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Thread Number: 40104
/ Tag: Recent Vacuum Cleaners from past 20 years
Brittle ABS Plastic |
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| Post# 425755 5/20/2020 at 10:58 (1,436 days old) by DesiredName (Utah) | ||
Today I was working on a Dyson that I bought from a thrift store to clean up and resell. When I brought it home I set it on the floor and noticed a piece of plastic broke off. I took a closer look and pressed my finger on another piece and It broke off with no effort at all. I could tell the whole thing was extremely brittle. I took it outside and gently pressed my foot on the front of the floor head. It literally turned to little pieces under my foot with very little effort. This has been my experience with abs on multiple occasions. I wonder why this happens.
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| Post# 425768 , Reply# 1 5/20/2020 at 18:22 (1,436 days old) by huskyvacs (Gnaw Bone, Indiana) | ||
Same as vintage Macintosh computers, Saturn's SC and SW series cars, and other related miscellany that used it from the late 80s through the late 90s. It was a new and innovative cheap damage resistant plastic back then and very tough.
However the binder they used to hold the plastic together does not age well and after 15-20 years it starts breaking down and decomposing through just natural air exposure and gets fragile. All early Dysons suffer from this, mainly because Sir Dyson refused to use a sealant on the plastic as well as the plastic itself aging, a sealant would have at least held it together better. You have to be very careful with them and not bang them around or run them into things. Not sure why for whatever reason you continued to break parts off it intentionally - parts for these are very expensive for these early Dysons and hard to find - they do not show up on eBay often. It cost me $65 for a new (used) front shroud for my DC07 alone and that was after 2 years of hunting and waiting for one to pop up again. | ||
| Post# 425771 , Reply# 2 5/20/2020 at 19:11 (1,435 days old) by DesiredName (Utah) | ||
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Interesting, it's too bad they didn't use a better binder.This Dyson was so fragile that it was cracking under it's own weight. I figured I couldn't sell it to someone in that condition. I saved the motor,clutch and cord for other Dyson projects. It was amusing to be able to poke my finger through it in any spot I pressed on though haha. It reminded me of badly rotten wood.
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| Post# 425772 , Reply# 3 5/20/2020 at 19:19 (1,435 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina) | ||
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| Post# 425815 , Reply# 5 5/21/2020 at 15:33 (1,435 days old) by vacuumdevil (Vacuum Hell ) | ||
This is super normal for older plastic machines.
particularly Dyson had problems UV light could break it down very fast. If the machine was not one of the standard yellow or purple colors they actually had problems under warranty with them becoming brittle and breaking.
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| Post# 425817 , Reply# 6 5/21/2020 at 16:28 (1,435 days old) by DesiredName (Utah) | ||
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Vacuumdevil | ||
| Post# 425825 , Reply# 7 5/21/2020 at 18:53 (1,434 days old) by Oreck_XL (Brooklyn, New York 11211) | ||
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| Post# 425838 , Reply# 9 5/21/2020 at 21:43 (1,434 days old) by fan-of-fans (USA) | ||
I agree UV in particular exacerbates the problem. I've had a few vacuums with plastic that had faded to a yellow color, and the glossy outer layer had revealed a chalky texture. Usually I just part them out, since they weren't anything too special.
Also I have noticed the issue on older plastic bladed box fans. It seems to happen if they were in a garage or shed, or somewhere that wasn't temperature controlled. The blades did the same thing, glossy white surface changed to chalky finish that would scratch if you scraped at it. Sometimes edges would be chipped and blades would seem fragile and thin, like the bonding agent was gone. I also noticed sometimes they would get mildew from damp environments, not sure if that caused the problem or not. Like the mildew dissolving something in the plastic? | ||
| Post# 425846 , Reply# 10 5/22/2020 at 00:52 (1,434 days old) by MadMan (Chicago, IL, USA) | ||
The 'binder' is also called the plasicizer, as it is the chemical agent that gives the plastic its plasticity. Once that's gone, it's no longer plastic.
I'm sure by now the engineers know about this problem. This isn't isolated to Dyson, it's literally any ABS plastic made back then. No doubt they've been making improvements since then. | ||
Post# 425857 , Reply# 11 5/22/2020 at 10:52 (1,434 days old) by JustJunque  (Western MA) |
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Unrelated, but related | ||
| Post# 425869 , Reply# 13 5/22/2020 at 16:25 (1,434 days old) by Marks_here (_._) | ||
I had to look and 
Yes in my Cadillac Eldorado Opera Coupe I notice yellowing of the plastic trim by the windshield.
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| Post# 425888 , Reply# 16 5/22/2020 at 20:15 (1,433 days old) by Marks_here (_._) | ||
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Ok for the phone
since everything is now digital and that was a UHF signal it doesn't work but the CB still does. It was expensive back then, you would turn the dial to zero click the receiver twice, the operator would come on ask you for the number you want dialled then ask you for the number for it to be charged to which was my house phone (aka landline) and that's how this one worked. The Seacode was different it had a rotary dial with its own number, until the Pulsar took that over, I think lol.
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Post# 425890 , Reply# 17 5/22/2020 at 20:26 (1,433 days old) by JustJunque (Western MA) |
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Rob,
Same here. I also have a 1986 Pontiac that I left untouched in a garage for almost twenty years. I just hauled it out to get it back on the road last summer, and all the interior is still like new. The Regal has been decaying out in the elements, and the interior is toast. Mark, That's an impressive Eldorado. I don't imagine there are too many of those around. Beautiful interior too. My Pontiac was a really limited edition. Around 1200 made. Barry | ||
| Post# 425891 , Reply# 18 5/22/2020 at 20:41 (1,433 days old) by Marks_here (_._) | ||
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Not any more
I take it out every now and then for a drive, it doesn't do well going up steep roads and it definately stay inside when it rains which has been an every day occurance here.
Since this thread started I have been going through a bunch of things that are plastic, I've found that my Aerus Lux Guardian Ultra has now started to turn yellow but only on certain parts of it, the sides but not the front where the hose attaches and also the rear is still white. Also my Electrolux Ultralux Classic has yellowed, theback wheels, the top part where the off/on switch the entire thing, pistol grip hose and the sheath but the white trim around the blue front and also the bumper guards are still white. | ||
| Post# 425924 , Reply# 20 5/23/2020 at 15:04 (1,433 days old) by vacuumdevil (Vacuum Hell ) | ||
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@DesiredName it really depends on the manufacturer. Jason seemed to use their own mix of special plastic they called "liquid Steel" witch did seem to be some sort of cheaper ABS. I have several old Miele canisters that have not gotten gotten ridiculously brittle. I also have an old 1970s Electrolux upright where the plastic isn't particularly brittle and is of a mystery formulation.
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| Post# 425950 , Reply# 21 5/24/2020 at 01:22 (1,432 days old) by MadMan (Chicago, IL, USA) | ||
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Plumbing
Personally, when I'm plumbing, I'll use all pvc for drains and copper for hot/cold supply lines. The pvc pipe is never under pressure. However, some water supplies are better off with non-metallic pipes. Depends on your local water. If it's acidic, it'll leech the metal from the pipes, and your drinking water will have copper in it.
Polybutelyne deteriorates over time. I've heard the hot side goes faster, which makes sense. | ||
| Post# 425958 , Reply# 22 5/24/2020 at 02:16 (1,432 days old) by gregvacs28 (U.S.) | ||
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They all deteriorate over time, it's just a matter of which type deterioration you'll put up with. | ||
| Post# 425981 , Reply# 23 5/24/2020 at 14:46 (1,432 days old) by Oreck_XL (Brooklyn, New York 11211) | ||
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Give me copper every time!!! | ||
| Post# 425987 , Reply# 24 5/24/2020 at 19:19 (1,431 days old) by huskyvacs (Gnaw Bone, Indiana) | ||
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My house was built in 1949 and has copper plumbing with lead solder. The toilet and sewage pipes going vertical are solid cast iron. Everything is all perfectly intact and no signs of deterioration after 70 years. I only had one tiny pinhole leak on a random elbow in a random pipe in the basement 2 years ago. The original plumber forgot some solder on one 2mm section of the elbow and after 68 years it corroded and spring a leak. Had a plumber come out and it was fixed in 25 minutes.
The kitchen sink that had plumbing replaced in the late 1970's is black PVS or ABS - I forget how you tell - and I have to re-do it soon because they built it wrong and it's got about 150lbs (exaggerated) of buildup in the suspended pipe and I have to catch that before it breaks itself or it will be a stinky mess. | ||
| Post# 426001 , Reply# 26 5/25/2020 at 02:19 (1,431 days old) by MadMan (Chicago, IL, USA) | ||
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If you have old copper pipes with lead joints, DO NOT purge the lines. Calcium buildup is the only thing preventing you from getting lead poisoning. For that matter, really, copper poisoning either. The same reason the ancient Romans weren't poisoned by lead pipes, and the same reason I don't have lead poisoning. A lead pipe connects me to the water main.
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| Post# 426004 , Reply# 27 5/25/2020 at 05:28 (1,431 days old) by huskyvacs (Gnaw Bone, Indiana) | ||
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I have a water softener for hard water and it's all fine. The lead in solder is very negligible and mainly on the outside of the pipe between the joints, very little of it actually is on the inside of the pipe.
When I was in elementary school in the 1990s, it was a 1910's school, and all the drinking fountains were porcelain and still had the old signs installed from the days of segregation. All lead pipes and fixtures. Everyone was fine and it stayed that way until when the school was renovated in 2010 after being declared historical. PEX piping has been around residentally since the later half of the 2000's, nothing new. It is only feesable if you are building a new house from the ground up - it is not at all suitable for retrofitting due to the extensive drilling and damage required to run it through floors and behind walls, and the cost outweighs any benefits of it. Also because PEX is a new trade - most plumbers do not know anything at all how to run it properly to get the proper pressurization and to tune the manifold properly, so finding someone that can install PEX that is not a scammer and can do it properly is going to be very costly. Also if you have high chlorination in your city water (most municipalities do) PEX is not at all suitable. The chlorine will eat away the pipes (in retrospect I think this is why the cheap garden hoses I buy keep failing and tearing apart - the water is weakening the hose) www.repipeyourhouse.com/p... PS: The old lead pipe trick is to not run hot water before running cold water, as the heat expands the joints in the pipes and can expose the joint to backflow from the steamy hot water. That's why they go clankety clank when running hot water and then switching over to cold. If the pipes are not used on a daily basis and water stagnates, that's the only time you might get high lead levels (like a basement sink for example). Any other time it's no danger because as the pipes age and naturally oxidize from water exposure, the corrosion will coat the inside of the pipes and protect the water from the lead. If the local treatment plant of your city and the infrastructure is old and uses lead pipes and lead solder in their treatment facility, or if you get water from a well or cistern, there isn't much you can do about that. So even if you replaced all your plumbing with PEX, you could still be getting leaded water from the municipality. | ||
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