Thread Number: 41069  /  Tag: 50s/60s/70s Vacuum Cleaners
Electrolux 1205 Door Pops Open
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Post# 435934   12/5/2020 at 19:31 (1,209 days old) by FernGreen (CT)        

Hey guys i just got my 1205 back together after getting the electric motor rebuilt. I have never used this vacuum prior to the rebuild so i don't know if this is normal but when i put my hand over the suction the door likes to pop open. Is this normal? It only does it when i completely put my hand open the suction and i can see the latch slowly undo itself. Is this some kind of built in safety mechanism which uses that valve assembly in the front cover. Or is there something wrong with my valve causing the door to pop open prematurely? I tried adjusting the knob to coarse dirt and it doesn't make too much of a difference when my hand is blocking the suction. I have an electrolux Silverado that i can put my hand over all day and the door will never pop open so i'm sure which one is in the wrong.

Post# 435936 , Reply# 1   12/5/2020 at 19:53 (1,209 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        
Your 1205 is doing exactly what it's supposed to do...

human's profile picture
The fact that the door is popping open like that on your 1205 means the mechanism is working as it should. Your Silverado, on the other hand, needs some attention. The problem with it could be as simple as a vacuum line that has come loose or is cracked and leaking. It's a pretty easy fix, just a pain to trace out exactly where the problem is. That said, it's probably not hurting anything the way it is now but if you're like me, just knowing it isn't functioning properly will make you a little crazy over time.

Post# 435938 , Reply# 2   12/5/2020 at 20:51 (1,209 days old) by FernGreen (CT)        
Great News!

Oh alright thank you for the response, thats very reassuring (at least for the 1205 lol). I pulled the front cover off before i saw your reply and i found one of the vacuum hoses was full of dirt so i blew that out but it seems to be working great i just wasn't sure about that vacuum actuator but i ran the vacuum when i had the front cover off and i got a basic idea of how it operated.

Post# 435962 , Reply# 3   12/6/2020 at 02:42 (1,209 days old) by huskyvacs (Gnaw Bone, Indiana)        

huskyvacs's profile picture
If the 1205 is the model with "Automatic Control" then yes, the bag door opening when suction is blocked is the normal function of the vacuum. That is supposed to happen. Adjusting the dirt level adjusts how soon or how late the mechanism will operate. Like if you are picking up a lot of pet hair, you would not want it to open too soon as it would keep opening every 2 seconds, but on fine grit you don't want it opening too late to where it overfills the bag. On older models, the LX I believe it was, it would fling the door open an then kick the bag completely out of the vacuum.

Reply# 6 here describes how the process works, it's within the bag door sandwiched behind the fascia, and the rubber tubes usually rot or the springs get rusty and stick in place which causes it to not work right.

www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bi...

It's a really ingenious system in how it operates.

Here's the LX ejecting a bag:




Post# 435972 , Reply# 4   12/6/2020 at 13:23 (1,208 days old) by Jo (Dallas,TX)        
How it works and how to use automatic control settings

Yes dirt in the hoses will cause it to act incorrectly.

The adjustment dial is for the sensitivity of the automatic control which pops the door open, shuts the machine off, and/or turns on the check bag light depending on the model. All 3 for your 1205 and Silverado.

Number one is most sensitive and 6 is lest sensitive. The system monitors suction before and after the bag and when there is an imbalance due to blockage in the bag it will activate. Coarse dirt setting will cause it to activate more frequently or when there is a minimal loss of suction and 6 or fine dirt will allow the machine to continue operating until almost all the suction is lost from the bag filling with dirt.

It is not advisable to keep the machine set on a number beyond 4 as motor strain and a loss of efficiency will be allowed to occur. Those high settings should only be used temporarily to complete a fine dust cleaning job such as Sheetrock or plaster dust, powder or ash which will clog the bag’s pores.

The coarse setting is good for people who have shedding pets as the pet hair will fill the bag but still allow air to pass through very efficiently so you would need a lower setting to notify you of a full bag before it literally becomes stuffed to the point the pet hair begins accumulating into the suction hole and hose as the bag ends up completely full.

My experience is the older machines pre 1205 are more sensitive than the 1205 and beyond machines.

I did have an instance where my Aunt’s Olympia wouldn’t stay running even with relatively a new bag and set on 6. Was told by the Electrolux man we were picking up too fine of dirt and it was accumulating in the system throwing it off. It was an unusual situation I had to use the vacuum for...she failed to clean her home and heavy dust which turned into a fine powdery dirt accumulated in the carpets heavily.

On the newer machines without numbers such as the Lux legacy only graduated sized dimples are shown on the dial and they represent the “particle size” so coarser dirt is a larger dimples and fine dirt is the smaller dimples and it is recommended the machine be set at the middle dimple of all 7 for general cleaning leaving 3 optional dimples going towards either extreme.

Those old pre 1205 machines have the arrows and words advance and retard on the dial indicating which way to turn the knob to advance or retard the automatic control’s sensitivity. It always still seemed a little confusing to me but once I understood how the sensor worked the words advance and retard with the arrows then made sense.

Some models went to 4 numbers but there are two strokes of the dial usually necessary to reach the next number on the 2 and 3 settings...the secondary stroke going upward in numerical order will make 2 or 3 a little less sensitive. They put “normal” on the 3 setting which would be a 4 and 5 setting on a 6 position dial model. Essentially it’s still a total of 6 settings but for some reason Electrolux decided to lessen the total to 4 on those models. The early plastic models have 5 settings with the word normal in place of 3 which is right in the middle.

Essentially, regardless of the total numbers or stripes or dimples or dirt types indicated....they all work the same way. I always found the golden jubilee through Silverado to be the most explanatory with words on some of the numbers as well as numbers and stripes.

So while it may seem that the higher the number the more dirt one can fit in the bag, that’s not necessarily true, start with a clean bag and suck up plaster dust and the bag will clog and pop open on 6 while not full but suction is lost. Vacuum up all thick dog or cat hair on 1 and the door won’t pop open until the bag is almost completely full. Vacuum normal household dust and crumbs and the amount of dirt allowed to accumulate in the bag will more closely coincide with the setting of less dirt on a lower number and more dirt on a higher number.

To effectively and efficiently and thoroughly vacuum carpets a lower to mid number or stripes or larger dimple setting or coarser dirt setting should be used and the bag should be changed when the check bag system engages regardless of how much dirt is in the bag and for hard floors a higher setting or smaller dimple setting can be tolerated as not as much suction is needed to still thoroughly clean hard floors so you can let the machine run up to a less efficient state allowing you to put more dirt in the bag and still clean the hard surface completely.


Post# 436012 , Reply# 5   12/7/2020 at 22:09 (1,207 days old) by FernGreen (CT)        
Awesome information! Another question please

Thank you guys for all the info on how the system works and where to have the dial set at. I left the dial turned to least sensitive setting but now i'll adjust it to midway to be safe. This brings up another thing, since the electrolux's use a filter bag does this mean that if i vacuum small particles such as drywall dust, the bag will get clogged before it ever gets full? I thought the bags just needed to be changed when they were full but maybe i've been doing this all wrong because the more i think about it, wouldn't the drywall dust have the tendency to coat the inside of the bag not allowing the motor to breathe efficiently?

Post# 436015 , Reply# 6   12/7/2020 at 22:24 (1,207 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
I wouldn't......

suck up massive amounts of sheet rock dust or cold fireplace ash with an Electrolux tank.

It's not that they can't do it, they can. The risk is too great that some of that stuff will pass through your motor. Less likely with a HEPA bag, but still. Use a wet&dry shop vac for those adventures, with its own disposable bag system.

Kevin


Post# 436143 , Reply# 7   12/10/2020 at 22:20 (1,204 days old) by Jo (Dallas,TX)        
To answer your question... and you’ll love this photo!

Yes, if sucking up Sheetrock dirt it will clog the pores of the bag quickly and cut off suction and then the cleaners efficiency is reduced, not to mention not enough air is going through to cool the motor AND the motor is under strain causing more heat to be generated and now you have less air to cool it...hence why you should change the clogged....but not full...bag instead of turn the dial up and continuing using that bag in the machine until it is full. Setting the dial on fine dirt allows you to pick up this type of dirt TEMPORARILY without the automatic control stopping the machine as quickly...so you can complete the job...then the dial should be immediately set back to the medium or coarse settings (more or most sensitive). Stuffing a bag is NEVER recommended. It puts strain on the motor and overheats it. Bags should be changed when 2/3 full. So for standard household cleaning without shedding pets, likely a medium setting will achieve this. The Electrolux will stop when the bag is about half to 2/3 full usually somewhere in the two stripe medium dirt range.

I have an old Electrolux I use in place of a shop vac to suck up nasty stuff and Sheetrock dirt. It has the automatic control and I do have to adjust the dial frequently depending on what I’m sucking up with it. My Electrolux I use in my home is usually set in the medium range and I rarely have to change the setting because I don’t use that vac for anything unusual other than the standard household dirt.

Here’s a picture from a 1205 manual explaining the dial and it’s settings direct from Electrolux! You’ll probably have to enlarge or zoom in on the picture to read it but it gives info about setting the dial and the ranges. A much older Electrolux manual I read long ago gave a more detailed description about how to set it and how it worked so that’s how I learned all about it.

I do notice that the bag door will sometimes open if you are cleaning carpet with the power nozzle then suddenly pull the hose handle out from the wand to suck up something with the hose handle end. The change in air flow or flow rate rate by disconnecting the power nozzle wand while the machine is running and the bag is close to being full enough to trigger the automatic control at what it is set on at the time must be enough difference that it triggers it. So then I usually put the hose handle back on the wand, shut the bag door and continue cleaning and it doesn’t retrigger again until the bag is more filled.


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Post# 436150 , Reply# 8   12/11/2020 at 08:41 (1,203 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
Yes, better to 'waste' some bag capacity than to waste your machine! Fortuately, generic 'C' style bags for Electrolux canisters are dirt cheap when bought in bulk online.

Post# 436155 , Reply# 9   12/11/2020 at 10:43 (1,203 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
Even if......

you trust that the bags won't tear with sheet rock dust and fireplace ash....there's the issues of 'dead heading' your motor frequently or longer in duration as you want to finish the job with one bag.

In anybody else's hands other than a collector/vac enthusiast, these old tanks now are relegated for 'bad' jobs.....while their 'plastic fantastic' counterparts sit in closets resting and chuckling to themselves.

Kevin


Post# 436174 , Reply# 10   12/11/2020 at 19:00 (1,203 days old) by Jo (Dallas,TX)        
I agree

Yes people are using these great old vacs for crap jobs and the plastic crap machines for their home cleaning which is a shame. I do use an old Electrolux for my nasty jobs but also have much better Electrolux’s I dare not use for such. I tried a shop vac but was disgusted with it constantly clogging and how nasty it was to clean out, hence I decide to replace it with an older Electrolux. Surprisingly, I have had very good luck with using the old Electrolux for these nasty jobs...the dirt gets all contained into the self sealing bags and I never have a nasty clean out job to do on the machine and the machine is so well built it is much better than a cheap noisy plastic shop vac and I love the Electrolux tools as well so much prefer to use it than a clumsy shop vac.

I rarely have had any issues with the bags tearing or otherwise failing. If so it was when I was pulling it out to change it and it was full anyway. I’m quite leased at the filtration I get from the Electrolux. Those 4 ply bags do keep the dirt captured quite well.

Since I was realizing that some of the nasty remodel jobs I was doing I was likely sucking up stuff that could be carcinogenic or was just downright really nasty, I decided I wanted a vac for the job that I could trust to thoroughly capture the dust and dirt and not to have to deal with cleaning filters or dumping nasty dirt out that could be a hazard, hence I chose the Old Electrolux and it is a pure pleasure to use for these jobs because no longer do I see, touch, or breathe the nasty stuff I pick up, even when it’s time to change the bag. I just be careful not to pick up any moisture!

Jon


Post# 436193 , Reply# 11   12/12/2020 at 11:01 (1,202 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
You're not....

giving a fair shake to wet & dry shop vacs. I use them all the time on pro jobs because almost all of them can be fitted or refitted with big bag liners that consume the space of your barrel. They don't clog up until they have significant poundage of sheet rock dust, sawdust & debris.

So there's no real reason to put even an old Elux tank through that. And except for HEPA bags, sheetrock dust is so fine that it will go through the best ply bags over time into your motor. So just because the bags don't tear, don't assume they're catching all the sheet rock dust.

I'd much rather sacrifice a shop vac to a job like that and not an Elux tank.

Kevin


Post# 436196 , Reply# 12   12/12/2020 at 14:18 (1,202 days old) by Jo (Dallas,TX)        
I’m sure they are good with a bag

I actually had a shop vac wiith a bag for a short time and it did do a good job for the Sheetrock dust to not clog quick. I gave it to my Father as he wanted one. I don’t suck up Sheetrock dust all that often anymore so even though I’m using an old Electrolux, I don’t think it will kill it and I have opened it up and blow out any dust on the motor periodically with my compressor.

Since then I moved to a home with a one car garage from a two car garage and I just don’t have the space for a shop vac and the Electrolux fits nicely in my work bench and I have all the tools and hose in an upright caddy so it’s very convenient to take in my car and into people’s homes. I get all sorts of comments on it and that is fun.

If I was picking up a lot of Sheetrock dust I’d likely configure it with the dust trapping water bucket system so it doesn’t get into the bag. But for my needs it is not often I’m picking up heavy amounts of Sheetrock dust.

I’ve also heard that one can suck in toilet paper rumpled into the bag before sucking up Sheetrock or fine dust and that helps to capture it and prevent it from clogging the bag.

I did indeed burn up a tiny shop vac...the little square one...that one I used for lots of Sheetrock dust cleanup jobs and it was nasty to clean the filter, but it was for the worst jobs and finally bit the dust! It was only $19.99 new from Lowe’s. They run specials at this time of the year on the little ones for this price. The little ones don’t take bags though.


Post# 436227 , Reply# 13   12/13/2020 at 02:30 (1,202 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
Different strokes....

for different folks. I have a ton of Elux tanks....many waiting to be used/restored. I could certainly sacrifice one for 'bad jobs' like sheet rock dust and ash. But I won't.

I'll let the big wet & dry shop vacs I have be the sacrificial lambs.

Everybody is free to do whatever they want to their own vacs. I've seen vids of Russians vacuuming grass and others making vids on how to deliberately destroy a tank vacuum. Maybe not as insidious as putting a cat in a microwave, but a close second if you're a vac collector.

Kevin


Post# 436254 , Reply# 14   12/13/2020 at 18:48 (1,201 days old) by electrolux137 (Los Angeles)        

electrolux137's profile picture

~
~

All this chat about the 1205 popping open puzzles me. The last Electrolux with a pop-open feature was the Model G. When the 1205 came out, it was equipped with a motor shut-off and a red light indicator, but the cover did not pop open.


Post# 436257 , Reply# 15   12/13/2020 at 21:26 (1,201 days old) by vacuumlad1650 (Wauponsee, IL)        

vacuumlad1650's profile picture
No, Charles, the metal body machines all popped open. From the 1205 and on the door opened, AND the bag indicator turned on. The plastic body machines illuminated a full bag lamp and shut off.

Post# 436260 , Reply# 16   12/13/2020 at 22:01 (1,201 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I was just thinking my Silverado does turn off and pop open, although with the perfect hepa bags it's hard to get it shut off

Post# 436261 , Reply# 17   12/13/2020 at 22:02 (1,201 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
Yeah.....

even the Diamond J door pops open. I know nothing about the plastic bodied Elux's.

Kevin


Post# 436263 , Reply# 18   12/13/2020 at 23:24 (1,201 days old) by electrolux137 (Los Angeles)        

electrolux137's profile picture

~
~

"I stand corrected."


Post# 436273 , Reply# 19   12/14/2020 at 10:14 (1,200 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
Mostly.....

they crack open and the machine quits running because the door is ajar. Not to be confused with the older models that popped a bag out. I've never had one that old working.

Kevin


Post# 436289 , Reply# 20   12/14/2020 at 20:53 (1,200 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
Kevin wrote:
Yeah.....

even the Diamond J door pops open. I know nothing about the plastic bodied Elux's.

I reply:
Some plastic bodied canisters have that feature and some don't. You can tell by whether it has a big knob on top. I have a Diplomat LX that came with that feature from the factory but the knob was missing when I got it so I disconnected the vacuum line. It works just fine without it.


Post# 436328 , Reply# 21   12/15/2020 at 22:30 (1,199 days old) by Jo (Dallas,TX)        
Pop open feature

The models that have the automatic control system in the bag door all pop open, sometimes they pop open a little but don’t shut the machine off if the suction holes collar gets stuck in the bag gasket. The spring of the shut off switch is suppossed to help push the door out when it becomes unlocked and if that spring isn’t strong enough it may not open enough to engage the shut off switch.

The plastic bodies models with the knob on the top like the Lux Legacy just have a switch that the automatic control system engages which shuts off the motor and turns on the check bag light. The internal automatic control switch has to be reset by shutting the power switch off then back on again before the vacuum will run again. The bag door does not unlatch or open on these models. This is the way Electrolux of Canada made these machines and when the US and Canadian companies merged, they adopted the plastic body Canadian models for the lower and mid level machines scrapping the 1453 special model.

Jon



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