Thread Number: 38357  /  Tag: 80s/90s Vacuum Cleaners
Why Does Dyson Credit Himself As First Bagless Inventor?
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Post# 408195   4/16/2019 at 14:04 (1,836 days old) by repairman (Woodridge, IL)        

The FIRST bagless vacuum was invented by Rexair in 1936. So why is he taking credit for something that was created before he was born? The Model A even used a filter and no water.

Post# 408197 , Reply# 1   4/16/2019 at 14:27 (1,836 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)        

dysonman1's profile picture
Even before the model A, the Rexair used the power of two cyclones, working at different speeds. The dirt container was in the back, the motor was upside down, and the airflow/dirt hit the side of the rotating separator and was thrown into the top of the dirt bucket. The fine dust went round and round by the separator until it too was thrown into the dirt bucket. They had an after motor filter, it sat on four "legs" and was the machine they SHOULD have made.

Post# 408198 , Reply# 2   4/16/2019 at 14:28 (1,836 days old) by compactc9guy (Bathurst NB)        

compactc9guy's profile picture
What about Compact IEC whit there cyclonic action or FilterQueen.

Post# 408226 , Reply# 3   4/16/2019 at 22:40 (1,835 days old) by MadMan (Chicago, IL, USA)        

madman's profile picture
I imagine he's just full of himself.

Post# 408242 , Reply# 4   4/17/2019 at 08:02 (1,835 days old) by gottahaveahoove (Pittston, Pennsylvania, 18640)        
That could

gottahaveahoove's profile picture
easily be. It happens all the time.

Post# 408247 , Reply# 5   4/17/2019 at 08:31 (1,835 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)        

dysonman1's profile picture
To be fair, he had never seen a Rainbow when he invented the Dyson. The inspiration for the cyclone came from a saw mill, which uses a high efficiency cyclone to separate sawdust from the airflow so they can use the saw dust again. The cyclone is also used in industry for powder coating paint rooms. The overspray goes through the blowers and up to the huge Vulcan's ice cream cone on the roof of the building.

I was just explaining that to my good friend Greg Palmer last night. Those cyclones work correctly because the flow of air into the cyclone is constant. In a vacuum cleaner, the flow of air is always changing (using the crevice tool as opposed to vacuuming bare floors), making the high efficiency cyclone work more or (in many times) less effectively as different attachments are used.


Post# 408264 , Reply# 6   4/17/2019 at 16:32 (1,834 days old) by kirby519 (Wisconsin)        

Actually it was James Kirby that had the original Idea of a bag less or water trap vacuum even before Rainbow. James Kirby decided it would be to much hassle for the consumer to want to deal with it.

Post# 408374 , Reply# 7   4/20/2019 at 18:19 (1,831 days old) by Lesinutah (Utah)        
Hey

lesinutah's profile picture
Iec may have used it before Kirby. Howard Hughes had them cleaning commercial airplanes. I'm not positive I believe it was prior to WW2 they just started a year or two before then went into production for military. It could have been Kirby but cyclone technology has been around for a long time. I'd imagine that cyclone could be traced back millenniums.
It a great technology.
Les


Post# 408459 , Reply# 8   4/22/2019 at 15:48 (1,829 days old) by kloveland (Tulsa)        

kloveland's profile picture
I've heard Kirby had the original idea first myself. Jim Kirby had many patents. He would be a good person to research on the web.

Post# 408471 , Reply# 9   4/22/2019 at 19:30 (1,829 days old) by Lesinutah (Utah)        
Hey

lesinutah's profile picture
He had over 200 patents. You could print a volume of books with his patents. I'm not sure cyclone technology other than how it's formed is patented able. If it was patent by anyone within a 10 year span almost every vacuum had cyclone technology.
Les


Post# 408498 , Reply# 10   4/22/2019 at 23:37 (1,829 days old) by MadMan (Chicago, IL, USA)        

madman's profile picture
Les, you might be right. There was an ancient method of filtering water... can't recall when or where. Probably ancient Greece or Rome. It was effectively a slow cyclone but with water spinning around instead of air.

Post# 408569 , Reply# 11   4/24/2019 at 00:46 (1,828 days old) by Lesinutah (Utah)        
Hey

lesinutah's profile picture
We agree again. Toilets I believe use cyclone.
It's truly a great technology.
Les


Post# 408624 , Reply# 12   4/25/2019 at 10:18 (1,827 days old) by compactc9guy (Bathurst NB)        

compactc9guy's profile picture
There are many Bagless cleaner or one that use cyclonic action , Compact Tristar and Filter Queen and of course Rexair Rainbow and of course Fantom .I Think hes just tooting his own horn to be honest i sold Dyson at walmart most of em felt cheap plastic over price and fell apart after a short time il stick to my heavy Compact thank you .Dyson = Die soon lol

Post# 408647 , Reply# 13   4/25/2019 at 20:52 (1,826 days old) by kirby519 (Wisconsin)        

Jim Kirby
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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For the American labor leader, see James Kirby. For the baseball player, see Jim Kirby (baseball).
James B. Kirby (September 28, 1884 – June 9, 1971) was an American inventor and self-taught electrical engineer who focused his career on "eliminating the drudgery of housework". He is known mostly for inventing the Kirby vacuum cleaner and the wringerless washing machine.

In 1935, the famous news reporter and radio personality Lowell Thomas wrote a book entitled "The Man Who Revolutionized the American Household" about Jim Kirby and his drive to harness electricity to ease household chores. Much of Lowell’s work was devoted to describing Kirby’s whimsical, innovative home in Richfield, Ohio. Kirby had purchased the land in 1919 at the age of 35 after making his fortune with the invention of the washing machine spin cycle. He devised and patented a system of filtration dams that would keep silt out of the new lake he created. He situated his house on a hillside overlooking the lake and powered it with an experimental hydroelectric mill. In 1923 he constructed a new type of dance hall at the head of the lake that not only had a “sprung floor” but actually had industrial–strength springs supporting the floor joists.

Kirby's father James D. Kirby was a Great Lakes marine engineer. His mother, Sylvia Bigelow Kirby, was descended from early Richfield pioneers. Kirby grew up in Cleveland's southwest side on Marvin Avenue with his younger brother Walter and an orphaned cousin, Bessie. Kirby got an early start on engineering when he attended Electricity And Magic classes at the YMCA. While attending Lincoln High School he worked as a lamplighter, where he walked up and down Scranton road and Denison avenue lighting and snuffing out the street lights for which he earned $16.50 a month. He would often also go to downtown Cleveland and "stuff" newspapers for a dollar a night.

He invented his first vacuum cleaner, called the Domestic Cyclone, in 1906, which was a hand-powered canister cleaner that used a water filtration system. His first portable vacuum cleaner for home use was manufactured and distributed by Franz Premier Electric which was founded to produce Kirby’s vacuum in 1912. Premier was later acquired by General Electric which continued to utilize Kirby’s innovations. In 1915 Kirby invented the washing machine spin cycle. The LaunDRYette Company was founded to manufacture this invention. The LaunDRYette washing machines became very popular and Kirby’s share of the profits allowed him to buy and expand his farm in Richfield.


Post# 408657 , Reply# 14   4/25/2019 at 22:48 (1,826 days old) by Lesinutah (Utah)        
Umm

lesinutah's profile picture
It says nowhere he invented cyclone vacuum technology. I'm versed on a fair number of his patents. A007kirbyman told me a small portion of his patents. He revolutionized alot of industries people aren't aware of. I'd say at least 4 or 5 industries not businesses industries still practice and use his patterns.
If you are trying to impress on how much of a genius Kirby was just stop. If you want to be impressed let bill just post some of his research. He has done alot and I mean maybe more than anyone in the world. He posts on this board.
Spare the rest as Kirby needs no explanation unless you truly want a a few thousand pages from the expert in the area.
Feel free to chime in bill but maybe you shouldn't I understand the magnitude of the research but I'm not sure King Kong his family all on steroids could quantify as a comparable visual simile.
He didn't invent cyclone vaccuum technology. He just revolutionized the world more than any man not named Hawking or Eistein in the last 200 years.
Les


Post# 408678 , Reply# 15   4/26/2019 at 10:40 (1,826 days old) by kirby519 (Wisconsin)        
@lesinutah

Well excuse me for chiming in on the discussion.

Post# 408679 , Reply# 16   4/26/2019 at 11:13 (1,826 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
If I may:

I think that Kirby519 was making the distinction that Jim Kirby invented the "bagless" or "water trap" vacuum.  That is since the heading on this thread is "Why Does Dyson Credit Himself as the first bagless inventor?"

Then it Rexair/Rainbow was mentioned.  The heading nor the drift was not regarding cyclone, hence it was pointed out that Jim Kirby had a "bagless" water trap vacuum prior to Rexair, and Dyson.

 

but Hey


Post# 408693 , Reply# 17   4/26/2019 at 18:31 (1,825 days old) by Lesinutah (Utah)        
Hey

lesinutah's profile picture
I thought you were trying to educate us. I mentioned prior we need no educating.
Les


Post# 408698 , Reply# 18   4/26/2019 at 19:12 (1,825 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        

This post has been removed by the member who posted it.



Post# 408700 , Reply# 19   4/26/2019 at 20:59 (1,825 days old) by kirby519 (Wisconsin)        
@kirbysthebest

Thank you.



Post# 408723 , Reply# 20   4/26/2019 at 23:23 (1,825 days old) by Lesinutah (Utah)        

This post has been removed by the webmaster.



Post# 408731 , Reply# 21   4/27/2019 at 01:05 (1,825 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
Your post are offensive

So I am reporting them as such.
You have no right to tell others when, what, and how to post.


Post# 408736 , Reply# 22   4/27/2019 at 01:35 (1,825 days old) by compactc9guy (Bathurst NB)        

compactc9guy's profile picture
we can al lagree to dis a gree i think but lets keep things clwean no dust bunnies in the post per say .....

In my opinion bag less cleaners were and are Compact Tristar Filter Queen Rexair Rainbow then came along fantom and dyson .Diffrent Vacuum for diffrent folks .


Post# 408767 , Reply# 23   4/27/2019 at 14:34 (1,825 days old) by jake1234 (greasby)        
Bagless vacuums

The reason that Dyson calls himself the creator of the worlds first bagless vacuum cleaner is because his design was the very first one that truly took off. All the other bagless models listed on here like the tristar compact and the rexair machine from the 1930's are very old machines that never really took off and didn't sell in huge numbers. These machines for many people were too complicated to use and they didn't want the fuss so they were happy to stick with a far more common widely known bagged machine. Plus, Dyson got loads of his marketing campaign and advertising of the earlier machines done on television which wasn't nearly as popular when the other models mentioned above were in the shops. So these older machines would have had to rely on confusing home demonstrations and the odd housewife flicking through a brochure and not really paying attention to a vacuum that was confusing and different and probably cost three times as much as the basic bagged model of the time. Dysons first machines were a lot simpler to use than the older bagless variants like the rexair and although still expensive would of probably still cost less than the rexair in the 30's. You also have to remember that when the older bagless machines came out there wasn't nearly as half as much fuss made over the bagless design as Dyson made with his machines as he went out of his way to make this his top selling point. Overall, I think one huge selling point of the Dyson that put it above the rest was how quickly the news spread that the machine was simple and reasonably affordable and decent to use. As I said before Dyson went out of his way to shout about his machine and boy did he shout! He went to public announcements, aired adverts for the DC01, DC02 and the DC04 (He never made an advert for the DC03 which I could never understand as this was the fanciest machine of them all and had the most features). Done in shop demonstrations, had them published in magazines and newspapers and even in the early days they wiggled there way into the Argos catalogue which is massively convenient to use. In conclusion, for all his hard work and effort that he put into the thing, come on folks, I think through gritted teeth we can give him the tittle of the worlds first bagless vacuum cleaner. I mean, if I had been through all that he had been through I think I would feel like I had just invented the worlds first bagless vacuum cleaner aswell. :)

Post# 408771 , Reply# 24   4/27/2019 at 15:14 (1,824 days old) by kirby519 (Wisconsin)        
@jake1234

The aforementioned for runners of the bag-less and bagged vacuums were sold mostly door to door. That was well before television or the internet. Word of mouth sold vacuums as well as print advertisements got the prospective buyers attention. Or were sold in appliance stores where you bought your stove, refrigerator and washing machine.

Also consider that homes and farms at the time were just getting electrical power. Didn't have electric at your home at the time. There was no use for an appliance that required electricity to use it. Cities had power well before outlining areas.


Post# 408816 , Reply# 25   4/28/2019 at 09:11 (1,824 days old) by jake1234 (greasby)        
kirby519

I know thats the point I am trying to make. Because the older machines were sold well before television took off and the internet wa even invented they mainly had to rely on word of mouth and in home demonstrations whereas Dyson had more ways of marketing his machine. Where I live, all the houses had electric in the 30's and all the houses on my road were built with electric current. Around me, the very first houses started getting electric installed in them around 1910.


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