easton, Washington)        
My 2nd favorite

panasonicvac's profile picture
A 2000's GMC DENALI That we bought in 2003. It was the replacement of our Chevy Tahoe that we later took at our first and last cabin to use up there. Had some major modifications on this as you can see because my Dad wanted this to look nice like the tail lights, DVDs, back up camera, etc.

I've always liked this truck for some odd reason, We later sold this truck in 2007 and now my Dad uses a 2007 Lincoln Navigator.

These were the pictures we took when this was listed on KSL back in 2007.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 15         View Full Size
Post# 358348 , Reply# 65   8/29/2016 at 01:41 (303 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Would have to imagine the movie player screen visible to the driver only works when the car is stopped-very nice.

Post# 358388 , Reply# 66   8/29/2016 at 19:07 (303 days old) by kenkart (Mocksville, NC)        
Re M-37

My uncle had a 53 Dodge M-37 Weapons Carrier when I was growing up, Have ridden many miles in that thing and have seen that winch pull loads you would think impossible...As for Chryslers PushButton shift, it really was about bullet proof, not so much the Edsel and Packards, Chryslers was mechanical and theirs was electrically operated.

Post# 358410 , Reply# 67   8/30/2016 at 09:51 (302 days old) by dirtmaster37 (The Mitten..somewhere cold most likely...)        
Mine will forever be.."The LAST Real Packard".....19

dirtmaster37's profile picture
I have been in love with these cars for over 25 years. No, I do not own one, but will eventually. I have been fortunate enough to sit in, and drive fellow collectors 56's and they are by any yardstick the finest automobiles ever to rool out of Detroit in the 50's or 60's for that matter.

From the very robust V-8, thru the butter smooth ( yet troublesome) Touch Button Ultramatic, to the float ride you get from the Torsion-Level torsion bar suspension. I cant say enough about these last cars from a brand that sadly lost it's way.

Here are a few VHR pics of a car that was sold a few years back....

Post# 358411 , Reply# 68   8/30/2016 at 09:54 (302 days old) by dirtmaster37 (The Mitten..somewhere cold most likely...)        
Pics of the Packard....

dirtmaster37's profile picture
Sorry Pics.....

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 20         View Full Size
Post# 358416 , Reply# 69   8/30/2016 at 10:54 (302 days old) by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        

gottahaveahoove's profile picture
not MY favorite choice, BUT ..... just look at that thing!! Can it all be wrapped up with "Stunning"?

Post# 358446 , Reply# 70   8/31/2016 at 00:16 (301 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

My 41 had a Braden MU2 winch and one time I was in the backyard before all the other houses were built screwing around and sunk that thing down to the frame/bumper. There was NO driving or pushing it out.
I decided to winch to the small fir tree very close to the truck. Engaged the winch, truck started to move, then the tree popped up, root ball and all and almost fell on the cab. I had to dig that 3/4 inch cable out from around the tree and mud and found a BIG fir tree quite a bit away.
I did all kinds of fun and dumb things in my truck and jeep back in the day. They both were amazing rigs in what they could do if you were crazy and could drive and read the terain.

Post# 358453 , Reply# 71   8/31/2016 at 06:07 (301 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Packard has

a history beggining in Warren Ohio. The museum and annual show is there.
After Henry B. Joy bought most of the company's stock, it moved to Detroit.
General Motors named the electrical division in Warren Ohio Packard Electric.
They used to make every wiring harness for every GM vehicle.
Packard had a large proving ground and lodge in Shelby township Mi. They spent way too much money designing their own automatic transmission, while Ford bought their first from Borg Warner, and were even using GM Hydramatics in Lincolns.
Richard Teague designed that beautifull Packard Patrician above, then went to American Motors upon the merger of Packard and Studebaker, also a failing company.
Hudson and Nash merged to be the number four automaker AMC.
With Mercury, Pontiacs, Oldsmobiles, and Buicks nearly as nice as a Packard, with lower price tags, they just couldn't compete with that. I think even a base level Cadillac costed less. Production ended with the 1956 model year. The factory is finally being demolished, what hasn't fallen down on it's own.

Post# 358521 , Reply# 72   8/31/2016 at 23:28 (300 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Favorite engine:426 Hemi

Next favorite:V-10 Dodge truck engine I presently have...450ft/lbs of torque just off idle and not a nickles worth of trouble since it was new(1995)

After that, tie for: 440, 383 and the cars the 409 was stuffed into.

Honorable mentions:427 Chev, 427 Ford side oiler & 389 Pontiac Tri-power, 390 Ford, 390 AMC


It's a highly subjective question....some people are rabid about small block, fast revving engines and other like me love the big blocks.





Post# 358522 , Reply# 73   8/31/2016 at 23:51 (300 days old) by floor-a-matic (New Rochester/Pemberville OH)        

floor-a-matic's profile picture

My favorite car would be the 1979 Ford Granada that my parents used to have; interior had dark blue/woodgrain trim & exterior dark blue


Or 1976 Ford Maverick white with blue top

Post# 358530 , Reply# 74   9/1/2016 at 05:30 (300 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Engines, Granada;

Kevin, how about the Pontiac 421 Super Duty?
Flooramatic, I learned to Drive on a Granada in driver-ed. It had a six in it. Not bad, for what they cost back then. It was an upscale car from the Maverick which it replaced. President Obama even had one.
Mavericks were solidly built cars also. Our neighbor had one.
They replaced the Falcon, but mainly in sheet metal and shape only.
The other driver-ed cars we drove were a Chevy Nova with a 305 V8, a Plymouth Volare' SE 318 V8, and an Oldsmobile Omega brougham with a 350 Olds rocket V8. That was the best handling, and smoothest car. It also had the highest price tag.
My friends mom had a 1978 Mercury Monarch ESS in midnight blue and a chamois landau top. She chose it over the Cougar XR-7 for better fuel economy. It had a sluggish inline six. Especially when the A/C was on.
I almost bought a used V-6 Mustang Mach 1, which was even worse. I chose a slightly used Olds Cutlass Supreme V8. Best selling car in 1976.

Post# 358540 , Reply# 75   9/1/2016 at 08:57 (300 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
Don't remember

the details about the Pontiac 421 Super Duty. What car(s) did it typically wind up in? I might have raced one with the 'cuda, but don't remember that engine.



Post# 358543 , Reply# 76   9/1/2016 at 11:00 (300 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Mom had a double black 76 Cutlass Supreme, sweet, smooth, fairly fast car, not much trouble either, it replaced a 74 Monte, that was a TURD! 85 T Bird replaced the Cutlass, I missed the olds then.

Post# 358555 , Reply# 77   9/1/2016 at 14:53 (300 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
the 421

was very limnited, costly to mill, and usually installed in Catalina's, the 2+2, Executive, or Bonneville. Maybe Grand Prix's in '68 or '69. I don't know if it was ever in a GTO. GM had cubic inch restrictions for mid size cars.
David, '74 was the worst smog control laden year for any car. Chevrolet 350's with air injection and EGR ran sluggish.
1975 with unleaded fuel, a catalytic convertor, and high energy electronic ignition made a world of difference. The spark was 85% hotter. Only California cars kept air injection in '75.

Post# 358557 , Reply# 78   9/1/2016 at 15:14 (300 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
I was confused

myself about the 421. There also was a 428, only in large cars, unless a customer had a dealer install one in a GTO. The early 421's were dealer installed only.
Reserved for NASCAR racing until 1967 when it's crankshaft switched from a drop forged to a nodular iron one.

Post# 358559 , Reply# 79   9/1/2016 at 15:33 (300 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Oh I know, 70s I was in the auto business, that one was really bad! But not just the running. Of course CA cars were the worst I think in the poor running

Post# 358562 , Reply# 80   9/1/2016 at 18:11 (300 days old) by bikerray (Middle Earth)        

bikerray's profile picture
I had a '66 Buick Wildcat Convertible that had twin quadrajet carbs, it would pass anything on the road except gas stations.

I don't remember any Buicks with a pushbutton transmission. Chrysler Imperial had pushbutton on the dash and Edsel had pushbutton in the center of the steering wheel, which was fun when you turned a corner and the trans dropped into low when the wired were shorting out.

Post# 358563 , Reply# 81   9/1/2016 at 18:29 (300 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
No, Buick

never offered a push button transmission selector.
David, my second cousin worked for Chevrolet central office back then. I remember him going out there to the old Southgate Ca. assembly plant which was having quality issues. It was also very old. I don't know if they ever produced Monte Carlos, but they did full size (B) body Impalas, Caprices, and (A) body Chevelles. The Monet Carlo then was an A special, with a 116 inch wheelbase vs. 112 inches for the Chevelle. Same width. Same dash board even.
A high school stands on the site today.
Van Nuys ran f body Camaro's and Firebirds. Freemont may have also made larger cars then. That's the Tesla plant today.

Post# 358564 , Reply# 82   9/1/2016 at 18:56 (300 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Chevelle in a Tux as they say!

Post# 358565 , Reply# 83   9/1/2016 at 19:05 (300 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Though I have to say, no worse than dad's 74 GP SJ, that was fast anyway

Post# 358571 , Reply# 84   9/2/2016 at 02:00 (299 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

'71 was about the end of high compression/high performance engines in street cars....the insurance companies were all over it at that point. Some could be converted back at expense, some not. Still some high performance beasts in motor homes and maybe available as recreational off-road/boat engines. 


I think we established quite awhile back that there was no push button 40's Buick bad. Doesn't really serve a purpose to keep beating that dead horse. The three-on-the-tree was the tranny to have in the 40's, the Dynaflow being a bit sluggish as was said.


If there was a Goat with the 421, I never saw one. The premium engine being the 389 Tri-power. When I was growing up in St.Louis, there was a special plant there that made the baddest of the bad Vettes, many on special order. My brother had a friend whose dad was a doc and he told his son he could have any Vette he wanted, as long as he didn't get any tickets. He'd special order Vettes from that plant every couple of yrs that were pretty incredible. Compete stock with about anything Baldwin Motors was putting on the street.


My brother taught me to drive a stick on a '68 396 SS Camaro hardtop with a floor shift. He had the car about six months and it was stolen. He had ordered the 350 and got the 396 by mistake for the same price. We raced a 350 once, same yr, right in front of a cop shop from about 30mph on. No comparison. Sweet ride....too bad it was a way that was my 'first car'


He took the insurance money and bought a Pontiac Formula 400, auto. Had the stand-up hood scoops but they were fake. Probably some kinda dealer option to make the ram air real...I dunno. He had that car forever...even pulled his bass boat with it down in TX.  The valve train on those engines was anything but bulletproof....he was lucky. I was just starting to work on engines then.


GM was hypocritical to put their phony 'ban' on street racing in the early 60's....I think it was '64. Ways around it of course, but that left Mopar to accelerate their street racing program to the point where they had little competition by the late 60's. I always liked the body style of the AMX and the little Javelin...but they weren't serious contenders. The Mark Donahue Javelins were good lookers and the red/white/blue editions were so rare, that they have been forged for decades. AMC didn't have distinct build codes for their Javelins and many of the factory cars where mix & match which to this day drives the collectors crazy trying to sort out the fakes. 


And speaking of 'fakes'....did you know there are more registered Duesenbergs than were ever made? And the fakes are so well done that even the experts get fooled. Charles Schmidt Motors sold one(fake) to a well heeled collector and Charles did real prison time over it.



This post was last edited 09/02/2016 at 04:52
Post# 358592 , Reply# 85   9/2/2016 at 10:27 (299 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I want to say the 421 and 421SD were for the bigger boats and maybe?? started with the Catalina Swiss Cheese racing program? I know they were more likely to be seen in the Bonneville and GP. I THINK

Post# 358653 , Reply# 86   9/3/2016 at 08:46 (298 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Yes David,

just the large boats. I think when Pontiac had to produce thousands and thousands of small journal 350's, and large journal 455's they needed another line in the Montcalm avenue foundry and engine assembly area in Pontiac. No more room for the 421, or 428, plus they were old school heavy mills like Fords 390, and 429's.
My exes dad worked at the Pontiac foundry. He retired after they "assembled" their final engines. The 2.5 litre Iron Dukes for Fieros', and A and X body cars, and the Braziilan 1.8 litre turbo 4 cylinders for the Fiero and the J body Sunbirds.

Post# 358657 , Reply# 87   9/3/2016 at 10:51 (298 days old) by oliveoiltinfoil (England, UK)        

oliveoiltinfoil's profile picture
I am European so I have done it properly. Its probably not the best car in the world but it does most things well. Being a VW its beautifully built, jack of all trades, master of most of them. I have got 80.3 MPG on a long run and gets to 60 in less than 10 seconds. 550 miles per tank :D

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 2         View Full Size
Post# 358658 , Reply# 88   9/3/2016 at 10:54 (298 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Mike, is it true you can't tell what Pontiac engine you have, from the outside they all appear the same?301-455? Rumor mill is all I have. I have had several, but not at the same time.

Post# 358896 , Reply# 89   9/7/2016 at 04:17 (294 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

You can always tell a big block from a small least I've never been fooled. Prove me wrong.....



Post# 358904 , Reply# 90   9/7/2016 at 07:59 (294 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
True David,

at least I used to have a hard time telling, unless I measured the width of the intake manifolds, like an Olds 403 vs. a 350. Except for Big block Chevy's. Their valve covers were way wider than a small blocks, without lines in them.. Then a 409 had the double C shaped valve covers. Pontiacs valve covers were all fairly wide also.
A Buick 455 was usually painted red. After 1974, all Buick V8's were blue, In fact most GM V8's by then were. Olds engines through 1974 were gold.
A Ford 460 was much bigger under the hood than a 351. of course, only the Lincoln Versailles ever had a 351.
The Chevrolet 400 was not a big block, and neither was the Ford 400.

Post# 358905 , Reply# 91   9/7/2016 at 08:24 (294 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
No I had been told they all had the same block, it seems a waste of metal/ weight

Post# 358972 , Reply# 92   9/8/2016 at 09:18 (293 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

not the same blocks. A friend used to also say, all standard GM 350's. Not true.
Big difference in crank shaft bearing journal sizes. Some had a taller deck, for a longer stroke. Some remained over square, so had a larger bore, requiring a wider, longer block.
The small block Chevy maxed out at 350 cubic inches, and then a siamesed cylinder 400, unless a custom builder made it into a 383 stroker engine
A 396, 427, and 454 were bigger MkIV blocks.
Small block marketing designation was "turbo fire" Big block was "turbo jet.
Across GM divisons, each cast their own block, at least until the mid 70's. Then the main difference were the heads, manifolds, and belt drive accessory mounting.
An Olds engine had positive valve rotation first, and it's distributor rotated in the opposite direction from the others. They ran very smooth, and sounded different.
Chevy had it's starter on the opposite side, so the battery also, and later, the A/C compressor on the drivers side. The others were on the passenger side, and Cadillac in the center with the upper radiator hose circling over it.
So all the drilling in the blocks were different.
Buick as you may well know, had it's distributor up front on an angle, same for the oil filter. The others behind the oil pan side.

Post# 358974 , Reply# 93   9/8/2016 at 09:31 (293 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I was speaking of all V8 Pontiacs

Post# 359000 , Reply# 94   9/8/2016 at 18:55 (293 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Ok David,

they looked identical, but side by side, a Pontiac 389, 400, or 455 was wider than a 326, or 350. Near the end of their V8 engine production, they made the 301, and even a 265. Chevrolet made a 267, and a 305. Close to the displacement of their first V8's in 1955 of 265, and 283.
Canada never even got a Pontiac mill in their Pontiacs. Only Chevrolet engines.
The US eventually got the Parissienne after full size Bonnevilles were no longer made here. Power was from a Chevrolet 305.
My dad used to say a V8 was a V8. Take care of it, it takes care of you. I disagree.
You could feel a difference in a '77 Bonneville that had an Olds 350 from one with a Pontiac engine, and an Olds Delta 88 with a Chevrolet engine. Also between a '77 Buick Regal with a Chevrolet vs. a Buick 350. I drove them. The Buick engine seemed quieter with a low purr. The Olds powered Delta 88 royal pushed me back in the seat on take off with silent low end torque. Plush ride. They offered the base Buick 231 V6, but I bet that was a dog. It barely moved a Cutlass Supreme.

Post# 359006 , Reply# 95   9/8/2016 at 20:28 (293 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
But it is true they didn't have a big block and small block right? I think.Its been so many years.Yes the Buick and Olds seemed more into quieter lower rpm torque, quite easy at it.

Post# 359023 , Reply# 96   9/9/2016 at 08:35 (292 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Pontiac, Olds, and Buick did have

small and large blocks. They did not have entirely different shapes like the Chevrolet small block and Mark IV big block, but had larger dimensions to accomadate the larger bearing journals and crankshafts, as well as cylinders. Thus a wider oil pan, and heads.
We saw the sad result when Oldsmobile over stroked the compression ratio of a small block 350 to make it a diesel. The crank shafts, wrist pins, connecting rods, and or bearings broke. They were probably relying on the higher revving ability of small blocks, but a diesel does not rev higher. It has a lot more force on the crank from the piston because of the high compression, thus more torque.
Law of physics. The base or lower end of an engine must be able to handle the force to it by the load of the pistons.
The 455 would have been a better choice for this, but it's big cubic inch displacement would have not saved enough fuel consumption. Cars were also already downsized, and it would have been a tight squeeze even in a full size B or C body, let alone a mid size after 1977.
Once Oldsmobile engineers beefed up the crank shafts and bearings, the engines lasted longer. Then the 6.2 litre diesel by Detroit diesel was well proven, but only used in light trucks.

Post# 359026 , Reply# 97   9/9/2016 at 10:33 (292 days old) by rugsucker (Elizabethton TN)        
"sad result when Oldsmobile--(made) it a diesel"

I was talking cars with someone years ago who bought one of the first Olds diesels and decided to take a vacation in their wonderful new car.By the time they got to Washington DC they were having problems from bad to worse and found an Olds dealer who was not prepared to service the diesel.After problems,days in motels,loaner cars,etc they got in touch with a GM executive.He had the car repaired as well as they could as well as writing a rather large check for their time and trouble.When they returned home the diesel was traded!

Post# 359027 , Reply# 98   9/9/2016 at 10:55 (292 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

I bought a 60 something Jeep truck for my son when he was a try and keep him out of trouble and form a positive father & son project. The engine was a 327, but I realized shortly it wasn't a Chev 327. I wanna say the truck was a '67.


If I remember, it started life as a Kaiser-Nash engine and then later, AMC was still using it when they bought Jeep. I think it disappeared in the 70's. I remember getting parts for the rebuild and people thought I was on drugs talking about a non-GM 327. I even heard it rumored that it was a Buick motor....but that never really panned out.


I had a '75 Renegade CJ5 with the little AMC 304 V8. I liked the motor, especially after I put in an Edelbrock and a Holley. My only complaint about that Jeep was the three spd floor tranny. Always felt like it was missing a gear;shift into third and it felt like your tranny fell into a deep hole....horrible ratios between second and third. Fix was a Ford T-18 top loader 4spd, but I never got that far with it. Gearing was great off-road however.



Post# 359030 , Reply# 99   9/9/2016 at 11:10 (292 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Some Jeeps did use a Buick 350 and 231

Post# 359032 , Reply# 100   9/9/2016 at 15:15 (292 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Yes, Jeep did

use GM engines. I think even a Peugot diesel 4 cylinder in the late 70's, unless it went in the AMC Spirit as an option. Then GM's 60 degree 2.8 litre V6 from it's S series trucks and X cars in the early 80's. GM brought back the Buick 231 90 degree banked V6 in 1975. It became even firing by 1977, and went through several improvement stages before it was discontinued in 2005.
AMC had their own 327 V8, years before Chevrolet. The engineer who designed AMC's first V8 was hired from Kaiser and developed a 288 cubic inch prototype there, but it never saw production. He got the AMC mill into production in 18 moths. It was either 255, or 287 cubic inches. Later bored out to 327, 343, and 390. In 1970, they were updated to tall deck blocks of 304, 360, and 401 c.i.

Post# 359035 , Reply# 101   9/9/2016 at 20:03 (292 days old) by Marks_here (Crossville TN & Altoona PA WOO HOO )        

marks_here's profile picture
These are my favourite cars the Excalibur Phaeton & the Zimmer Golden Spirit

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 2         View Full Size
Post# 359036 , Reply# 102   9/9/2016 at 20:07 (292 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I think that 327 came out in their Rebel that was very fast in it's day.

Post# 359176 , Reply# 103   9/12/2016 at 11:58 (289 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

I was almost finished rebuilding the Jeep 327 when things went sour with my son. He had a very troubled life, even though we all tried to help him over the yrs. He died this last August at 32 yrs old.


The Jeep was sold shortly after my son lost interest and the new owner had it running around town in about a week. He got a good engine rebuild out of the deal at least. Those were tough 4WD trucks. There's one very much like it in the original move Tremors, that Kevin Bacon drove.



Post# 359183 , Reply# 104   9/12/2016 at 15:16 (289 days old) by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        
Well, as we all know,

gottahaveahoove's profile picture
some have a bigger one than others.


Post# 359190 , Reply# 105   9/12/2016 at 16:12 (289 days old) by kenkart (Mocksville, NC)        
AMC 327

I had a 65 Rambler Classic with the 327 four barrel and it was a great engine, My cousin had a 80 something Silverado truck with a 350 and I blew it out of the road with that old Rambler, That Packard above is simply the finest example of why I love the 50s!the Ultramatic was a good transmission, but the electric shift was not so great, A true Packard story, MY Mothers first cousin got married in 1950, He father in law had a almost new Packard convertible they took on their was standard shift with overdrive, Jan thought it would be interesting to see how fast it would run in first and second with the overdrive engaged.....75 in low and 110 in second!!!!She is 84 and still doesent let any grass grow under the wheels of her Park Avenue!..LOL

Post# 359194 , Reply# 106   9/12/2016 at 17:21 (289 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I had a Rebel with just the 290 4V and it was pretty quick! Fun car. turned tight!

Post# 359207 , Reply# 107   9/13/2016 at 01:02 (288 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

Sorry about your son. The jeep Kevin Bacon drove in Tremors was a M715 military version of the pickup you had with a straight 6 in it. Basically their modernized version of a M37 Dodge but more civilian parts beefed up and modified for military use.
Neighbor years ago when I was a teenager had your exact
Pickup, even had the 327 in it.
There wasn't a straight panel on it and he loved it because he didn't have to be careful with it and more dents just added character.
He had a beautiful F250 high boy all lifted and chromed out he pulled his custom ski boat with some kind of built huge engine in it but it was too pretty and perfect to daily drive, wheel, or hunt in.
That jeep nobody had to worry about and he beat it and got it dirty a lot.

Post# 359356 , Reply# 108   9/15/2016 at 13:58 (286 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

yeah, that's the model that replaced the M37 and had the six with all the engine failures. I saw a LOT of them in the mountains with small V-8's dropped in them. I had the opportunity to buy many of them...but stuck with the M37 and the M43....just made more sense to me not to be immediately looking for a retrofit engine.


I didn't think the one in the movie was the military version. The websites for the movie say it's the J20 Gladiator. And that they bought one runner and two other parts trucks.  Said they used the parts trucks to make a whole one again for the second movie, because they couldn't find another complete runner. Apparently they trashed the first one.....



Post# 359482 , Reply# 109   9/17/2016 at 18:53 (284 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

Well, maybe I'm mixing it up with flat liners as they definitely had a 715, OD and all. I think the Tremors one had the bigger tires but now I'll have to watch it again and see if it's just a beefed up pickup version.
The first movie is on my best movies ever list and not just because of that truck, it was just a lot of fun with a good attitude.

Post# 359488 , Reply# 110   9/17/2016 at 21:20 (283 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

I really don't know as I'm a M37/M43 man. The truck in the movie was similar to the one I had with my son, but different somehow...probably just the yrs difference. Without seeing the movie again, the M715 looks much more military, versus the 'civilian' looking movie truck.


Not that you ever find the complete truth on the Internet, but all the links I followed for the movie truck never mentioned the M715.


Now I'll have to go back and look at Flat Liners......forgot completely about the truck in that movie! What's with the younger Bacon and Jeep



Post# 359500 , Reply# 111   9/18/2016 at 15:59 (283 days old) by Vintagevaclover (Athens, GA)        
That's an easy one for me!

vintagevaclover's profile picture
It would either be a Mercedes Benz S-Class or a BMW 7 Series or 5 Series. They drive amazingly, have some of the best build quality, and are beautifully styled. They also have almost every possible option and upgrade available. They also last for a very long time too if well maintained. While do like and appreciate classic cars and the work, time, and money that goes into restoring them such as the ones posted here, I don't think I would want one because I know nothing about them or how to work on them, the only way I know how to fix a car is to take it to the dealership lmao. I also only drive German, I just feel the the quality is better. The USA used to be great at making cars "back in the day" but now, not so so much at all. The newer American cars I've been in just had an overall cheap feeling to them, even the "nice" ones. Let alone there have been several recalls in just the past few years on Ford, Cheverolet, and Chrysler. That's just my feeling on the subject though.

Post# 359532 , Reply# 112   9/19/2016 at 07:20 (282 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

those cars do drive very nicely, but I know a few owners of those cars who now drive a Lexus because they had some electrical problems and such. Mercedes especially from the early millennium suffered that.

Post# 359533 , Reply# 113   9/19/2016 at 07:21 (282 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
I'd be

a bit biased towards Porsche.

Post# 359578 , Reply# 114   9/19/2016 at 13:10 (282 days old) by Vintagevaclover (Athens, GA)        
That can be true!

vintagevaclover's profile picture
After all, NO car is absolutely perfect. The electronics in most German cars are VERY complicated. It will usually cost a minimum of $500 or more just for the mechanic to rub his chin and say "Hmmm, now THATS gonna cost you" lmao. My first car was a white 1999 Mercedes-Benz S-550 with a black interior, corded console telephone, and 6 speed manual transmission (only 225 of those in the US at the time!). The only electronic issues I had with it though were the sunroof stopped working and the heated steering wheel stopped heating, both were repaired relatively easily though. The only other problems like that I've had with BMW have been that rear window regulators quit working. Again, it was a simple fix. They drive and handle well enough to make up for small fixes like that in my opinion. The company that has the most electronic issues like that would be Jaguar though, my mom got a new one (I forget the model, but it was a 4-door sedan) back in 2005 and she got rid of it in less than two years because it had so many problems like that, the high price tag is there but the quality is not. Porche is definitely a good company, not exactly the same as Mercedes & BMW though as they make more sports/racing cars than anything else. They are amazing to drive though!

As for Lexus, you can keep those away from me lmao. They may be acceptable when they're brand new but as they get older things fail on them as well and they do not handle as well as they age for some reason. While Japanese cars run for a very long time, it's the motor that keeps running while everything else around it crumbles after a while. I drove a friend's 2003 LS 430 (I think?) and it handled like a bucket of bolts! It literally felt like driving a sofa to me lol, whereas my 7 Series from the same era still handled like it was brand new. The feel of the interior doesn't have the same luxurious feel either, they use a lot more plastic which gets brittle and cracks. Isn't Lexus basically an overpriced Toyota with different logos?

Post# 359593 , Reply# 115   9/19/2016 at 15:52 (282 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Oh, and I wonder about the Maybach 57 and 62 models.

I know every car eventually has problems, but never heard any about Lexus, especially the LS series.
My favorite Benz is the mid 90's S 420, 430, 500 or 600, which is the V-12. they had double door glass glazing, and were super quiet. The S600 had either as standard or optional power door latches, small rear quarter edge markers that rose up like small antennas for backing up, and a power rear sun screen and rear head rests.
Of course, I wouldn't snub a nice E 430 from that era either.

Post# 359628 , Reply# 116   9/20/2016 at 11:17 (281 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

I've been the original owner of a MB 300TE 4Matic wagon for a very long time...'92. The car cost me $63,000 new, so I paid the price of admission for the marque. Today's dollars that would be way over $100,000. W124 and W126 series were the hallmark of Mercedes engineering. Hailed as the 'over-engineered' series, they spared nothing in their manufacture. Other car companies followed/copied their new safety standards and innovations for over a decade after the series. Even today they are expensive to maintain & operate...especially the 4Matics. But the upside is that you can find one for next to nothing. Few drove on the hwy like those E and S class cars....that was the allure. They had real soul. The Lexus and Infinity cars were reversed engineered;the Japanese took the world's best luxury cars apart piece by piece and designed their cars around existing platform & innovations. They can be great cars to drive/own, but they have no soul. 


On the downside to that great series...around '92 the Germans introduced a biodegradable upper, lower and ETA wiring harness. This has plagued these cars ever since. The wire insulation virtually disintegrates.  My car would have had it, but the 4Matics retained the older engine harnesses and were dropped altogether from the series after '93. All the E class cars that had the bigger, more powerful M104 engine had faulty harnesses along with the V8 400E420 series and the 'muscle' sedan 500E500 cars from '92 on. They didn't produce a good harness again until '98. Other than being eco conscious, you have to wonder what they were thinking. In typical MB fashion they tired to get their customers to foot most of the repair bill. Never a company to acknowledge consumerism...unless you paid for it.


Since the W124, W126 series, MB has been on a steady slope of decline....especially with the affordable C class. The newer cars have an average of 46 onboard computers. They are not cars you can shade tree, their failure rate  is high and the bean counters have made sure they don't have the longevity of the older series. Sad story for a once great car marque. The series after the W124, the W210, are OK cars, but nothing like the W124 build quality. They too are affordable now and are still decent cars in my opinion.





This post was last edited 09/20/2016 at 11:39
Post# 359718 , Reply# 117   9/21/2016 at 19:15 (280 days old) by Vintagevaclover (Athens, GA)        
I have to agree with Real1Shep about Lexus/Infinity

vintagevaclover's profile picture
They may be sort of nice to drive when they're new, but they just don't drive as well as they age. The handling just isnt there. I also agree they have no soul, a good friend of mine got rid of his almost new LS saying "this thing is just a Toyota Avalon that they changed the emblems on and raised the price by $20,000" Haha.

But yes, the S Class you are referring to is the one I had and Also my favorite body style too. It was very advanced for the time. The Maybach is also an amazing car as well! The pic is the one I had😊

Post# 359736 , Reply# 118   9/22/2016 at 07:28 (279 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
See I've never been told that

by any Lexus owner, but most I know ate older, and drive much less, and are easier on cars now.
Also, the LS 400, 430, nor 450 have nothing in common with an Avalon. Avalons are upgraded Camry's, built in Kentucky.
The LS is rear drive, and built in Japan as are all other Lexus cars.
You are thinking of the smaller Lexus ES 300.
The GS is also rear drive.

Post# 359738 , Reply# 119   9/22/2016 at 07:36 (279 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Also note;

that Mercedes has only ever built one front drive car, the A class, unless you consider their hand in the Smart car. BMW has never made one. They don't handle well.
I give Audi a pass on this, as their Quattro system adds rear wheel traction and vehicle stability.
Also, the ratio of unsprung weight to sprung weight car has drastically affects ride and handling.
Also it's center of gravity. higher center of gravity, more body roll. More unsprung weight, better handling, less pitch and yaw. More sprung weight, a smoother boulevard ride, but handling can be compromised.

Post# 359783 , Reply# 120   9/23/2016 at 09:34 (278 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
I saw a road test

on youtube of a Hyundai Genesis 5.0 V8 ultimate. Quite impressive actually for a 7er series size at a 5er series price. Lexus may have some competition there.
No, it's not another Mercedes either, which is what some say of Lexus.

Post# 359827 , Reply# 121   9/24/2016 at 09:33 (277 days old) by Vintagevaclover (Athens, GA)        
That's very true about front wheel vs. rear wheel drive!

vintagevaclover's profile picture
I did even know Mercedes ever made one lol. I did know BMW hadn't though. I can take or leave Audi honestly, I had and A6 for very short period. It drove alright but it didn't have the same feel to it. Ive heard they've gotten nicer in recent years though. However, I just yesterday traded (and paid for lol) my black 528i in on a much newer silver 535i. Even though it's basically the same car, this one is 10x better!!

Post# 359838 , Reply# 122   9/24/2016 at 15:15 (277 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Wow Austin!

It's in exceptional shape! Is it a 1998 or '99, or an early 2000's? They didn't really change much until 2005.
Some mid 90's BMW V8's had some piston scuffing issues.

Post# 359842 , Reply# 123   9/24/2016 at 15:55 (277 days old) by Vintagevaclover (Athens, GA)        
The black one was a 1999

vintagevaclover's profile picture
This is a 2004. It looks like it just rolled out of the showroom too!! AND it's a stick shift!! Something I've been wanting again for a looooong time. It has every upgrade possible for this model which makes me very happy😊

Post# 359887 , Reply# 124   9/25/2016 at 07:09 (276 days old) by Bobbi (PA)        
Love the environmentally friendly cars others have posted

We have a 2014 Ford C-Max Energi PHEV. LOVE IT! We routinely get 1200 miles per tank, and over 100 mpg.

Post# 359889 , Reply# 125   9/25/2016 at 07:20 (276 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
A gem from

Dingolfing for sure!
Of course environmentally friendly cars are becoming ever more popular, but any petrol or diesel engine can be retrofitted with CNG to double the fuel mileage and lower pollution.
More and more new busses run with it. You can get the same fuel economy with a cng supplemental system as a Prius. Chrysler uses compressed natural gas Peterbuilt semi tractors, and all those recalled VW TDI diesel cars? What will become of them once they are bought back?

Post# 359912 , Reply# 126   9/25/2016 at 22:57 (275 days old) by Vintagevaclover (Athens, GA)        
I've never tried a hybrid car before

vintagevaclover's profile picture
I've heard some can be nice though

Post# 359925 , Reply# 127   9/26/2016 at 07:58 (275 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

if the v.i.n. on that silver beemer says it is a 2004, something is amiss with it.
The subsequent body style to it was released for the 2004 model year.
It may have been stolen at some point, or damaged and totaled and sold as salvage, in which case may be why it looks brand new. It may have been rebuilt after being stripped or wrecked, and a vin number used from another.

Post# 359946 , Reply# 128   9/26/2016 at 12:41 (275 days old) by Vintagevaclover (Athens, GA)        
That was a typo!!

vintagevaclover's profile picture
Haha, it was suppose to say 2003! It also came from the dealership so I highly doubt anything like that is going on.

Post# 359958 , Reply# 129   9/26/2016 at 16:53 (275 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Ok Austin!

I'm glad for that! Not that I completely trust dealerships though, and I bet now and then one gets duped without even knowing it themselves.
A used car can have a sketchy history regardless of the Carfax report.

Post# 359985 , Reply# 130   9/27/2016 at 03:41 (274 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

neighbor lady has a Prius and she used to have me drive her everywhere. Kind of a dingbat, gets confused easily behind the wheel and can add incredible mileage to an easy trip. Always messing around with the dash monitor, to see who was the most economical driver. I always beat her without even trying. Her car....wasn't like I was gonna go flying around in it with her sitting there.


But....once she let me borrow it to take my son up to Spokane. Just the two of us and quite frankly, I hammered the car. Awful suspension....darting all over the road almost uncontrollably at high speed. Gutless in power. The only thing positive I can say about the car is that it's a hell of a city commuter car if you can pretend you are driving something else.


Nice Bimmer! You should have lots of fun with that stick. You could find sticks in the E(don't remember about the S)series I mentioned. But they were lack luster with poor ratios. I know people who have borne the expense of converting them to the standard shift.  Compared to a tight shifting Bimmer, they are a disappointment. However in Europe, there were a lot of ways to order your MB. You could opt for cloth interior, dual climate control, a stick and thus cars you never see over here. You could have even ordered a estate wagon with the diesel, stick and in 4Matic. They only offered the wagon for the first yr W124 run....then removed it from NA. 


I had two Peugeot wagons before the Mercedes.....loved them both. First one was the last yr their wagon was built on a light truck chassis and it was a diesel. Second one was gas and pretty sporty.  Then Peugeot pulled out of NA and let us all stranded for parts & service. The French can be masters of retreat.





This post was last edited 09/27/2016 at 04:04
Post# 359994 , Reply# 131   9/27/2016 at 07:32 (274 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
I'm sure

she didn't appreciate her car being hammered on. Are they even meant to be hammered? A Prius performs best at a steady cruising speed, or in town driving.
They may not be autobahn high speed engineered.
My grandmothers 1966 Impala lasted her 26 years. It still ran smoothly and glided along when she passed away. She babied it. It had regular maintainance, and was garage kept. She drove it once from Pa. to California.

Post# 360202 , Reply# 132   10/1/2016 at 13:43 (270 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

She never knew....not like I damaged it, but put it through its paces. I wouldn't own any car that I hadn't put through its paces. The car is a purpose built commuter, nothing more. The amenities are stark, it's not particularly comfortable, it's gutless in power and overall, very unattractive. It has lots of appeal to a lot of people...I recognize that and thankful we still have choices.



Post# 360328 , Reply# 133   10/3/2016 at 21:18 (267 days old) by funnynet1231 (Maine)        
Straight Up, The Mirth Mobile.

funnynet1231's profile picture
A 1976 Amc pacer would be most excellent to have. (Party on dudes, or dudets)

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 360338 , Reply# 134   10/4/2016 at 02:40 (267 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Pacer remember those-such a HOMELY thing-but useful.Folks that I knew who owned a Pacer cautioned you NOT to put heat sensitive things under the window-that window heats up like a giant magnifying glass!

Post# 360349 , Reply# 135   10/4/2016 at 10:28 (267 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Pacer, the new "wide" small car

has a collectable following today. Not so small by todays standards. Mid size, if not full. In those days, it was a compact. We called them fish bowls. It was designed for the wankel engine, but smog regulations deemed the wankel impractical, so it got the inline six.
Not a well made car at all. Cheesy seats, door hinges, electrical, and even manual window cranks.
My cousin had to bungie cord the drivers door closed on hers, and my friends mom bought a used one because it was cheap. The drivers seat soon sagged on the left. She drove up to their machine shop one warm day, and her head was pushed against the side glass. The window didn't roll down. No A/C.
I think some bugs may have been improved on by the time the wagon came out. It looked better with it's squared off aft section and lift gate.

Post# 360388 , Reply# 136   10/5/2016 at 09:30 (266 days old) by kirbyvertibles (Independence, KS)        

kirbyvertibles's profile picture
I used to have a 1977 silver Mercedes 450 SEL. It was a beast! I sold it to a preacher who asked if I'd ever sell my car. Without thinking I said yes I would. He got it the same day. I got a few updates a couple years later as to how she is doing. He jokingly said it almost got him divorced as his wife was not happy lol The reason he wanted it was because his parents had the same model and it was special to him

  View Full Size
Post# 360389 , Reply# 137   10/5/2016 at 09:32 (266 days old) by kirbyvertibles (Independence, KS)        

kirbyvertibles's profile picture
Shaylee really wants this. It's the flagship SUV the GLS. It's so much fun to drive. It's got 3rd row seating and so much more. Maybe someday

  View Full Size
Post# 360391 , Reply# 138   10/5/2016 at 09:40 (266 days old) by kirbyvertibles (Independence, KS)        

kirbyvertibles's profile picture
This is a stock photo of my currant baby. I've had this about 10 years. I LOVE thus car. It's a 96 red c280

  View Full Size
Post# 360402 , Reply# 139   10/5/2016 at 12:33 (266 days old) by s31463221 (Frenchburg, KY)        
All these Mercedes....

s31463221's profile picture
REALLY makes me miss my old Benz....I traded it a couple of years ago to my truck....and honestly I've regretted it ever since I let it go.....

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 2         View Full Size
Post# 360408 , Reply# 140   10/5/2016 at 14:33 (266 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
My brother just dumped as in what will you give me carmax 2 late model MB,one was nice, the other cute. He wanted to hit the road and roam after they sold their house here in CA, took their new F150, it was nice too. I very much enjoyed my 81? I want to say 300D, built like a tank

Post# 360434 , Reply# 141   10/5/2016 at 23:21 (265 days old) by kirbyvertibles (Independence, KS)        

kirbyvertibles's profile picture
Steve, that's beautiful!!!!

I felt that way for a while about my Volvo s-60. I still miss driving it but I've finally gotten over it. I drove the crap out of her. I made SEVERAL 5,000+mile road trips across this Country in it. Mostly from Kansas to Washington down to California and back.

Post# 360440 , Reply# 142   10/6/2016 at 06:57 (265 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

Waynes World used a Pacer, and so did John Denver with George Burns in Oh God, and Oh God, you Devil.

Post# 360450 , Reply# 143   10/6/2016 at 10:09 (265 days old) by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        

gottahaveahoove's profile picture

those Pacers are a great workspace to make a very large hoagi (sub to some folks)  Remember that ad?

Post# 360467 , Reply# 144   10/6/2016 at 13:40 (265 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

don't recall that add John. So it was also a good tailgater.
By the time the Pacer came along, my two year old Gremlin was falling apart, so I was paying more attention to Monte Carlos and Olds Cutlasses. I didn't even want a Nova.
I sat home except from school, and work for a year to save for money down on a good car.
I didn't have the heart to sell it to anyone. The dealer gave me $500 for it.

Post# 361542 , Reply# 145   10/27/2016 at 06:26 (244 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

A state trooper was indicted yesterday on charges of fraudulent salvage vehicle inspections.
So it can and does happen, that a dealer may unkowingly buy a salvaged vehicle at an auction that may have been rebuilt, but not have a salvage title reissue.

Post# 361549 , Reply# 146   10/27/2016 at 10:21 (244 days old) by dysonman1 (Rolla, Missouri)        

dysonman1's profile picture
The first car I ever bought was a 1979 Pontiac TransAm. I loved it, drove it until the wheels fell off (not literally). It did have almost 300,000 miles on it when it finally gave up the ghost.

When we got married, my husband bought a new Tie Yoda Corolla, and gave me the Tie Yoda Highlander that he had. I sold my big Dodge truck to a co-worker (for hauling deer out of the woods). I'm extremely impressed with the Highlander. It drives like a dream.

The Corolla is also a fantastic car. We took it to New Orleans on our honeymoon, and spent in total, $80 to go from St. Louis to New Orleans and back. It just sips the gas. He bought the 'sport' model, and it's so comfortable to both drive, and ride in.

The first time I saw the Corolla, Donnie told me to take it work so I could see how it handles. Lord, I got into that thing and there were a million buttons. Buttons everywhere. I mashed them all down, and floored it. Once I figured out what all the buttons were for, it was much better.

All in all, after much more than 50 years on this earth riding and driving a lot of vehicles, I think the Tie Yodas are the best.

Post# 361588 , Reply# 147   10/28/2016 at 06:56 (243 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

it's great to have so many choices in vehicles. Toyota builds quality ones, and most others run rather well until they get older also. Most have had issues and recalls. Today, it's Toyota again, for air bags.
The car business is a global giant today and all makers source parts from the huge consortium of suppliers, such as Takata, Bosch, Delphi, Eberspaker, Merritor, Nippon Denso, etc., etc.
So, a Toyota assembled her in the USA may have some same parts as a GM product.
GM and Fiat even share small vehicle suspension parts.

Post# 361601 , Reply# 148   10/28/2016 at 11:22 (243 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Yesterday at the library there was an older fellow, gosh getting there myself! walking away from my car, I asked if something was wrong? He said Park Avenue, didn't know they still made that. Pretty car. I said thanks, they don't. It's 16 years old! But there isn't a nick or scratch in it, it looks new! Thanks very much, I try hard. Made my day!He had even looked inside the thing.

Post# 361609 , Reply# 149   10/28/2016 at 14:09 (243 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
I got behind a 1941 (I think) Pontiac in rush hour traffic on Wednesday. It was beautifully restored in two-tone gray and silver but the exhaust just about asphyxiated me. There were no brand markings on the back but my dad has a '41 Olds similar to it (for sale, btw) and looking at some photos online, the '41 Pontiacs I saw all had the same distinctive five vertical chrome strips up the middle of the trunk lid. Amazingly, it didn't appear to be hot-rodded in any way.

Post# 361631 , Reply# 150   10/29/2016 at 00:09 (242 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

Those older cars used simple 1bbl carbs and should have the usual idle mixture screw so if it was running that dirty it needed a tuneup or adjustment. I don't remember my Jeep or Power Wagon ever running so dirty they smelled bad or made my eyes water unless the choke was out when cold. My Jeep the engine was pretty tired and it even passed emissions testing in 77 when I first tagged it as the cut off back then was 41 or earlier vehicles. I think the standard was 1 percent or less C02 so not very tight but it passed and they checked for visible smoke too so even if it technically passed smoke would fail it. Later they went to 74 or earlier so my Dart is exempt, I have ran it through on a free self test and it passed better than many new cars in the late 80s after I super tuned the AVS 383 carb I plunked on the original 318. I kept the test reports it was so clean and the test guy saw me come in again and poked his helper and told him to watch this. It passed just as clean again and then he came out and showed me a picture of the 71 340 Dart he owned, his pride and joy.

Post# 361638 , Reply# 151   10/29/2016 at 03:05 (242 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Mine has got to be my 2016 Toyota Highlander Hybrid Limited-Best car I have owned so far.Gas mileage is excellent for a car its size-and it does have all wheel drive-great for snow or ice.Mainly the ice storms we get here.

Post# 361688 , Reply# 152   10/30/2016 at 06:44 (241 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
How about a

"Zimmer Quicksilver"? Those of you anywhere near Pompano Beach Florida have likely see at least one.

Post# 361736 , Reply# 153   10/31/2016 at 11:53 (240 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
Speaking of

the Park neighbor has a 19yr old version with 50,000 miles, not a scratch, goes back to the dealer for anything wrong. She's older and so I've driven the car for her a lot, even trips to the coast. has some traction control system that when engaged, it growls ferociously sometimes. That would spook me, but the dealer can't find anything wrong. I guess the 'Ultra' models were supercharged, never drove one of those. Still, FWD and I'm not generally a fan. Repairs seem excessive on this car. Some sort of dash instrument cluster failure and they had to replace the whole dash cluster for $1,500. Had a manifold seal leak that recently cost more than that to repair.

I think she's putting more money into the car than it's worth. She loves the car though and remembers like yesterday when it was new. It keeps her happy to drive/have it, that's what counts.


Post# 361739 , Reply# 154   10/31/2016 at 13:35 (240 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
my dash cluster had fading issues, in and out. 1 hour labor and sent to SF to a company that rebuilt it and polished the lense, 220 total. Changed the oil today, getting too old for this crap

Post# 361749 , Reply# 155   10/31/2016 at 16:40 (240 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
The manifold seal issue is the achilles heel of the 3800 V6 engine that GM used in the Park Ave, LeSabre, Bonneville, Gran Prix, Olds Eighty-Eight, Ninety-Eight, etc. This was especially true of the 3800 series II engine that ran from 1995 to around 2001. The DexCool coolant they used (called 'DexKill' by many) would turn acidic over time and eat away the seals and let coolant into the oil, which is definitely not a good thing. I had a '97 Olds LSS that the mechanic caught just before it gave way and the repair was only about $400. Of course, I don't take my car to the 'stealership' where you pay double for repairs.

Other than that, the 3800 V6 is a rock-solid engine that will outlast the car if properly maintained. I had a friend whose dad had a 1991 Olds Ninety-Eight that he bought new and drove 400,000 miles before the body rusted out to the point that it was dangerous to drive.

Post# 361750 , Reply# 156   10/31/2016 at 17:51 (240 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I have had that happen, was told that the plastic top half cracked around the egr port. Its a few hundred to replace and my mechanic is 109 an hour

Post# 361752 , Reply# 157   10/31/2016 at 19:34 (240 days old) by Air-WayCharlie (USA)        

air-waycharlie's profile picture
My favorite is the 1964 Cadillac Fleetwood Sixty Special. Just beautiful.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 5         View Full Size
Post# 361762 , Reply# 158   11/1/2016 at 02:14 (239 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

jmurray01's profile picture
With all that talk of Mercedes, I suppose it is appropriate to post a picture of my "new ride".

It's a 1996 C220 Diesel, "Classic" trim-level so not a lot in the way of extras, but the general build quality per se is luxurious enough for me. It has the automatic transmission (although the manual was also popular over here) which is mainly why I bought it, as my Peugeot and Ford are both manuals which were wreaking havoc with my left knee injury.

I got it for a great price, and it only has 134,000 miles on it which I believe is barely run-in for these engines.

Yes they are slow as hell, but you don't buy a big Mercedes with an automatic for speed! It'll do 80 easily, and the cruise control holds it there smoothly, just takes a little longer to get there in the first place...

The first thing I need to replace on that car is the alloys though, as the current ones are aftermarket and hideous in my opinion!! They would be nice on a sports car maybe, but not a saloon.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 8         View Full Size
Post# 361763 , Reply# 159   11/1/2016 at 02:18 (239 days old) by FantomFan (Rochester, New York)        
For me...

fantomfan's profile picture
1958 Ford Fairlane 500 Skyliner, 1976 Oldsmobile Toronado and 1990 Lincoln Town Car.

Post# 361764 , Reply# 160   11/1/2016 at 02:27 (239 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

jmurray01's profile picture

I have to say though, my "favourite" car is definitely my 1996 Peugeot 405 1.9 Turbo Diesel. My mother owned two 405s when I was a child, and I always loved them.

It is getting to the stage now where the 405s are almost as rare here as they are in America, which is saying something. They were once one of the most popular cars, but failing rear axles and general wear and tear took the majority off the roads in the early 2000s.

The XUD9 turbo diesel engine in mine was the most popular, and was also fitted to Citroens of the same era. It came in a naturally aspirated version too, literally the same engine but without the turbocharger, and although that was critisised for the obvious lack of power, both versions were noted for their durability.

One thing you'll hardly ever see though is a rusty 405, as Peugeot had the foresight to galvanise the bodies so that they wouldn't corrode. Yes the undercarriage is still vulnerable, but the body should remain pristine so long as you keep it clean and free from dents/scrapes.


It is also at 134,000 miles, and like the C220 the engine is barely run in with that.


I did also own an estate (wagon) version of the 405, but sold it recently as it had too many problems and I had too little time and money to spend on it.  I sort of regret that, but in all honesty I'd never have had the time to fix it up, at least not for a few years until things with work calm down.


Incidentally the 405 was the last Peugeot model to be sold in the USA before they pulled out in 1991.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 361769 , Reply# 161   11/1/2016 at 06:58 (239 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
I've never

had a manifold issue with either of our GM 3800 series II engines.
Changing the coolant is crucial at the reccomended service interval, and never mix the orange Dex-Cool with green Prestone. That is when the chemical reaction takes place and corrosion eats the aluminum seals.
I did that, and caused the coolant pump to fail on our 2007 3.5 Impala.
Also, the series II has a metal EGR passage liner which keeps the plastic manifold from melting, which the series I did not have. Also, the heater hose tubes that run through the serpentine belt tensioner can leak on all of them, and is often mistaken for a manifold leak. It is best to change them with the new belt.
Some mechanics are out for the big buck, and tell customers their manifold is leaking when it is only those tubes. I bet some owners of the final series III 3800's with aluminum manifolds have discovered this by now.
I've never seen a Peugot 405 in the states myself. Most were likely sold in the north east. I think it is the first car to share mechanical design with Citroen. I've seen one C2 with Canadian plates on it.
Any Body by Fleetwood Cadillac is a work of art. All of them said back then, "body by Fleetwood interior by Fisher" on the rocker panel sill inside the door.
Most folks don't know that while all Cadillacs were not a "Fleetwood", even the DeVille and Calais models in fact had their body assembled at the Fleetwood body plant on Fort street in southwest Detroit. Then they were trucked in sets of 8 on special trucks about a mile and a half to the Clark street final assembly line where the body met the frame with the engine and drive train, and the front dog house with fenders, radiator, and grille and headlights.

Post# 361775 , Reply# 162   11/1/2016 at 09:09 (239 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Alloy wheels

seem to all leak when they get old. It's a nuisance so I have the tire shop put extra sealant around the tire bead. I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on a 2003 car with 155,000 miles on it. I can handle lugging the air compressor up from the basement occasionally.

Post# 361780 , Reply# 163   11/1/2016 at 12:39 (239 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Mike, my series 2 did not have the steel insert, mechanic even said should be too new for that! Replacement one done 10 years ago didn't either! Last year, that one did. Never mixed any off coolants and the heater inserts were replaced with water pump and radiator 10 years ago when they were claiming mine was too new to have that problem. A week later service engine soon and running on 5 they ate their words

Post# 361781 , Reply# 164   11/1/2016 at 12:40 (239 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

My neighbor with the Park Ave is 83. There is no other place in town, indie or otherwise, that can match the experience the GM dealer here has working on old Buicks and Olds. Sure she's paying about three times what she should for service but it would be a virtual nightmare for an indie here to do the work and all the resulting trips back to fix the same thing. Now when those old Buick and Olds mechanics retire/die out at the dealer, it wouldn't matter where the car goes and the resulting crap shoot.

Regarding the Peugeot...we bought a 505 Estate around '86. Loved the car and the kids loved it too. I started fixing it myself to save what the indie was hammering us with in repair costs. Then the French did what they do best-retreated......from the NA market. The story I got was that they refused to follow US trends & wants for the designs of their cars.

BTW, Peugeot were not just an east coast car, they were extremely popular up & down the Pacific Corridor. That's were we were living when we bought it. They competed against Volvo admirably there. Their ride was immensely more refined than Volvo, especially for the passengers in the back.

In any event, I was finding parts only from some outfit in NJ and how long that would be available was up in the air. So...we bought a '92 Mercedes Estate 4Matic which I'm still driving today and raising my grandson in.


This post was last edited 11/01/2016 at 12:58
Post# 361784 , Reply# 165   11/1/2016 at 13:31 (239 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

jmurray01's profile picture

Yes, it was a very poor decision Peugeot made to cease operations in the States I think.  But, I never thought they were that popular there, so a lack of sales was probably the cause.  When the 405 also failed to sell they must have just thought "screw it!" and left.


By the way, what happened to your 505?  It would be worth a lot now!

Post# 361831 , Reply# 166   11/2/2016 at 07:28 (238 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

what year is your Buick park ave.? They must have changed to the metal egr passage insert mid year.
Ford also had plastic intake manifold cracking issues with the Modular V8's.
You save a bit on fuel, then spend it on repairs.

Post# 361836 , Reply# 167   11/2/2016 at 09:00 (238 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture

Post# 361859 , Reply# 168   11/2/2016 at 14:39 (238 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

our Bonneville was an'01, and other '03 Impala. It hasn't let me down yet.
I just realized our '07 is already 10 years old, built 10/'06.
Point A to B, not expensive to run, and insurance is affordable.
You know how it is on a fixed income, and the medicare supplemental, or even employer health insurance is expensive.

Post# 361871 , Reply# 169   11/2/2016 at 19:22 (238 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
mine was may 2000 so almost a 2001. never figured I would have it 11 years, oh well, nothing wrong with it

Post# 361901 , Reply# 170   11/3/2016 at 06:57 (237 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
No David,

at our ages, who needs car payments?

Post# 361905 , Reply# 171   11/3/2016 at 09:10 (237 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Yeah, totally not possible

Post# 361914 , Reply# 172   11/3/2016 at 11:51 (237 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

By the way, what happened to your 505? It would be worth a lot now!


Interesting story on that 505. We traded it in on the Mercedes Estate. We had had a protective cloth cover put over the backseat to protect the leather from what small boys do to backseats. Pulled the cover off before we traded and the leather seat looked new! About four months after we traded, I got a call from a cop shop in St.Louis(we lived in Columbia,MO). They found the 505 apparently abandoned after a snowstorm, still titled in my name, do I want to come get it?? So I called around and learned about salvaged titles and the like, in case I wanted to do this. But....whomever "abandoned" the vehicle, picked it back up.


I found out that the Mercedes dealer just sent the car straight to the wholesale auction process and most likely, the new owner hadn't bothered to get a title transfer yet. I had the keys, could have picked up the car.....but my gut told me not to.


I can't believe it would actually be worth something here in the States today??? We loved the car, had a Peugeot diesel Estate before that. I wish I had kept the diesel was amazingly economical, very solid...just a fun wagon. The gasser however, was very well appointed and served us well as the family truckster. If IIRC, the paint was perfect and no accidents.....about 117,00 miles or so.



Post# 362634 , Reply# 173   11/21/2016 at 15:53 (219 days old) by cocobird5 (Laguna Hills)        
Favorite Car

I ran into a man parking a Studebaker Lark the other day and chatted with him for a while His still runs fine. That was the first car I ever owned, and I loved it.

Post# 362638 , Reply# 174   11/21/2016 at 17:07 (219 days old) by thekirbylover (Warrington, cheshire )        
My favourite car would be a 60s convertible mustang.

thekirbylover's profile picture
but for now I have a 1998 ford fiesta LX, Zetec S 1.25. not the most power fullest but it is great for a new driver , his name is Freddie btw. do ignore the wheels in one of the pictures as you can tell by the rear view I have upgraded to alloys :)

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 362658 , Reply# 175   11/21/2016 at 19:16 (219 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Very clean

Fiesta! Very Ford-ish 90's handsome styled interior. The USA did not get that generation, or the following one, but we do have the latest one. The original 70's Fiesta was a decent seller here. It's all about point A to B. Save you money while you are young. That will enable you to enjoy more as you age. A car depreciates. Money in the bank grows. Be smart, not that you aren't already.
Then when your savings and investments grow, you can afford real estate, and that usually also appreciates. Even just land.
Drive a cheap to operate daily driver for school, and work. Then later you can buy a luxury or a sports car or a nice SUV or crossover for the week ends and country trips.
Like a Range Rover, Jeep Grand Cherokee or a Jaguar, that fine machine from Coventry, or even an Aston Martin, or maybe a Noble.

Post# 362660 , Reply# 176   11/21/2016 at 22:48 (218 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

Hey, somebody put your steering wheel on the wrong side, you put that back on the left where it belongs ;)
Kinda reminds me of Caddy Shack...

Post# 362662 , Reply# 177   11/22/2016 at 00:47 (218 days old) by vacmaster (Southern California)        
For me..

vacmaster's profile picture
It would be a Chevrolet Suburban (we have 2) or a Mercedes Benz S 63 AMG Sedan

Post# 362694 , Reply# 178   11/23/2016 at 09:55 (217 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I may have to make this choice in a year or so? Ex was home visiting his mom and sister, I used to work for his mom in the 70s/80s she owned the Nissan dealership. She cares for her things and garages them! Her bottom of the line 03 Century has 28,000 miles, where my 00 Park Ave has 132,000 and outdoors all of it's life. He caught up all the sitting too much stuff on mom's car, trans and coolant service, replaced the rotted tires and wheel cylinders. Asked, so David, do you want mom's car? Buying it of course. I said it rather depends on what shape it and mine are in when she stops driving! Like mine better, but would hate to pass up on one of Cookie's cars.Brad quasi grandson would jump on mine like crazy and take it. or the Century I am sure. Not fond of mom's old Civic, which never breaks.

Post# 362740 , Reply# 179   11/24/2016 at 15:36 (216 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Then when your savings and investments grow, you can afford real estate, and that usually also appreciates. Even just land.


Real estate doesn't appreciate anything like it used have to hold onto home property a lot longer and if you're expanding with kids, a bigger/newer house will absorb the equity you had in your first house.  And as far as just really careful there. For one if you plan to build on it, few banks will lend you the money just using the land as equity. Secondly, holding onto just land for a long period of time rarely nets you any big profit(as compared to other investments) unless the area is rezoned commercial, or suddenly becomes yuppie hot spot potential.  All of that to say the least is a gamble.


My advice would be to buy a fix-'er-upper commiserate with the size of the family you expect to have. Do most of the work yourself and don't fret too much about how long it takes you. Take any extra money and funnel it into a retirement account and/or better yet, a broad-based investment portfolio. These days, leave real estate to the fools who think they can automatically get rich in it. 



Post# 362764 , Reply# 180   11/25/2016 at 06:45 (215 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Good advice Kevin.

I've done that twice. Bought in a buyers market, a house no one else wanted, fixed it up, sold it in a sellers market, bought another no one else wanted. It's hard to double dip though. Sometimes you need a house to live in at a time when the market is up.
Try avoiding bubble area markets. The appreciation is lower, but more stable.
A tip for new or young renovators; I've found out it costs more to special order certain items like bath fixtures from a big box store. An independent dealer often discounts them more.

Post# 362784 , Reply# 181   11/25/2016 at 18:36 (215 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

A tip for new or young renovators; I've found out it costs more to special order certain items like bath fixtures from a big box store. An independent dealer often discounts them more.


Exactly...if a store like Home Depot has to special order anything, they'll really put the screws to you.  Plumbing fixtures and supplies from a wholesaler in the long-run, for example, will be cheaper and people easier to deal with. 


I would caution though to do everything to code and do it well. Homeowners that scab stuff in and try to cover non-code work with nice paint/trim/bling ought to be publicly caned. You'll always get better money if you do the work properly and no one wants to buy a house and discover secret deplorable junk work that's been covered up.



Post# 362798 , Reply# 182   11/26/2016 at 08:36 (214 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
That is true Kevin.

A good home inspector sees things that are not to code, and code is often minimum.
I've added gfi circuits, and anti-scald pressure balance shower valves, even though I could have left the separate hot and cold rough in types grandfathered in. I think they look nicer, but are illegal now. Volume control valves can be added for the same separate appearance plus hot/cold variance, and multiple sprays, but are pricey.
Few houses if any are ever built perfect, and municipal inspectors often miss things, or can be on the take. Mine had a boiler drain mounted next to a floor joist in the basement above the washing machine that couldn't be closed, because the handle bottomed out on the joist. I guess it passed because there was a second shut off just above the laundry sink where the washer hoses connect.
One code I don't get is the new 6 inch water heater exhaust flu. This is very expensive to have a chimney liner installed. It costs more than a new water heater. A 3 or 4 inch flu was code for decades.

Post# 362814 , Reply# 183   11/26/2016 at 23:24 (213 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Those guys that inspect homes for a living independently, are widely variable with respect to what they catch. They're not officially schooled like I was in the trades. I've personally seen them pass over some very egregious plumbing violations.  But if you weren't in the trade, you might not know. Like san tees laying on their backs in the dirt...or too many aggregate angles without a cleanout, waste dumping down on service fittings from second and third story floors, external drainage fittings with no air gaps going into floor drains etc. Or just total ignorance of sanitary fittings and use of by the homeowner. Sanitary plumbing is learned, it's not intuitive.



Post# 362819 , Reply# 184   11/27/2016 at 06:38 (213 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Absolutley Kevin,

and although the knowledge is available to the handy person, knowing when to call, in a pro is crucial.
I've done so myself, not being a plumber. I don't mess with leading closet flanges, and other intricate fittings.
A pro as your self knows how air and gravity affect flow and venting.
I am currently awaiting delivery of a Kohler Salient cast iron shower receptor. Depending upon the drain connection, as the installation instructions say it is to be lead caulked to a 2 inch pipe, I may be calling on one again. I removed a bath tub which has a brass P trap connected to the galvanized horizontal drain.

Post# 362965 , Reply# 185   12/1/2016 at 12:03 (209 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Even younger plumbers balk at lead work, I had to cut my teeth on the process, so I still have the ladle, packing iron, inside/outside irons, two types of oakum etc. Not for the faint of heart. But....they sell lead 'wool' which does not require melting, yet that should be used with at least inside/outside irons of lore. I'd have to see it, but there are adapters to replace lead joints and there are multi-tight rubber gaskets for hub fittings. I've run into all kinds of tub/shower traps..brass like you mentioned, lead, lead with cleanout(what we call 'drum traps') etc. When we were still using Durham fittings, all that stuff was available. There are still hundreds of thousands of houses with old Durham stuff intact...maybe millions yet!

I was doing a job once that just required a brass WC ring soldered back to a lead we did for was a great way to secure a toilet. This young plumber was going to rip everything out and start over with ABS. That would have run up the job hundreds of dollars and my work was at most a half hr. Was he grateful, no....punk.

I looked on the Kohler site for installation instruction for the Receptor...drawings are poor quality. I can't tell if the trap riser pipe comes up into their drain with a gasket, or it's a hook-up below their drain. I'm guessing it might be like a conventional shower drain wherein, they provide the gasket. But..... Kohler's more expensive cast-iron products like this typically are designed with 'old school' plumbing in mind. Until we're all dead, they don't want to piss off us old plumbers and how we like to do things.


This post was last edited 12/01/2016 at 15:32
Post# 362973 , Reply# 186   12/1/2016 at 17:28 (209 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Thanks Kevin,

I ordered a Kohler drain in brushed nickel. It installs with putty into the shower base and is 4 inches round. I looked at the drain installation pdf from Kohler.
I'll ask the dealer when I pick it up. They seem to know their stuff. They may even be able to recommend someone.

Post# 362981 , Reply# 187   12/1/2016 at 22:38 (208 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Yeah, I'd have to see the actual drain or more drawings. I would silicone instead of putty that drain in. That's one of the few concessions I've made to 'the old ways' really is better than putty, but you have to be careful you don't squeeze it all out. It's more durable, last longer, never weeps out putty. The trick it to get ALL of the extra removed while it's setting. We use Hercules Wipes for anything like that...they are amazing....they'll even float scratches off of fiberglass surrounds and basins. You get all the excess out and you'll never see it yellow or degrade. I've pulled drains apart that were silicon-ed 30 yrs ago and they look like they were done yesterday.

The only times I've had to take old drains apart is if the finish wore off requiring replacement, or they got loose from the putty giving out.


Post# 362988 , Reply# 188   12/2/2016 at 06:18 (208 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Ok, thank's again.

My current Kohler sinks in that bathroom were cast iron hexagon from the early 90's.
They have a bit of rust around the drains. I installed new faucets with drains in about 1997 with putty.
Do you think silicone is better to inhibit rust? Not that it's an issue for me.
In 20 years, if I'm still living, I'll be almost 80, so the next remodel will be the next owners project.

Post# 362998 , Reply# 189   12/2/2016 at 12:55 (208 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Yes, I do and another plus for silicone. The old drains I pulled apart with silicone seemed to be 'preserved' in time....although from use and scrubbing the top finish can still come off exposing the brass underneath.


Post# 363220 , Reply# 190   12/6/2016 at 19:32 (204 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Really killed myself this week, detail before winter, last one this year for sure. This should guarantee we get rain, right? Inside and out, can hardly move, car however looks amazing!

  View Full Size
Post# 363236 , Reply# 191   12/7/2016 at 06:43 (203 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Sure does David!

California cars always look better in most cases, but you did a great job. Looks new to me.
One of my neighbors washes his big Jeep in winter with a bucket of hot water wearing wading boots and insulated coat. He says a car wash ruins the paint.

Post# 363239 , Reply# 192   12/7/2016 at 08:55 (203 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Thanks, it's work, but felt it needed it. No car wash here either.

Post# 363241 , Reply# 193   12/7/2016 at 09:10 (203 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Here either David

Last water bill was $207.00. Highest ever. I don't want to think what could have been if I were an avid car washer.
How does that compare to your area? Most of that is sewage charge. We actually used less cubit feet of water than a year ago.
Three person household. Step son does take long showers, but I have 1.5 g.p.m. shower heads.
We had a large rate hike. Some places were hit worse.

Post# 363243 , Reply# 194   12/7/2016 at 09:19 (203 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Ah, mixed answer?? We are on a private well. so washing car I have to move fast and that is not really possible anymore! Water spots! Our town the water/ sewer runs around $80, but metered, if you go over??? Next door city is much higher, ditto on town 15 miles north of us, so Yuba City is cheap for that I guess.I don't care for car washes, but also can't afford it. I had a job at a car dealer in high school, 3 lots of cars to wash every 3 days, I got fast then! I do enjoy it, just have to take a lot of pain meds to pull it off. To clean and dress the bottom side I had to lay on my side, knees weren't happy and lower back was a hell no.Yes well water can suck, but land lady loves the no bill. It's softened for inside, but still not something you want to drink a lot or smell in the shower. Tested, safe.

Post# 363244 , Reply# 195   12/7/2016 at 09:23 (203 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
At the library I had two older gentlemen stop me and ask when they started making that car again, so I guess it was worth the work! Made my day! Yes they were like 80, but still, I was smiling. I have never owned a car this long before. I don't drive a lot, it's never left me stranded, love the looks and ride. Cheap to license and insure.

Post# 363246 , Reply# 196   12/7/2016 at 09:49 (203 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
Vacerator wrote:
Last water bill was $207.00. Highest ever. I don't want to think what could have been if I were an avid car washer.
How does that compare to your area? Most of that is sewage charge. We actually used less cubit feet of water than a year ago.
Three person household. Step son does take long showers, but I have 1.5 g.p.m. shower heads.
We had a large rate hike. Some places were hit worse.

I reply:
$207!!! Holy s&%t!!! That's almost TEN TIMES what my average water bill is! Mine usually runs somewhere between $23 and $27--for water, sewer, and garbage pickup--and I've NEVER seen it hit $30.

Post# 363253 , Reply# 197   12/7/2016 at 10:41 (203 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Oh our garbage is another high bill and its pre sorted for them, 3 cans!

Post# 363265 , Reply# 198   12/7/2016 at 12:35 (203 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

is your water bill for 90 days like here?

Post# 363268 , Reply# 199   12/7/2016 at 13:35 (203 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Ours is monthly!

Post# 363269 , Reply# 200   12/7/2016 at 14:09 (203 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
No, it's monthly.

Post# 363293 , Reply# 201   12/7/2016 at 23:10 (202 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        


$207 isn't too terrible for 90 days. My water, sewer & garbage bill is now $135/month in this one-horse town. I never exceed the minimum charge amount for water. When I moved into this house around 2004, it was $65. I don't know how they can justify that kind of a price hike.

Mine usually runs somewhere between $23 and $27--for water, sewer, and garbage pickup--and I've NEVER seen it hit $30.

That's more in line with what I consider reasonable and wouldn't mind paying. Places with bad infrastructures are obligated to raise water, sewer & garbage fees or pass bond issues to repair all the obsolete utilities. If I was younger, I'd sure get into that field....maybe as an civil inspector.




Post# 363311 , Reply# 202   12/8/2016 at 12:33 (202 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Yes well water can suck, but land lady loves the no bill. It's softened for inside, but still not something you want to drink a lot or smell in the shower. Tested, safe.


Well water is easily treated for odor & taste issues, but does require some additional equipment. Landlords usually take the stance however that if the water is safe to drink,  deal with Sounds like hydrogen sulfides?




Post# 363314 , Reply# 203   12/8/2016 at 14:14 (202 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        

First full 90 day water sewer bill here was 306 bucks. Shortly after when I got my first big refund from the interest credit I bought a nice HE top load washer.
Now bill is usually around 240-250. Old machine was using about 50 gallons a load, new machine uses about 8 average and is bigger.
My old rental water bill was around 30 bucks for 2 months and then a separate sewer bill that was added when the city forced everyone to hook up.
I wonder when the greedy sob's will realize their citizens don't have bottomless pockets.

Post# 363316 , Reply# 204   12/8/2016 at 15:30 (202 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

they haven't realized or cared thus far, so they never will. Like how our incomes dropped half for some last decade, and when they ran out of tax revenue, they had to hike taxes and utilities. Conservatives also did it.
I got an he washer in 2012.

Post# 363319 , Reply# 205   12/8/2016 at 19:09 (202 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Iron and manganese? Kevin. Twin big blue filters before the softener. Still not lovely. I have to change them, 3 a month too

Post# 363365 , Reply# 206   12/10/2016 at 00:47 (200 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

For taste issues you want carbon activated filters...not just filtering by microns. Maybe one of those is carbon, you'd know.  I'd sure do some heavy research on what's currently out there for iron and manganese treatment. Yeah, changing the filters all the time is a real hassle. I just read an article about this as it's a big problem in Pennslyvania. One of the newer treatment processes is catalytic carbon filters and backwashing. I've never had this problem with a customer...iron yes(sulfides), manganese no.


There's almost always a solution to these things, but sometimes the maintenance is a real hassle. Sorry about the print change, I'm too tired to see why it's doing




Post# 363372 , Reply# 207   12/10/2016 at 08:18 (200 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
No worry, thanks for the info. It's not bad with the new softener and filters, they were an addition. just big and heavy and wet to change so much.

Post# 363469 , Reply# 208   12/12/2016 at 12:11 (198 days old) by electrikbroomgu (Rome, NY)        
1987 Olds Cutlass

electrikbroomgu's profile picture
One of my all time favorites since I was a kid are the G-body mid size GM personal luxury coupes. I grew up with these types of cars and owned many over the years. One of my favorites is the Cutlass Supreme. I just found this clean example with only 26K on the clock about 2 hours from me this past Summer. I absolutely love it! Rides like a dream. Handles really well with the optional GM F-41 suspension upgrade. It has the rally gauge cluster, bucket seats and floor shifter and the bullet proof Olds 307 V8 with 4 speed overdrive automatic. Judging by the thumbs up and compliments others seem to like the color combo too. She is now sleeping for the Winter slumber and will re-awaken at the end of April.

  View Full Size
Post# 363475 , Reply# 209   12/12/2016 at 14:30 (198 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        
Beautiful car

human's profile picture
I've always liked that body style Cutlass with a two-tone paint job. It really sets off the lines nicely. And that dark/light jade stone green is especially pretty, simultaneously sporty and sophisticated. My dad was still working for Oldsmobile back then and he said the two-tones sold especially well in the Northeast but we seldom saw them down here in the South. Most of the Cutlass coupes of that era sold down here had the vinyl landau roof treatments, of which I was never particularly fond. The cross-laced alloy wheels are a nice touch also. I had those on my '91 Cutlass Supreme coupe (FWD W-body) and later on my '95 Pontiac Bonneville.

Post# 363478 , Reply# 210   12/12/2016 at 15:04 (198 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
I had

a dark maple red and claret red '85 Cutlass Supreme brougham V8.

Post# 363489 , Reply# 211   12/12/2016 at 19:43 (198 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I had a gorgeous 82 Cutlass Supreme Brougham, light and dark gray, mom loved it too, loaded and comfy, slow! It was only here a year, it was a lemon I am afraid. Pretty car, wish my PA rode like that did, or maybe it did and my body wasn't as fussy then

Post# 363500 , Reply# 212   12/13/2016 at 07:12 (197 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Yes David,

I drove a friends '82 with the 260 V8 and it had no power. The paint job was awefull also. The shocks were too mushy. It rode well on a smooth road, but hopped on bumps like a boat on choppy water.

Post# 363503 , Reply# 213   12/13/2016 at 08:25 (197 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Ahh, mine was the 231, 125 hp I think and it drank oil. It was a year old when I got it, always wondered if it was a lemon or mistreated?

Post# 363514 , Reply# 214   12/13/2016 at 12:03 (197 days old) by electrikbroomgu (Rome, NY)        
1982 Cutlass

electrikbroomgu's profile picture
My mom had a light green 82 Cutlass also with the Buick 231 engine. She got it with 30,000 miles and it was in beautiful shape. It never used oil until around 100K but that was traced out to leaky valve cover gaskets. It was always very reliable and mom loved that car. The base suspensions on these were like most other American made cars of the time. Soft and ride oriented. They did offer upgraded suspensions and tires on all of these however and mine has both and combined go a long way to curing the flabby suspension

Post# 363524 , Reply# 215   12/13/2016 at 15:02 (197 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
That old 231 Buick V6

still had old tolerances, and they did use some oil. The 2 barrel carburetor hesitated on left turns, and they were notorious for spinning crank shaft bearings.
The later version got fuel injection, roller valve cam followers, and was greatly improved, but still not perfect.

Post# 363536 , Reply# 216   12/13/2016 at 18:28 (197 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        
231 V6

human's profile picture
The 231 V6 had a long and storied run both with GM and briefly with AMC. Originally developed in the early '60s, it was a V6 version of Buick's Fireball V8. They made the V6 version literally by shearing off two cylinders, which gave it an unusual firing order for a V6 resulting in a somewhat rough idle. This was eventually corrected in the late '70s. Tooling and production of the engine was sold off to American Motors in 1967 at the height of the muscle car era but GM bought it back in '74 when consumer focus shifted to fuel economy. GM originally wanted just to buy the finished engines from AMC the unit cost was going to be too high so they just bought every back and began manufacturing the engine again in-house. The engine eventually evolved into the 3800 V6, gaining not only multi-port fuel injection but a supercharger option as well. That would be the engine in your Park Avenue, David. The 3800 ended its run in 2008 when the plant that built it was closed down.

Post# 363539 , Reply# 217   12/13/2016 at 19:23 (197 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
That 82 was the newer one after the odd fire one in my 76 Century. The 82 was under warranty and they offered to replace/ rebuild the heads at 20,000 miles I think it was?It got traded off.

Post# 363576 , Reply# 218   12/14/2016 at 07:04 (196 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Last cast iron block

GM engine.
There was also a mid 80's Buick 3.3 Litre 3300 90 degree banked V6 that Grand Am's, Olds Calais, and Buick Sommerset's had as an option over the 2.5 litre Iron Duke 4. I think maybe also in the 6000's, Ciera's, and Century's.

Post# 363582 , Reply# 219   12/14/2016 at 10:00 (196 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
If I recall 3 Liter too! Saw one in an early front drive PA and Cutlass Ciera

Post# 363584 , Reply# 220   12/14/2016 at 10:18 (196 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Yes, 3 litre also David

in Olds Acieva, Skylark also.

Post# 363606 , Reply# 221   12/14/2016 at 14:55 (196 days old) by electrikbroomgu (Rome, NY)        
3300 and 3800

electrikbroomgu's profile picture
I have seen many 3300 and 3800 Buick V6's with 300-400K miles that still run as new. My friend is co-owner of a small dealership that sells loads of these cars and high miles is the norm. The Series II 3800 did have the upper plastic intake manifold issue but once that is corrected and replaced these mills are usually good for a load of miles.

Post# 363609 , Reply# 222   12/14/2016 at 15:40 (196 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I used to manage a quick lube, true they did rack up the miles!

Post# 363650 , Reply# 223   12/15/2016 at 12:36 (195 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
I had the 3.0 liter, 2bbl carb variant in an '84 Buick Century. Probably one of the last carbureted engines GM made.

Post# 363979 , Reply# 224   12/21/2016 at 14:22 (189 days old) by electrikbroomgu (Rome, NY)        
Last GM carbureted engine

electrikbroomgu's profile picture
To my knowledge was the 1990 Oldsmobile 307 4BBL V8 as in the Full size B-body station wagons and the Cadillac Brougham. The Buick 3.0 2BBL V6 lasted until 1985 and was succeeded by the Chevy made 2.8 2BBL for the 1986 model year. We worked on many mid to late 1980's Honda's with carburetors and a few Mazda's too.

Post# 363985 , Reply# 225   12/21/2016 at 16:33 (189 days old) by kenkart (Mocksville, NC)        
I remember

A guy in my hometown that had one of those early 80s Cutlasses with the 260, He took it out and put in a 403 out of a late 70s 98 and boy would it go then!!

Post# 364010 , Reply# 226   12/21/2016 at 22:18 (188 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I thought that 260 looked choked with that half quad

Post# 364022 , Reply# 227   12/22/2016 at 07:27 (188 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
They were choked

David. My '77 Pontiac GP has the 301 with the half quad. It tries to suck in more air when you floor it, but well, it's choked.
Fuel economy was the word of the year back then, because the cars were still heavy. Secondaries only engage when you floor it anyhow.
They did the half quad because the primaries were smaller venturies than the two barrel Rochester carb.
I pulled the carb off once, to see if the manifold had four holes. It doesn't.

Post# 364024 , Reply# 228   12/22/2016 at 08:10 (188 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I assumed that! My dad had a 76 Ventura with that motor, always wanted a 4 brl and duals to see if it could pass something then! It was fine at lower speeds, actually was a really good car, nothing broke, ever.

Post# 364037 , Reply# 229   12/22/2016 at 12:59 (188 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Wow David,

my ex had a '78 Phoenix, but he ordered the V6, and it spun a bearing then seized up because he fell asleep drunk with the engine running and it overheated. He passed out next to the front of the car. I should have done a 180 degree spin and ran, but hindsight is 20/20. A former life, live and learn. He was a GM shop rat. We dropped a 260 in it, and it ran another few years until the dimmer switch shorted and the car burned up. His mom had a '79 with a Chev.305, an no troubles either.
Willow Run assembly turned out some good cars back in the day.
My partner is great now. 23 years we're together.

Post# 364046 , Reply# 230   12/22/2016 at 16:05 (188 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
That 260 felt like the power of the v6, but it was smooth

Post# 364050 , Reply# 231   12/22/2016 at 16:21 (188 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
You're right about that. My sister had a '78 Cutlass Supreme with a 260 and its performance was pretty anemic, even compared to my '77 Buick Skylark that had a 231 V6.

Post# 364058 , Reply# 232   12/22/2016 at 18:58 (188 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

yes! An Oldsmobile V8 hallmark. The low 2:29 or 2:56 to 1 rear axle ratio didn't help either.
I never drove one with a 3:08, but even the 301 or the 305 V8's with a 2:56 had enough power.
Once those old 231 V6's were broken in, you could feel the roughness of the engine in the gas pedal.

Post# 364069 , Reply# 233   12/22/2016 at 20:38 (187 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I would guess, just a gut feel it was around 135 hp

Post# 364072 , Reply# 234   12/22/2016 at 21:59 (187 days old) by dartman (Portland OR)        
Spread bore carbs

The spread bore carbs were developed to help drivability, fuel economy, and emissions. Carter made the Thermo Quad and GM had the Quadra Jet. Very small primaries and huge secondaries. If either is setup properly the car will pull smoother, get a bit better mpg, and emissions should be better. The old square bore carbs the primary bores were slightly smaller then the secondaries and MPG and emissions were not a concern when they were designed in the fifties and sixties.
I run a ThermoQuad on my Dart and it is the smoothest, best pulling carb I ever have had. I tried a Holley, AFB, AVS, and I tuned all of them the best I could and the TQ is the best of them for me. The spread bore was the most advanced design of carb Americans came up with but most of their runs they were smogged out to death, tied to early horrible emission based computer control and severely locked down as far as adjustability.
Early ones can be tuned very well if you can find a strip kit for it. I have them for the AFB, AVS, and TQ. You have to use a intake designed to use them, most aftermarket later ones can use square bore or spread bore carbs interchangeably. Otherwise you use what the car came with but they did make adapters that sorta worked.
Test drove a ram charger suv that had a 2bbl to 4bbl adapter on it and a small holley. Had to be horribly in efficient and choked down. It did seem to run ok though.

Post# 364082 , Reply# 235   12/23/2016 at 05:59 (187 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

was 145 for a 4 barrel 305 in 1986.
Torque was decent, or maybe it was the 200 R4 transmission, but that first to second gear shift was abrupt at over half throttle.

Ford used a variable venturi carburetor with computer mixture control but it did not work as well as a Quadrajet with computer mixture control.

Post# 364088 , Reply# 236   12/23/2016 at 09:55 (187 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I was guessing on the hp of the 260

Post# 364097 , Reply# 237   12/23/2016 at 13:16 (187 days old) by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        

the 260 only gave 105 H.P.

Post# 364098 , Reply# 238   12/23/2016 at 13:22 (187 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
wow, I think the odd fire 231 was that too. must have had more torque

Post# 364289 , Reply# 239   12/28/2016 at 23:01 (181 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Matt, almost son and I replaced the front strut assemblies today on the Buick, wow what was I waiting for?? I had done strut cartridges 11 years ago, but still had a noise, and over time the ride was not SMOOTH. It sits over an inch taller in front now!! Looks like tie rod ends are a bit worn too, so check those and align now. It drives like a different car, like I remember it. He also fixed a fading display on the climate control 4 resisters loose and cooked ends. Wow, it lights up and even listens to the commands. So glad he took a week off!!!!! Love that car again. That kid has talent, kid 47! He moved into my house at 18, wish I could call him mine and say he inherited that talent and brains. Brad his son does call me grandpa, at 60 I can handle that fine!

Post# 364318 , Reply# 240   12/29/2016 at 14:45 (181 days old) by Opelgtkarl (Kirkland, Washington)        
Mine will forever be...

opelgtkarl's profile picture
The 1977 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am SE with the 6.6 liter V8, hog leg 5 speed transmission, and in black and gold like the bandit car

  View Full Size
Post# 364326 , Reply# 241   12/29/2016 at 16:02 (181 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

I can't tell you how many of those variants I've seen; primer-ed, Bondo, missing the trunk lock, parked in the front lawn and waiting for the next bank



Post# 365734 , Reply# 242   1/27/2017 at 22:07 by Luxkid1980 (Richmond, Virginia)        

I love my 2008 Mercury Grand Marquis. Its a big, heavy car compared to other sedans sold now and very comfortable to drive on trips. Cheap to maintain too! I'm not sure which cars would be comparable now as rear wheel drive sedans are far and few between.

Post# 365744 , Reply# 243   1/28/2017 at 08:30 by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
There are none made today

comparable to the Panther platform Ford, Mercury, and Lincolns discontinued in 2011.
They had full perimeter frames and separately mounted bodies.
All passenger cars today are unibody construction.
If you want a V8 sedan, you have to buy a Genesis, Lexus, BMW, Jaguar, Mercedes, Rolls or a Bentley.
Closest to them from Ford would be an Expedition, or Navigator.
Crown Vic's, Grand Marquis, and Town cars are now old school.

Post# 365747 , Reply# 244   1/28/2017 at 09:27 by human (Pines of Carolina)        
Ford's Panther Platform...

human's profile picture
...was a holdover from the '70s, literally. It was already 'old school' when it was still being manufactured. Law enforcement fleet sales kept it going, long after it logically should have been replaced, but it created economies of scale to enable them to be produced affordably for the consumer market. GM killed off its comparable platform, which included the Chevy Caprice/Impala, Buick Roadmaster and Cadillac Brougham in 1996 to free up production capacity for more profitable full size SUV's like the Suburban and Escalade.

Post# 365752 , Reply# 245   1/28/2017 at 14:01 by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Yes Edgar, I also forgot the Audi 8 V8,and VW Paheton

I have looked for side by side photos of the Panther frame and the prior Gran Torino/Cougar/Montego/LTD II frame, but haven't been able to verify they are identical. The wheelbase is 116 inches for both.
The GM B body frame after 1976 is also 116 inches, but not the same exactly as the 1973 through 1977 A body special coupe, sedan, and wagon frame that also was.
Chevelle coupes, LeMans, Cutlass and Century/Regal's had a 112 inch W.B., sedans, Monte Carlo and Grand Prix, and wagons 116 inches.
These frames had a hollow center section with no inner rail. The 1977 B body frame does. Ford frames always had one. The GM A body frame prior to 1973 did have.
The main difference between Ford and the GM rear drive body on frame design was that the steering gear on GM's was in front of the engine main cross member, and behind it on Fords. The other was the fuel tank mounting. Below the trunk on GM's, between the rear axle and trunk pan on Fords. Except station wagons. The GM wagon tank was behind the drivers side quarter panel area. The Fords had the deep well trunk.

Post# 365762 , Reply# 246   1/28/2017 at 19:52 by cuffs054 (monticello, ga)        

And speaking of the GM wagon tank. Kid next store turns 16 and dad gives him the family Buick Sport Wagon which was in great shape. Johnnie drives it for a while and tells dad that he thinks it has a leak and water is collecting in the drivers side rear panel. Dad gets drill and the rest is history.

Post# 365765 , Reply# 247   1/28/2017 at 20:44 by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
Oh yeah that was the standard fix. I remember helping my grandfather do that to his '76 Olds Custom Cruiser wagon when water was collecting in the cargo well just inside the tailgate. A couple of holes at the lowest point was all it took. That was one massively huge vehicle.

Post# 365782 , Reply# 248   1/29/2017 at 08:13 by Luxkid1980 (Richmond, Virginia)        

Nice video of the last Crown Victoria being built and coming off the assembly line:

Post# 365808 , Reply# 249   1/29/2017 at 13:14 by cuffs054 (monticello, ga)        

Actually it wasn't water. It was the gas tank. Surprise! Good thing dad had already taken delivery and the new Regal.

Post# 366162 , Reply# 250   2/4/2017 at 22:08 by dustin (Jackson, MI)        

dustin's profile picture
I have a 2004 Prius and love it. Mine has nearly 200,000 miles on it and runs like new. I haven't had a single problem with it in 10 months/20,000 miles. Going to need some exhaust work in the spring though, starting to get a bit noisy. Oil changes every 5000 miles and gas when it needs some. I've found it to be a pretty enjoyable car to drive, comfortable, pretty quick for what it is and very economical to drive. 50 mpg in the summer without too much trouble, around 45 average. 35-40 in the winter. I don't drive gently, but I don't beat on it too bad. Not unusual for me to floor it when merging onto the highway and it doesn't mind a bit. It has a tiny 1.5 liter 4 cylinder engine, along with an electric motor powered by a 200 some volt battery, feeding into a CVT transmission. Not a "fast" car but will do 0-60 in less than 10 seconds and 30-60 very quickly. I will definitely be buying another Prius when (if) I wear this one out. Actually how I got the car- original owner traded it in on a new Prius. It's very high tech for a 13 year old car, mine has the smart key and standard touch screen, but Bluetooth, navigation, and a backup camera were options.

Post# 372022 , Reply# 251   5/10/2017 at 22:02 by cocobird5 (Laguna Hills)        

My first car was a 64 Dodge Dart, and gas was 35 cents a gallon. I sold it when I moved across the country. My first California car was a Studebaker Lark. Loved that car. My dream car is a 64 MG.

Post# 372053 , Reply# 252   5/11/2017 at 18:39 by thermokid (Casper, Wyoming)        
Favorite Car

was my 1988 Ford Crown Victoria Country Squire station wagon; I loved that car I let my then roomate use It when I got my new Chevy Lumina LTZ. But he literally ran it into the ground. Sold it for $100 bucks I cried when he drove it away.I sure wish they still made big station wagons.I could haul a lot of vacuums in that car. But now I love my 2011 Buick Lucerne Super Series.I plan on driving that for the rest of my life since they don't make a Lucerne anymore. 2011 was the last year for that model...I hope it lasts 20 years. It has 33400 miles on it now.....

Post# 372062 , Reply# 253   5/12/2017 at 01:42 by kenkart (Mocksville, NC)        
Im driving a 2003

Grand Marquis LS, Nothing like rear wheel drive and v8 power....26 mpg on a trip suits me just fine.

Post# 372065 , Reply# 254   5/12/2017 at 05:08 by S31463221 (Frenchburg, KY)        

s31463221's profile picture
I had a 2003 Crown Victoria that I practically drove the wheels off of! When I sold it, the car had well over 200,000 miles and was still going strong! People were shocked at the decent gas mileage it got as well, I guess that wasn't expected from such a big car! I still have a big body Ford/Lincoln that I drive on occasion, and while it doesn't NEARLY get the gas mileage of my 03, you simply CANNOT beat the ride or comfort of it! It's literally like floating down the highway on the most comfortable living room couch you could imagine! That would be my 78 Continental Town Car!

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 6         View Full Size
Post# 372083 , Reply# 255   5/12/2017 at 15:26 by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
My dad had a '72 Lincoln Town Car and then a '78 Town Car with the oval opera windows and red velvet cloth interior. I loved driving that car. Like you say, it was like floating down the highway....never felt a bump and there was room to sit 6 adults comfortably along with all their luggage.


Post# 372131 , Reply# 256   5/13/2017 at 14:34 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

We had a '67 Lincoln blue, white top, saddle leather interior. One guy in the Midwest who could work on the top hydraulics stuck one time straight up in the air with me as a


I consider THAT a premium touring car of American heritage. It had enough vacuum lines under the hood to probably stretch across the state.  Fortunately, I didn't have to work on that car as it was leased. Suicide doors, of course...trunk lifted up and the whole top disappeared into it.....on a good day.



Post# 372167 , Reply# 257   5/14/2017 at 14:30 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Just for curiosity sake....I trolled the Net for '67 Lincoln convertibles. They range from about (drivable and licensable) $10,000-$69,000. Obviously, there are some really delusional owners out there. One seller bragged about a complete restoration which to me, is stripping the car to its frame, putting the frame on a car rotisserie and rebuilding the whole car. This was not even close to being done, yet the huge price tag. In the photos, I could see things that weren't restored.


And nobody said anything about rebuilding/updating the motor...the very heart of the car. You've got the heaviest production convertible ever made (over 5,700lbs) and no mention of the engine/drivetrain that moves it around. The people that buy these must not be too picky.....just looking for the flash/bling of this old car I guess.



Post# 373091 , Reply# 258   6/2/2017 at 00:39 by AmyOlson (Ellijay)        

Mine is 1956 Desoto Adventurer.

Post# 373104 , Reply# 259   6/2/2017 at 12:00 by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
convertables of any

make and model are more valuable. The hard top sedan lincolns can be had for much less.
A neighbor has a 1967 coupe. His wife keeps pestering him to sell it. I'd say it's almost in perfect condition.
The thing with a classic, is something always needs work. Why? Well, the same as us when we are 60 plus years of age.

Post# 373109 , Reply# 260   6/2/2017 at 13:38 by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
I'd bet the wife is one of those people--of whom there are many--who see cars merely as disposable appliances that should be sent to the junkyard as a matter of course once they reach a certain age. For the record, I am not one of those people.

Post# 373114 , Reply# 261   6/2/2017 at 15:06 by s31463221 (Frenchburg, KY)        

s31463221's profile picture
That's EXACTLY how my wife sees them! I have a beautiful (in my opinion) 1978 Lincoln Continental Town Car that used to belong to a friend of mine who is deceased now, and she absolutely HATES it! She refuses to ride in it, or even be seen in it! I LOVE driving it personally, it's huge, comfortable, and I feel safe in it! OH well, I guess that's how it goes sometimes.....she's about the same way with a vacuum in all honesty. If it were up to her, she would go buy the cheapest thing she could find from a big box store, run it until it dies, then pitch it......she cringes every time I pull out one of my Electrolux XXX's to vacuum with....and I can't explain to her that just because it's old doesn't mean it's not usable!

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 373137 , Reply# 262   6/3/2017 at 08:04 by Luxkid1980 (Richmond, Virginia)        

That's a great looking Lincoln Continental! They definitely don't make cars like that anymore. When I have to eventually get rid of my Grand Marquis, I'm not sure which vehicle I would get to replace it. I love that everything on the Mercury engine for the most part is easily accessible, unlike the Honda accord I had before. Nothing on that car was accessible, things like the starter were a pain in the a$$ to replace.

I agree Edgar, just because its older looking, doesn't mean it doesn't drive well (or clean well in the case of your Electrolux XXX) and a pleasure to use. Some folks just don't get it! :)

Post# 373138 , Reply# 263   6/3/2017 at 08:18 by rugsucker (Elizabethton TN)        
Licoln Continental Town Car with--

--the most unique power vent windows ever!

Post# 373140 , Reply# 264   6/3/2017 at 09:15 by S31463221 (Frenchburg, KY)        
Power Vent Windows

s31463221's profile picture

You're not kidding that they're unique! They're also a real pain in the a$$ when they decide to go "haywire" as my dad used to say! My drivers' side window literally dropped down inside the door once when it came off track! The shop had to take the door panel off and spend a good while fishing that stupid window out and getting it back on track! It works again now, but I'm extremely cautious opening my window these days!!

Post# 373203 , Reply# 265   6/4/2017 at 10:10 by countryford (Phoenix, AZ)        

countryford's profile picture
The 1948 Tucker is my absolute favorite. Alas, since they only made 51 of them, I doubt I'll ever get the opportunity to own one. I was able to sit inside of one, earlier this year. I was volunteering at an auction where one was being sold. I was able to sit inside of it.

The next car on my list and one that I will one day own, is a 1959 Cadillac Fleetwood. Hopefully I will have one, within the next 5-10 years.

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 4         View Full Size
Post# 373238 , Reply# 266   6/5/2017 at 00:38 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
True that....

convertibles/roadsters sell more than hardtops. But If I was gonna buy an old Lincoln from around '67, it would most definitely be the convertible.

The Tucker car is a fascinating piece of history cut from the same cloth as Howard Hughes being brought before a Grand Jury.

Whenever I get down, I pop in the movie with Jeff Bridges. I don't know how factual it is, but what a great ride (pun intended)!

Talk about rare, I never knew anyone to actually have one to see or ride in.....and I used to know a LOT of car people...most of them well-heeled enough back in the day to own/restore one. What did that one sell for at auction and was it fully restored (like in the pic you posted)?


Post# 373244 , Reply# 267   6/5/2017 at 09:37 by countryford (Phoenix, AZ)        

countryford's profile picture
It was the fourth Tucker that I have had the pleasure to see in person. But the first that I was able to touch and sit in. It was not restored but still in decent condition. The paint was pealing on it. The color was the same color as the one I posted but not in as nice of condition. It ended up selling for $1,347,500.

At that auction that I volunteered at, I was able to sit and even drive some very nice cars. 1920's on up. The auction was inside a building. There was a parking garage next to the building, with an alleyway in between. A volunteer would drive the car up to the alleyway where an auction employee would take over and then drive it onto the auction block. After the auction was completed the employee would drive it back into the alleyway where a volunteer would then drive it into the parking garage and park it. I was one of the volunteers who was parking the vehicles. Included is a link to the auction and what vehicles were there and what they went for. I wasn't able to drive every single one of these, but I did drive quite a few of them.

CLICK HERE TO GO TO countryford's LINK

Post# 373247 , Reply# 268   6/5/2017 at 10:35 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

I figured that Tucker might have gone for around a million....just so rare and wonderful provenance-the car itself.

A lot of hype in those auctions and you give up a lot in commissions. Still, if you want a sure bet at selling your car for high dollars.....

I figure if I had back that new '70 Hemi 'cuda I might float close to a million or at least hundreds of thousands.

Looks like if I want that '67 Lincoln convertible, I better move on it!

I just don't understand where all these deep pockets are coming from in these times. Must be the 'despicable' one percenters.


Post# 373249 , Reply# 269   6/5/2017 at 10:49 by wyaple (Pickerington, OH)        
I'm A Performance Guy So...

wyaple's profile picture
Here's some pics of my 2017 BMW 340i M-Sport RWD. Think zero to 60 in the mid four second range, BUT I have logged 40 MPG at 72 MPH using cruise control. I know the interior colors aren't everyone's cup of tea; however, I found that a pure black interior gets far too hot inside during the summer months.


  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 7         View Full Size
Post# 373252 , Reply# 270   6/5/2017 at 11:04 by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        
I like a lot of different types of cars.

gottahaveahoove's profile picture
Great BMW, too.
But the Lincoln Continental is a 'handsome looking car', indeed.
They, and their Cadillac counterparts screamed "I'm AN AMERICAN CAR"!

Post# 373266 , Reply# 271   6/5/2017 at 17:15 by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Still love my big old beast, even after 13 years

Post# 373293 , Reply# 272   6/5/2017 at 23:58 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
I gave up.....

on my need for speed. When I had money, it was a doable thing. But with the last XKE, I had $38,000 into a restoration and the car wasn't close to being done. Turned out the restoration house owner was a cokehead and a thief. There were some upscale prominent St Louis businessmen who got taken too. But they were so embarrassed by it all, they declined to file with the attorney general like I wanted to.

So now, my interest would be something HUGE and classic the '67 Lincoln which might be somewhat attainable in non-restored form. Collectors with deep pockets have driven car prices to insane levels. Pretty soon these cars I grew up owning/driving will just be a fond memory.


Post# 373327 , Reply# 273   6/6/2017 at 10:57 by countryford (Phoenix, AZ)        

countryford's profile picture

I know the interior colors aren't everyone's cup of tea; however, I found that a pure black interior gets far too hot inside during the summer months.


I don't mind a black or a gray interior but am not a fan of tan. Unfortunately those are the interior colors available. Is white an option on any new car? I know you could get blue, red, green, yellow or various shades of them, at one time. Not anymore. :(

Post# 373433 , Reply# 274   6/7/2017 at 22:06 by cb123 (Mobile, Al.)        

cb123's profile picture

Here's just a few.

Post# 373551 , Reply# 275   6/9/2017 at 19:39 by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        

gottahaveahoove's profile picture
HOW could you NOT admire them?

Post# 373564 , Reply# 276   6/9/2017 at 22:45 by cb123 (Mobile, Al.)        

cb123's profile picture

Here's another one.

Post# 373591 , Reply# 277   6/10/2017 at 09:23 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

are the days though when you could find one of these cars, throw some wax & new wheels on, tinker/rebuild the motor and away you go. Often now they are the pursuit of a collector over his lifetime. I've got too many interests to give that much time to one thing.....


Post# 373712 , Reply# 278   6/12/2017 at 11:36 by luxkid1980 (Richmond, Virginia)        

I went to the Smithsonian's Museum of American History in D.C. this past weekend and they had one of the Tucker automobiles on display. It sure was a beautiful vehicle!

Post# 373917 , Reply# 279   6/15/2017 at 03:04 by camelotshadow (Valley Village)        

I had a white w blue stripe 1970 Trams Am with the hi comp dor almot 20 years before I sold her.

I still have a 88 Volvo 740 GLE...they run forever & a beast MB
1983 Euro 500 Sec Mercedes...a coupe!!! in maganese brown...Problem is I have been sick & last few times she did not pass the smog so I have her stored..

Dad had a 56 Buick Special in matt brown & I hated to ride in it as a child.
We had a Covair too with a blown head gasket..LOL

My brother had a 67 GTO & a Pontiac I can't remember year...62 ish which had a special big engine.

Grew up watching my uncle fix his old Pontiac Bonneville...

I have worked on my cars but not lately..not much lately as I'm doing chemo now...

  View Full Size
Post# 373920 , Reply# 280   6/15/2017 at 04:58 by S31463221 (Frenchburg, KY)        
56 Special

s31463221's profile picture

I'm said your dad had a 56 Special and you hated to ride in it....was something wrong with the car that made it ride bad? I have a 54 Special that rides like it's floating on a cloud. Aside from no power steering, when you get moving, it's an absolute dream to drive, and a super smooth comfortable ride! A 56 Buick is actually on my bucket list of cars to own!!

Post# 373921 , Reply# 281   6/15/2017 at 06:00 by camelotshadow (Valley Village)        

I guess it did no have power steering but it might have had good brakes. I can't remember how it rode. I'm not sure where my Dad got the car but it was about 12 years old at the time & I thought it was big & ugly. Also the paint was very faded & it was a ugly brown.
I hated Rolls Royces too so I guess I had bad taste as a child!!!!

It was a 56 Special...remember that! Built like a tank!

Post# 373927 , Reply# 282   6/15/2017 at 08:03 by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Christine, Love your 560 SEC

I wish you well on your recovery! I am also 57. A friend our age passed away last week asleep in her recliner at home all alone.
Our son is out your way this week for the video game convention. A nephew lives in Burbank and works at Insomniac games.
He is living his dream. He left Champaign/Urbana Illinois to move there.

Post# 374015 , Reply# 283   6/16/2017 at 03:06 by camelotshadow (Valley Village)        

Thanks...ITs a 500 SEC imported from Germany by a Dr who had it converted to somewhat US standards but it has I think different heads in the engine as its the european model not one made for US. It still has the euro bumpers & the triangle warning signal in the trunk & the fire extinguisher. The Dr donated it to charity
& a guy who sold cars a few miles away had it listed on ebay. I found the ad also in craigslist & contacted him directly & snatched out of ebay & the bidders hands.

Really snazzy great driving car but being sick I have not driven in a few years so its sitting unused poor thing.

560 SEC were I think from 86 on ^ this one is a 1983 gray market.

Post# 374087 , Reply# 284   6/17/2017 at 17:08 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Gray market Benzes are problematic to get some parts for....especially motor parts. Often you have to deal with someone in Germany. Canada is awash in gray market Benz cars. If they are 25 yrs or older however, you have to do nothing to comply with US emissions or crash related compliance issues.

The 500E and the E500 are very famous for being corporate type rocket ships. A good representative '92 500E can go from stop to 165mph in about 45 secs. If you want faster than that, get the Ford GT. But the insides of the 500E500's are gorgeous. With all the goodies, they often retailed well over $100,000 in 90's dollars.

The good ones left still bring between $25,000-$45,000.


Post# 374105 , Reply# 285   6/18/2017 at 03:16 by camelotshadow (Valley Village)        

Mine was built to do 160 mph for hours on the autobohn but not sure in how many sec it would get there from 0. Once I hit the cruise control by mistake & it too off like a rocket but luckliy the brake overroad it...

Engine parts...sure some of them would be special order.

My trusty MB mech retired. Not many of the new ones know the 80's cars.

Euroa are a pain with the CA smog emissions reg being so tight.

Post# 374127 , Reply# 286   6/18/2017 at 16:14 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

I can tell you that it wouldn't be close in acceleration to the 500E500. They were purpose built AMG rockets with all kinds of speed goodies. They were the first corporate type cruisers to accelerate like that...they were in all the auto rags at that time. Yours is too heavy/bloated but well apportioned and like most of the Benz cars of the 80's/90's it was meant to cruise on the Autobahn. It wasn't made to cruise @160mph for hrs either....more like 140mph if you're being honest. There's top speed and top cruise speed...many mix the two up while bragging.


Post# 374199 , Reply# 287   6/20/2017 at 05:15 by camelotshadow (Valley Village)        

I've never been close to its top end & I just looked up some of the stock engines & 140 is probably right. I was going on what someone told me about the car & they are no longer with us but guess they were wrong or I remembered worng. 140 or 160 are off the charts as speed limits are more than half that.

AMG's would be nice to own. Right now I am on cancer drugs & can't even drive so a sports car is of no use to me.

I have a classic mercedes euro coupe just sitting which is not good but I am sick & it won;t pass smog & I have no money to fix it. Can't drive it anyway.

E500 was a well built car...too bad it looks just like a SEL.

Post# 374202 , Reply# 288   6/20/2017 at 08:27 by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Sorry to hear about your health issues. I have two '92 300TE station wagons. Both I have had @140mph for short duration. A lot of it depends on what final drive ratio you have. The estates have a spirited rear end (numerically high) so that you have plenty of pep from the stoplights with loads. The 400E and 500E have numerically low rear ends for high speed cruising and V-8's.  The problem with the W124's is that they are basically small cars. I feel I have plenty of room in my estates, but when I get into a W124 coupe or sedan, I feel cramped. I'd much prefer a W126 of the same vintage, much like yours.


Your car is a wonderful combination of coupe styling, size and luxury appointments. There's one on eBay right now starting at about $5,000. eBays motors isn't really an accurate accounting of how these cars sell on the open market, but they do give you choices you don't often see in the real world.



Post# 374257 , Reply# 289   6/21/2017 at 13:00 by compactc9guy (Bathurst New Brunswick Canada )        

compactc9guy's profile picture
To me they are many cars i love mainly the 1986 Mercury Lynx L my mother had loved that thing i detail it so many times also my grand ma pontiac 6000 LE that thing wasa couch on weels on day i hope to have a 1972 Pontiac Grand Prix SJ 455 my neigh-board had one but sold it fiberglass body modify a bit or a Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado . I once drove 2016 Chrysler 300 C platinum what a ride and how could i forget the devilles or town cars yes i love old boats almost bought a 77 monte carlo at one point

  Photos...       <              >      Photo 1 of 5         View Full Size

Forum Index:       Other Forums:                      

Comes to the Rescue!

Woops, Time to Check the Bag!!!
Either you need to change your vacuum bag or you forgot to LOG-IN?

Discuss-O-MAT Log-In

New Members
Click Here To Sign Up.


Vacuumland home
Discuss-o-Vac Forums
Vintage Brochures, Service and Owners Manuals
Today's Vacuum of the Day
Photos of our Collections
Vintage Vacuum Cleaner to sell?
Technical/service questions?
Looking for Parts?
Website related questions?
Digital Millennium Copyright Act Policy
Our Privacy Policy