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Thread Number: 15380
Bagged or Bagless ? |
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| Post# 163420 12/27/2011 at 02:26 (4,504 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
I suspect I may be opening a can of worms here, but oh well!
In my opinion - Bagged is Best! Pros: Better Filtration without the need of countless filters Super easy maintenance Looks better (I like a nice "slab front" cleaner, and can't stand the curving fronts the bagless ones have to have) Cons: You have to spend money on bags And for Bagless... Pros: You don't have to spend money on bags regularly When the filters are freshly changed and the bin is empty, the suction is very good Cons: The filters wear out a lot quicker than on a bagged cleaner, so you have to spend money on them After a few uses the suction decreases rapidly If you don't change the filters and empty the bin regularly the motor gets a lot more wear I'd love to hear your opinions though! | ||
| Post# 163421 , Reply# 1 12/27/2011 at 03:02 (4,504 days old) by Blackheart (North Dakota) | ||
I'm a bag guy
I've used all sorts of bagged and bagless machines i find that bagged machines typically have better airflow and are just generally less messy to empty, i think Electrolux has the best bag system you just open the cover pull it out toss in a new one and close the machine, the oreck uprights are pretty easy too.
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| Post# 163422 , Reply# 2 12/27/2011 at 03:11 (4,504 days old) by SuctionSelector (Leeds, England) | ||
jmurray01
Well. Hmm, I like bagged and bagless.
Bagged because you don't have to replace any filters(some bagged) because when you throw away the bags they have the filters built in. However bagless is good because you don't have to buy bags. But, many bagless vacuums such as Vax, Panasonic, Tesco, aren't as good as others like Dyson. However when you said "After a few uses suction decreases rapidly", that is not true to be said of other machines. I used my 17 year old Dyson DC01 to clean the house, and that maintained the same amount of suction through each room/area. Thats my opinion. Jacob | ||
| Post# 163423 , Reply# 3 12/27/2011 at 04:01 (4,504 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 163424 , Reply# 4 12/27/2011 at 04:04 (4,504 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 163426 , Reply# 6 12/27/2011 at 04:32 (4,504 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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Well actually, people think a bagless cleaner will be cheaper because they won't need to buy bags any longer, but they will still have to spend money on new filters every 6 months!
I know the manuals say to wash them and they'll be fine for the lifetime of the cleaner, but unless the cleaner dies after 6 months (which some do, and that is how they get away with saying "lifetime of the cleaner") you will need to replace them, as after 6 months of use, the dirt gets so ground in that no amount of cleaning will restore the air flow the filter had when it was new. Seeing as I only use my Panasonic MC-E8011 once a month, I've never replaced the filters and just clean them, but if I used it more, I would replace them regularly. And yes, you're probably thinking "but even if I have to replace the filters, that is once every 6 months - I have to replace the bag every month!", however, bags cost £2-3 for a pack of 5, whereas filters cost £10-20 for a pack of one! Indeed, you also have to replace the filters on bagged cleaners too, but because the filters aren't in direct contact with the dirt, you can simply clean them every 6 months and replace every couple of years, or sometimes never replace at all if you have a good quality filter and good quality bag. Works out at just the same maintenance cost, if not more for bagless, so I know what I'd rather. | ||
| Post# 163427 , Reply# 7 12/27/2011 at 04:35 (4,504 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 163429 , Reply# 8 12/27/2011 at 07:24 (4,504 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
Personally, I wouldn't use a bagless cleaner if you paid me! I despise emptying the bloody things with dust clouds blowing in your face and I hate washing out the filters - it's just so messy!
However, I can imagine why people prefer a bagless machine. With regular filter maintenance, a Dyson (or other multi cyclone cleaner) will retain constant suction. It's just a pitty that there are so many low efficiency direct filter cyclones on the market that clog up after 1 use. Therefore, I've always thought that if you want to go bagless, Dyson is really the only option. I've also never found any bagless vacuum to be of particularly high build quality. Dysons have always seemed cheaply made and flimsy in comparison to bagged vacuums in the same price range. Sorry James Dyson, but I'll be sticking with a bag. | ||
| Post# 163430 , Reply# 9 12/27/2011 at 07:42 (4,504 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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I know what you mean about build quality, as all the Bagless cleaners I've owned have been quite cheaply built, even if they weren't cheap to buy.
In comparison, my '94 HOOVER Turbopower 1000 Bagged cleaner is the sturdiest cleaner I've ever seen. It actually fell down a flight of stairs about a year ago (when my mother was using it I hasten to add) and was 100% unscathed. Not even a mark on the body. Solid, solid as a rock! | ||
Post# 163433 , Reply# 10 12/27/2011 at 08:03 (4,504 days old) by jfalberti  (Visalia, CA) |
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I think it's all up to personal preferance
I have both bagged and bagless cleaners. In my opinion Dyson is the only bagless cleaner I like. I have a DC14 and a DC15 and like them a lot. I bought an extra pre motor filter for each, and when it comes time to clean the filter, I just swap it out and clean the old filter at my convenience. Always have a fresh filter ready to go. I also have bagless Eureka and a bagless WindTunnel that I don't care that much for. I also like my bagged Hoover Tempo, Kenmore Progressive, and Kirby Ultimate G Diamond Edition.
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| Post# 163438 , Reply# 12 12/27/2011 at 09:02 (4,504 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada) | ||
I'm definitely a "bag" guy. Ever since our family owned a Sanyo bagless "dust cassette" canister vac in the 1970's, I have never been convinced that there is any benefit to a bagless vacuum cleaner. The time required to maintain such cleaners is far greater than the time required to find and buy bags for a bagged vac. And now with the internet, it is very easy to order the right kind of bags and have them delivered to your door.
Being a closeted teen "vac lover" several decades ago, I was the one who took it upon myself to keep our 2 vacuums running properly. Compared to emptying the Sanyo, changing the F&G bag on our Eureka upright was a breeze. A lot of the vacuums bought by consumers are actually used more by hired help than the consumers themselves. Many of these "cleaning ladies" are faced with the dusty task of emptying the bagless vac bins and keeping the filters washed and dried.....tasks they often don't understand or have time to do. I also don't enjoy seeing dirt spinning around in front of my face the entire time I am using a vacuum. And I can't stand having to deal with hair clinging to the filter of any dustbuster or cordless stick vac I have used in the past. And no matter what they say, bagless vacuums eventually need to have their expensive filters changed. So you do have some expense in upkeep just like a bagged machine. I also have to agree that the circular dust bins of cyclonic vacs make them far too bulky. Add to that all the on-board attachments,"plumbing" and turbo tools hanging onto them for dear life, and these bagless uprights look absolutely ridiculous. Seeing anyone use these contraptions often makes me laugh - it looks like they are pushing around an entire hardware store on wheels! I would prefer to clean wall to wall carpeting using a sleek Miele upright, or even a bagged Eureka Ultra any day, over using these cumbersome overloaded bagless machines. Just my 2 amps worth! :-) | ||
| Post# 163441 , Reply# 13 12/27/2011 at 09:10 (4,504 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada) | ||
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Question for vac repair shop owners:
Do you find that your workload is greater these days due to the prevalence of bagless vacs on the market? In other words, do you have a sense that buyers of bagless vacs are coming to you with more problems, than those who have bought a bagged vacuum?
I often wondered if the loss of revenue from sales of bags may be filled by more vac-users bringing their bagless vacs in for repairs due to sloppy maintenance on their part. Any thoughts? Just curious..... | ||
| Post# 163446 , Reply# 14 12/27/2011 at 09:24 (4,504 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA) | ||
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| Post# 163457 , Reply# 15 12/27/2011 at 10:40 (4,504 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 163463 , Reply# 16 12/27/2011 at 10:51 (4,504 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada) | ||
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| Post# 163464 , Reply# 17 12/27/2011 at 10:52 (4,504 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center) | ||
i'm bagged,but with some aceptoins
first off,i agree with eurekaprince on how those bulky dirt chamber things are just
silly.how do you expect the consumer to get under things like beds,couches,exe... with that bloody thing dropping attachments everywhere,when you're granny's old hoover convertible glides under everything in a snap! and another thing,most bagless vacs have,the bloody stretch hose! now,HOW on earth does hoover,eureka,bissell and more expect us consumers to clean some cobwebs in the corner,or along baseboards when as soon as i stick the crevice tool on,i thing rockets back at me! for this reason,i am most defiantly a baged vacuum person,vacuums like a hoover elite get under things like that.and,again,i don't know why anyone would pay $20-$30 for a new filter every 6 months when you could buy a pack of bags for $2-$15 every 6-12 months! however,i do have some accept-ions for bagless vacs, KENMORE/SANYO DUST CASSETTE CANISTERS:I like the little pigs,i don't find them that hard to empty. FANTOMS:the one everyone forgot,fantom vacuums, especially the thunder/furry.they have stupendous power,and groom the carpet excellently.i don't see why people here like the dysons,my DC-07 barely grooms,and i think fantom is the much better cleaner. just my 5 amps worth :) | ||
| Post# 163465 , Reply# 18 12/27/2011 at 10:58 (4,504 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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The only thing I disagree with is about the stretch hoses.
My 1994 HOOVER Turbopower 1000 has a stretch hose, and it never snaps back at me when I put the crevice tool on. OK, occasionally if the end of the hose/attachment gets stuck to something, either the hose or the Vacuum Cleaner will tug backwards, but so long as you're careful, I'd prefer a stretch hose, as the plastic ones are so unwieldy and limit the amount of spaces you can clean without hauling the whole cleaner around with you. | ||
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Post# 163599 , Reply# 22 12/28/2011 at 11:19 (4,503 days old) by RainbowD4C (Saint Joseph, Michigan ) |
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I actually prefer water (I have a Rainbow) or bagg. At least with bag the dust is contained when you clean out the vacuum. My mom has a bagless and you get a facefull of dust everytime you empty it unless you do what I do and just put the cup deep in the waste basket and empty it that way plus it seems with bagless your vacuums get dirty quicker and don't last as long.
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| Post# 163601 , Reply# 23 12/28/2011 at 11:47 (4,503 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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I know what you mean about the face full of dust.
It happens to me all the time when I empty the bin of my Panasonic. I've tried doing it outside, which makes it worse as the wind blows the dirt into your face with more force than indoors, and I've tried holding the bin low down into the bag, but some dust always manages to seep out and hit me in the nose putting me into a coughing fit! And I'm not even asthmatic - I honestly don't know how anybody with respiratory problems could have a Bagless cleaner. | ||
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Post# 163704 , Reply# 26 12/29/2011 at 03:08 (4,502 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC) |
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thats a thing on the Compact-TriStar vacuums-you can use them either way-with the paper liner bag-or without-the cloth one alone.when I use my TriStars-use the paper bags. | ||
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Post# 163725 , Reply# 29 12/29/2011 at 12:00 (4,502 days old) by vinvac (Dubuque IA) |
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Bagged for me as well.
Personally, with allergies, I don't want to empty and wash the container each and every time I use it. Part of the reason I don't like using my Rainbows...you can't dump the water in the house...you have to go outside...it is just to messy. The quality of the high end bags is so good that they really don't leak a lot. Plus with bagless the filters are twice the price of bags..sometimes three and four time the price of bags. For us as collectors bagless machines are great...we take care of them..for the normal household...they don't clean filters, they just empty the bin and most of the time when you hear a bagless machine running..the pitch is very high as the filters are totally clogged. Bagless machines for me are a gimmick...the company has you totally convinced that because you can see the dirt swirling around in the clear container that it is really cleaing well. The fact of the matter is that when using a bagged machine with a high quality bag the air flow is staying just as strong and cleaning much better. The filter area of a bagless is so small compared to that of a bagged machine...they clog so much quicker and air flow is reduced almost immediatly. Morgan | ||
| Post# 163735 , Reply# 32 12/29/2011 at 13:15 (4,502 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa) | ||
 I must say i prefer bag less but oonly Dyson bag less, In our shop we sell many makes and models and we are taking on the miele vacuums so i bought an S7 upright to try out.. I loved it , quiet easy to use just fantastic I have animals , and despite the bags getting full rather fast I have another problem , they start to smell. even with its charcoal filter the machine gets a certain stink to it. I switched back to my Dyson dc27 and although it is noisier I empty it after each use and 2 years on no smell , not even the dc07 we use now in the family room has the slightest smell to it . | ||
| Post# 163783 , Reply# 35 12/29/2011 at 20:27 (4,501 days old) by kirbylux77 (London, Ontario, Canada) | ||
Prefer Multi Cyclonic Bagless vacuums....
I do like bagged vacuums, & it's nice that many bagged vacuums make it so easy to take the bag off, throw it out & put a new one on & continue cleaning. I also feel that the latest generation of vacuums with HEPA cloth bags do filter as well or perhaps better than filtered bagless vacuums. However, having said that, I do feel that micro-filtration or plain paper bags do NOT filter as well as the tower HEPA filters supplied these days with filtered bagless vacuums.
For my personal cleaning situation, I am an apartment dweller, & don't have any cats or dogs, & my carpeting is also low-pile commercial grade carpeting, which doesn't let off lots of carpet fibers. I find that I pick up lots of fine dust & sand, & that clogs my bagged vacuums fairly quickly....even the ones with HEPA cloth bags. For this reason, I prefer to use multi-cyclonic bagless vacuums, such as Fantom, Dyson, Hoover T-Series, etc, most times for my regular cleaning. I have had a Bissell Healthy Home upright now for nearly 2 years, & I find it outcleans many of my bagged or filtered cyclonic vacuums. It also empties without much dust flying in the air, & I don't mind taking the bin outside to empty, & just to be sure dust doesn't get in my face, I wear a white drywall dust mask. I also find the same thing with my Fantom Lightning canister. The only time I find that either my Fantom or Bissell can get messy is that I will take a canister vacuum with a blower, such as a Filter Queen or TriStar, put a crevice tool on the hose, & use that to blow out the multi-cyclonic filter assembly every few months; then I do have to do that outside with a face mask, or dust would be all over the place. I would use a Water Filtration vacuum, such as Rainbow, & have owned one in the past, but since I clean my carpets every 2-3 days, it would be too inconvenient to set up & empty & clean each time. I also don't believe that water works well at trapping fine dust; when I owned my Rainbow D4, I was always disgusted by the fact that there was dirt on the separator to clean off, & that convinced me their claims of filtration were overstated. If I was to buy another Water Filtration vacuum, it would have to have a HEPA filter on the exhaust. I agree with many points made about bagless vacuums, though, for sure! Filtered bagless vacuums, in most cases the filters are a pain to get clean, unless they are foam, like the original Bissell Cleanview uprights, or like the Powerforce bagless uprights, the pleated filter is intended to be rinsed & washed clean & left to dry. However, they still lose power when the dust & dirt accumulates on the filter, as they are designed to simulate what a bag does....so you don't get any advantage in cleaning performance. Rather, you get the convenience of throwing out the dirt & not wasting money on bags....BUT you have the cost of replacement filters. So, you still have a cost for consumables. The only real advantage is that you get the satisfaction of seeing all the dirt the vacuum collected & can have a sense of pride in having a clean home. Rob BTW- For anyone who is in my particular situation, picking up lots of fine dust & sand, & using a bagged vacuum, here's a tip to restore cleaning power to your vacuum if your bag isn't very full- Open the bag compartment of your vacuum, & if the hole of the bag is exposed, stuff a small dry towel in the hole of the bag. Then, give the bag a good vigorous shake. When you are done, carefully remove the towel, take it outside & shake off the dust that accumulated on the towel. You will notice your vacuum should regain most, if not all, of it's cleaning power, because you have knocked the fine dust off the walls of the bag so air can pass thru. | ||
| Post# 163799 , Reply# 36 12/29/2011 at 23:58 (4,501 days old) by kirbyvertibles (Independence, KS) | ||
For deep cleaning bags are the way to go but bagless are fun to play with and to use as a daily quick cleaning that fine, but when you want to get serious I think the bag is better. As for water well again if it's really dirty you have to stop and empty before you're done, but i'm not knocking them.
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Post# 163801 , Reply# 37 12/30/2011 at 00:21 (4,501 days old) by RainbowD4C (Saint Joseph, Michigan ) |
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@ Morgan. I dump my Rainbow down the toilet or the kitchen sink. I've never had a problem with it and I've done that for years.
I will admit that when it comes to bagged machines I like Electrolux/Aerus with the way they seal off when you open the machine. If I were to ever get a new vacuum that is what I would get. | ||
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Post# 163808 , Reply# 39 12/30/2011 at 05:49 (4,501 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC) |
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Before you dump the Rainbow bin down your plumbing--pick out the large peices and wads of lint-hair.Does your place use a septic tank-if so dump the bin outside-plant beds is a good place-been doing that with any of my Rainbows. | ||
| Post# 163834 , Reply# 42 12/30/2011 at 10:49 (4,501 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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Sadly, that isn't the first time I've heard of somebody using a Vacuum Cleaner until the bag is 100% full and dirt it starting to collect in the hose.
I fill my bags to half way, then change them - Which is what everybody should do, as once a bag gets fuller than half way, it puts a strain on the motor, and will start to cause extra wear. Even bags that say "Can Be Used Twice" I throw away after the first use, as I just don't trust a bag that has already been filled once to still give me the same air flow as a new one would. For the price of a new bag, compared to the price of a new motor, it just isn't worth it. I'm not surprised at all though that the Electrolux's motor wasn't damaged by being ran with a full bag, because, simply, it is an Electrolux! Nothing Sucks Like An Electrolux! :) | ||
| Post# 163847 , Reply# 43 12/30/2011 at 13:52 (4,500 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
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I fill my bags to half way, then change them - Which is what
I usually pack the vacuum bag as full as I can and have never had a problem. My Panasonic 40 series vacuums will retain strong suction and good performance until the bag is about 3/4 full. Same with the Electrolux 616. My Henry keeps strong suction until the bag is almost full, but only if I use the HEPAflo bags.
The Sebo, however, keeps on picking up flawlessly, even with a full bag. Infact, the bag full indicator doesn't start flashing until the dirt is coming up through the hose. The bags on my Miele S5281 and on my Dad's S2110 can really be crammed full before the suction drops. | ||
| Post# 163852 , Reply# 44 12/30/2011 at 14:54 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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Yes, the bags can take it - Of course they can if they are of good quality, but over time, the strain the motor is having to put up with to keep the suction up with the packed bag will end in a break down.
If the motor is a durable one, the break down will take a long time to become apparent, but it will still happen one day. Maybe tomorrow, maybe next year, or maybe in the next decade, but it WILL happen if you keep filling your bags until the motor is working very hard to keep going with the amount of air flow restriction the full bag is putting on it. I never trust a "FULL BAG" indicator, as they always come on too late in my opinion. I once ran my '94 HOOVER Turbopower 1000 without changing the bag just to see when the full bag indicator lit, and when it did, the bag was 2-3CM from being filled to the top. I don't know why Vacuum Cleaners even have bag full indicators to be honest, because by the time they come on you are way past the recommended bag change interval. The only good thing about the indicator is that it tells you when you have a blockage in the hose pipe/inlet passage, and even then it is superfluous in my opinion, as it is usually obvious if there is a blockage bad enough to set the indicator off. | ||
| Post# 163886 , Reply# 47 12/30/2011 at 17:29 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 163912 , Reply# 49 12/30/2011 at 18:32 (4,500 days old) by danemodsandy () | ||
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Jamie: That having been said, a Diamond Jubilee in good repair will suck the dried paint off a wall. My DJ has the highest suction of any of my vacuums, including my TriStar CXL, though the CXL is very close, without the jet-fighter whine of the DJ. | ||
| Post# 163916 , Reply# 50 12/30/2011 at 18:58 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 163952 , Reply# 52 12/31/2011 at 04:18 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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I never buy genuine bags, unless I can get them really cheap, like I did at my local recycling store when they had two packs of genuine HOOVER bags for my Turbopower really cheap.
Otherwise, I log onto eBay, and buy the cheapest (usually Electropart or Qualtex) bags I can, which have never given me any problems nor performed any worse in suction or air filtration opposed to the genuine manufacturers bags. | ||
| Post# 164007 , Reply# 54 12/31/2011 at 09:52 (4,500 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY) | ||
I prefer bagged. The only bagless I like is Rainbow. The Epic 6500 is bags are super cheap & easy to change. I always change them WAY before they even look full because I can tell it loses some suction. There's nothing like putting a fresh bag in and feeling that power, but it never seems to last. The suction remains decently strong but I can always tell it's never as good as when the brand new bag was put in.
The LAST dry bagless I had was a Fantom Fury in the Late 90s & I hated it with a white hot purple pink passion. You could see dust collecting all over the OUTSIDE of the machine and emptying it was what I hated most because of dust flying all over. I think I'd like a DYSON but you've never going to get away with emptying it and dust flying. | ||
| Post# 164012 , Reply# 55 12/31/2011 at 10:08 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164013 , Reply# 56 12/31/2011 at 10:19 (4,500 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
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"I always empty outside and push the canister to the bottom of the bin and wipe down the canister. Keep a spare filter and toss the filters in the washer on a gentle wash"
And you find that easier than just tossing a bag into the bin and putting a new one in? Sounds like an awfully messy, unhygienic process to me. | ||
| Post# 164016 , Reply# 58 12/31/2011 at 10:32 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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@baglessball I don't agree. Bags rarely burst - For my whole life my mother has used bagged cleaners and never ONCE has a bag burst or lost suction after vacuuming up any kind of fine powder.
Bags FTW! Fill the bag to half way, pull it out, throw it in the bin, put a new one in - Simples! And no dust getting into the air. | ||
| Post# 164026 , Reply# 60 12/31/2011 at 10:53 (4,500 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
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How often do you wipe your cleaners down?
I don't need to because they don't leak and get caked in dust. Only my older cleaners sometimes need a wipe if I've not used them for a long time.
Like jmurray, I've always had bagged vacuums. As has both my parents and most people in my family. Aside from the odd Dyson, they all still do. I hate the dustclouds, having to empty it everytime I use the bloody thing and having to wash the filters out. It's messy and unhygienic. Add that to the fact that Dyson are the only efficient bagless vacuum and are stupidly overpriced and cheaply made, then I REALLY don't want one. It takes me months to fill a vacuum bag and I've never had any issues with the suction dropping on the Sebo or on the Henry. 1 pack of 10 bags will last over a year. Hardly an expense. | ||
| Post# 164027 , Reply# 61 12/31/2011 at 10:55 (4,500 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
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Have you ever cleaned up after a builder? They'll soon p | ||
| Post# 164031 , Reply# 62 12/31/2011 at 11:06 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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My thoughts exactly Chris!
I've cleaned up all sorts (including mess left over from a builder) with my '94 Turbopower 1000 bagged and never has the bag burst or lost any suction. And yes, I HAVE sucked up talcum powder when a whole bottle of it burst on the landing of our previous house and the Turbopower didn't loose any suction. | ||
| Post# 164037 , Reply# 64 12/31/2011 at 11:21 (4,500 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY) | ||
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| Post# 164038 , Reply# 65 12/31/2011 at 11:26 (4,500 days old) by baglessball () | ||
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Funny that. Never loses suction? Then please be my guest to record the above instructions and post it on line. | ||
| Post# 164039 , Reply# 66 12/31/2011 at 11:28 (4,500 days old) by Blackheart (North Dakota) | ||
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Fine powder
Any vacuum will lose airflow with fine powders i once put down some baking soda and used my DC-17 to clean it up when i was finished i was curious and put the Baird meter on the dyson and it did not register (usually at 1.5/10) once the filter and cyclone assembly were washed and dried the power came back to it.
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| Post# 164040 , Reply# 67 12/31/2011 at 11:32 (4,500 days old) by baglessball () | ||
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Mark40511 For killing suction? My point was that IN MY EXPERIENCE I would prefer to use a dyson to clean an environment with this in,rather than a bagged machine. I agree extremely fine dust shouldn't be vaccumed up but it can't always be helped.. | ||
| Post# 164041 , Reply# 68 12/31/2011 at 11:40 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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"Ask the member of your family who own them."
I don't need to, because a couple of years ago my Grandfather bought a brand new Bagless Vax Upright cleaner and after a year he got rid of it and bought a bagged Miele cylinder cleaner because he was disgusted by the suction loss the Bagless had after only a couple of uses. The Miele is still working perfectly with no suction loss by the way. | ||
| Post# 164046 , Reply# 69 12/31/2011 at 12:04 (4,500 days old) by baglessball () | ||
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I'm dyson bagless. Not Vax/Hoover/whatever else bagless.. | ||
| Post# 164047 , Reply# 70 12/31/2011 at 12:12 (4,500 days old) by baglessball () | ||
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Mieles are good. But some of the bags do leak, they will lose some suction, and bags or Mieles are EXPENSIVE!! | ||
| Post# 164048 , Reply# 71 12/31/2011 at 12:15 (4,500 days old) by baglessball () | ||
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Mieles are great. But some of the bags do leak, they will lose some suction, and bags or Mieles are EXPENSIVE!! What makes you think that bags don't lose suction? Ask anyone. | ||
| Post# 164050 , Reply# 72 12/31/2011 at 12:21 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164056 , Reply# 73 12/31/2011 at 12:47 (4,500 days old) by baglessball () | ||
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Have you tried a dyson? | ||
| Post# 164057 , Reply# 74 12/31/2011 at 12:52 (4,500 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164058 , Reply# 75 12/31/2011 at 13:04 (4,500 days old) by baglessball () | ||
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What model was it? | ||
| Post# 164060 , Reply# 76 12/31/2011 at 13:12 (4,500 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
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Baglessball...
I have to say, if you want bagless, Dyson is the way to go. The cyclone design is unrivalled IMO. It's certainly the most efficient bagless machine you can get.
HOWEVER that doesn't mean I like it. I've said it before and I'll say it again. James Dyson knows NOTHING about vacuum cleaners. He is an engineer - a very good one. His cyclone design works very well. But a vacuum needs more than just suction. Hoover had it spot on with lower wattage, dirty fan motors and an effective brushroll. The Dyson brushroll is one of the worst I have ever seen - 2nd only to the brushroll in Hoover "The One" machines. The bristles are too far apart and not dense enough and that horrid helix brushroll does nothing but shred carpet fibres. Remember, the brushroll is not just for sweeping up bits - it's meant to groom the carpet pile to prolong the life of the carpet. The naff brushroll isn't helped by the floating head design of the cleaner either. I've found the whole wand and hose assembly to be a complete pain the arse. I want my tools to be at hand when I need them - I don't want to have to stop mid-vacuum to get the hose out and have to take half the bloody thing apart just to get up a few crumbs by the skirting board. I've also found the tools to be cheap and break easily, although improvements have since been made (I actually quite like the click-fit tools) Also, I've found the build quality to be absolutely appalling, especially in proportion to the price of the machine. When paying £200 plus for a vacuum, I expect robust plastic and metal parts, not something that feels like it's going to snap in half if I get a bit rough with it (that actually happened to my Gran's DC15 - snapped clean in 2 around the ball assembly). Add all this to the fact that I don't like emptying the damn thing OR washing the filters out (which I've found to be way too messy and unhygienic, although the filters on the DC41 look like you can just chuck them in the washing machine. A vast improvement!) and you've got a vacuum I wouldn't ever want to own! Dyson need to stop trying to "improve" on their cyclone design. It's already very efficient as it is and the filter set up on the DC41 looks drastically more acceptable. Now it's time to start focusing on everything else that's wrong with the bleedin' thing, starting with that horrible brushroll | ||
| Post# 164062 , Reply# 77 12/31/2011 at 13:22 (4,499 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
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Incidentally, my Grandparents have owned 5 Dysons since 1997. DC01, DC04, DC07, DC15 and a DC27. The DC01 never actually broke, but the suction dropped on it so much it didn't pick a thing up, despite regular filter changes. The DC04 and 07 both blew up and the 15 snapped in 2 and fell apart. The 27 is still in use, but now accompanied by a George, so it doesn't get used much anymore. I've used them all and none have impressed me for various reasons. A very good friend of mine has a DC26 Overdrive that's not bad, but testing at his house proved his Sebo X4 picks up more and the 26 leaves too much behind (though I'm presuming this is entirely due to the crap brushroll, as previously stated). I also owned a Dyson DC04 silverlime for a while and it was very average - nothing impressive about it.
Is it any wonder I stick to Sebo, Miele and Numatic for modern cleaners? | ||
| Post# 164067 , Reply# 79 12/31/2011 at 13:44 (4,499 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164070 , Reply# 80 12/31/2011 at 13:52 (4,499 days old) by hoovermanmick () | ||
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get your self a second hand hoover turbopower 1 if needs a motor get a new one put. in best cleaners out when they was out they was recmended my axminster carpets CLICK HERE TO GO TO hoovermanmick's LINK | ||
| Post# 164086 , Reply# 82 12/31/2011 at 17:07 (4,499 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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I thought almost all Vacuum Cleaners had handle lock!?
I don't know how I'd survive without it, seeing as I have a few rugs to clean on a daily basis and don't fancy snapping belts every morning when the end of the rug gets tangled up in the brush roll. The only cleaner that doesn't have a working handle lock is my Electrolux 502S. It did have the feature, but the notch has worn down now and it just goes straight to the floor when you try and lift the brush roll, so I have to either put the handle so low it literally touches the floor to get the brush roll to lift off the carpet a few CM, or click it into the upright position which gets annoying. Oh well - The joys of owning vintage Vacuum Cleaners eh!? | ||
| Post# 164093 , Reply# 84 12/31/2011 at 17:58 (4,499 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164094 , Reply# 85 12/31/2011 at 17:59 (4,499 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164105 , Reply# 87 12/31/2011 at 18:42 (4,499 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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I totally agree about the 2-In-1 Electrolux tool - It is fantastic!
The brush has lots of bristles, and they are soft! The bristles on the brush tool for my 2007 NUMATIC Henry are very, very hard and I'm afraid to use it! My Turbopower's brush bristles are harder than the Luxes, but not so hard I cringe when running it over a nice piece of wood furniture. | ||
| Post# 164108 , Reply# 90 12/31/2011 at 19:11 (4,499 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164163 , Reply# 91 1/1/2012 at 07:38 (4,499 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
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jmurray..
the dusting brush on my Henry is really long and soft. I think Numatic only supply the naffer version that you have with the James. CLICK HERE TO GO TO Turbo500's LINK | ||
| Post# 164170 , Reply# 92 1/1/2012 at 08:36 (4,499 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada) | ||
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In North America, the best dusting brush is the horse-hair version of the Kenmore/Panasonic dusting brush that used to be found on the Progressives/Elegances and Whispertone canisters. The bristles are really soft and the rectangular shape is very practical. You can buy these at any Sears store for about $10.
CLICK HERE TO GO TO eurekaprince's LINK | ||
| Post# 164176 , Reply# 93 1/1/2012 at 09:37 (4,499 days old) by kirby (passadena md) | ||
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dyson is best i like dysons filitration best | ||
| Post# 164184 , Reply# 94 1/1/2012 at 11:35 (4,499 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY) | ||
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When I had the bagless upright in the late 90s......I remember I took the entire vacuum outside on the deck and had a grocery store plastic bag and dumped the contents in that carefully. Dust flying all over the place as I did it & then I was left with the container that NOW had a layer of dust on the outside of it, so I would get a damp rag and wipe it off outside. This wasn't fun in the winter time. I hated it!
I also wonder about those who just take the dust cup over their trash can and release it there. So when you start throwing things in the trash, every time something lands in the trash, that dust is going to fly up | ||
| Post# 164192 , Reply# 95 1/1/2012 at 13:04 (4,499 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164290 , Reply# 97 1/2/2012 at 07:32 (4,498 days old) by 2011hoover700 (owosso michigan) | ||
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| Post# 164294 , Reply# 98 1/2/2012 at 08:37 (4,498 days old) by kirby (passadena md) | ||
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dysons cheaply maid! ha ha ha ha dysons are NOT chepely maid. i have had my dyson dc01 for over 8 years first vacuum i ever got :-) | ||
| Post# 164298 , Reply# 99 1/2/2012 at 09:20 (4,498 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164333 , Reply# 100 1/2/2012 at 14:36 (4,497 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK) | ||
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dysons are NOT chepely maid. i have had my dyson dc01 for ov
Actually, the DC01 and DC04 seem to be a heck of a lot more robust and reliable than the later models. The problem with the DC01 is that the suction wasn't all that great and the neither was the brushroll, which made for a very average machine. The DC04 was a vast improvement suction wise, but of course, that was the introduction of the clutch models and that AWFUL helix brushroll which I hate! After that, the quality starts to drop. I've seen more broken DC07's and DC14's going to the tip, in skips or on the back of scrap trucks than any other Dyson. I also meant that the quality of the machine is not in proportion with the astronomical price tag.
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| Post# 164427 , Reply# 102 1/2/2012 at 22:00 (4,497 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada) | ||
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| Post# 164451 , Reply# 103 1/3/2012 at 11:01 (4,497 days old) by sanitairered (Michigan) | ||
eurekaprince | ||
| Post# 164460 , Reply# 104 1/3/2012 at 12:45 (4,497 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada) | ||
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Floyd.... | ||
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Post# 164587 , Reply# 105 1/4/2012 at 00:19 (4,496 days old) by RainbowD4C (Saint Joseph, Michigan ) |
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A friend of mine uses her hubby's shop vac to clean out the bagless vacuum. It has actually helped make the filters last longer and lets face it a shop vac has more power than a household (well some house vacuums may have more than a shopvac) but all the same she says it cuts down on her dust flying around when she empties it and the filters and canister looks like brand new.
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| Post# 164664 , Reply# 106 1/4/2012 at 17:50 (4,495 days old) by FantomVacuumFan (St.Petersburg, Florida) | ||
It depends...
I feel as though it depends on what type of bagless vacuum you are using. If your using something like an original Fantom, then bagless is the way to go. It amazes me how people say that they get dust clouds in their face with bagless, yet, I have only experienced this maybe 10 times over a 8 year period, when I vacuumed up a lot of dust, and I was in a rush to empty it, and didn't take the care to dump it to avoid the mess. Bagless vacuums don't last? Again, it depends on the model. Fantoms and Dysons seem to last a lot longer then other vacuums. My oldest Fantom is a 1994, so its going on 18-19 years old. Now, if your buying a new vacuum, rather than a used one, you would either probably want to buy a Dyson other than DC07-DC14, as the brush rolls on those stink. But if you don't want to go with a Dyson, either look at the Hoover Platinum Collection Multi-Cyclonic, which after owning since June, I can say is a good vacuum, but leaves a few things to be desired, or you should probably go bagged, I am not that high on anything else. I have not really used anything else, to be honest, but just based off of reading, and browsing at stores, I really don't get a good impression of a lot of current bagless vacuums. If I were to get a bagged vacuum, I would want to try to get a Miele S7 Tango, or something like that.
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| Post# 164665 , Reply# 107 1/4/2012 at 18:01 (4,495 days old) by vac_whisperer () | ||
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BAGGED! Suction is easily maintained, and no clogged filters. Plus, when you empty a bag less,the dust goes everywhere unless you're outside. And I find Bagless vacuums often leak. | ||
| Post# 164747 , Reply# 108 1/5/2012 at 09:25 (4,495 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 164793 , Reply# 109 1/5/2012 at 15:22 (4,494 days old) by fan-of-fans (USA) | ||
I will admit I was intrigued with the early Fantoms and their bagless technology. They didn't need expensive bags and seemed to be more powerful than bagged. And it was fun to watch the dust spin around. However, they never mentioned that in fact the HEPA filter needs to be changed after a while and that's what causes it to lose power. Not to mention the filter was $80. Then other manufacturers started making bagless machines with the round pleated filters, which seem to need cleaning after each use.
As mentioned above about using a bagged machine to clean a bagless, that's what I do. I use a Kenmore canister with a crevice tool to clean the pleated filter on my Kenmore Quickclean bagless upright. I never have had to replace the filter yet after 6 years. The reason I use the upright is that it seems to clean my carpets better than the canister can. But as said many people don't have a way to clean the filters well, other than buying a new filter and sometimes don't even know there is one. So the filter gets clogged resulting in poor suction and either the owner thinks the machine is worn out or they don't want to buy a new filter when they could get a whole new vacuum. But the same can happen with bags as people don't think to change them, or don't have any replacements on hand. | ||
| Post# 165877 , Reply# 110 1/14/2012 at 15:59 (4,485 days old) by anthony (leeds uk) | ||
bagged or bagless | ||
| Post# 165885 , Reply# 111 1/14/2012 at 17:28 (4,485 days old) by joshdonnell () | ||
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Baged I like bag better , all bagless like dyson will loose it cleaning power and it flow. Rexair should sue dyson for claming no lose of suction . Because rainbow can only caim that and other water besed vacuums | ||
| Post# 166015 , Reply# 112 1/16/2012 at 05:24 (4,484 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 166020 , Reply# 113 1/16/2012 at 08:12 (4,484 days old) by Blackheart (North Dakota) | ||
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I don't think actual Suction is lost | ||
| Post# 168614 , Reply# 116 2/6/2012 at 20:51 (4,462 days old) by floor-a-matic (somewhere) | ||
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I prefer changing bags any day over emptying a bagless bin. Bagless is TOO MESSY! Bagged is MORE SANITARY! :) | ||
| Post# 168648 , Reply# 117 2/7/2012 at 04:26 (4,462 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland) | ||
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| Post# 168761 , Reply# 118 2/7/2012 at 22:26 (4,461 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2) | ||
It amazes me how people say that they get dust clouds in the
It doesn't amaze me - it annoys me - some brands like Vax who are churning out old U.S Dirt Devil uprights with the twist off top canister, where you have to unscrew the top immediately reveals dust - but that isn't the problem - neither is the problem affected if the bin door is at the bottom - the problem comes when you go to empty your bagless bin into ANOTHER bin with an open top. Dust hits whatever is left in the bin beforehand and will fly back up at you - despite the forces of nature with gravity - a ever-so-gentle breeze will allow dust to fly back up, causing clouds of dust to cake you and whatever else is in the vicinity.
I find it hugely ironic that back in the early days, when Dyson lamented nothing but ill thought on bagged vacuums, that their user manuals suggested putting the collected dust into a ANOTHER BAG to seal up the dirt if owners had allergies. Sounds like a cheap shot to me, and it was! JM - I don't know where you get the info from that a full dust bag puts a strain on the motor. Doesn't happen with all. It could happen IF you have a Hoover vacuum cleaner or a dirty fan system and use the old promise that the paper dust bag are "reusable." Trouble is, Hoover never really informed the customer that you could only use the dust bag twice before disposing of it and replacing with a fresh bag. I guess they were trying a cheap shot there of pushing the buyer to buy more bags. I like good value for money and I never let any of my vacuum dust bags leave the vacuums until the bags are absolutely full. Ive yet to burn out any kind of motor. They are tested to have a full dust bag of dirt, otherwise people would have sued several manufacturers by now if they don't go by their full capacity claim and only used once as dictated by the brand/user manual. I'm not a fan of bagless vacuums but I do have one because I have pets to clean up after. Not so much dog or cat hair because that stuff stinks and my bagged vacuums take care of that. My bagless upright has newer filtration copied from Dyson's Dual Cyclone system, but regardless of whatever it is, when you have a couple old budgies who love nothing but to spit out seed several times a day, the clean up can get quite tedious. The bagless vac is therefore crucial if you have more than one or two of the "standard" pets in your home. Or, an alternative like the humble Black and Decker (or whatever) cordless dust buster. But that just too sore on my back having to bend down to the cage legs all the time to pick up the seeds! | ||
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