Thread Number: 24995
Hoover Windtunnel dirt cup problems
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Post# 281086   5/19/2014 at 15:08 (3,622 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        

niclonnic's profile picture
Hello everybody -- I'm new to Vacuumland. I've been a long time lurker, and just decided to join today.

I've been using a Hoover Windtunnel 2 Rewind Pet that I got back in July of 2013. Lately it has started to fall apart. I did a little vacuuming yesterday with it. I went to empty the dirt cup as usual, but suddenly, the bottom flap fell off! Part of the hinge on the dirt cup cracked off without me even knowing it. Basically I was not happy to see that happen. I've had this vacuum for 10 months, and have now noticed this is the second part that has broken (first was the cord clip on the handle).

Does anyone know how to fix the dirt cup? If not, should I go back to my Dyson DC07 Animal?

Any solutions would be greatly appreciated.

I am attaching pictures of the vacuum below.


Post# 281087 , Reply# 1   5/19/2014 at 15:10 (3,622 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Pic 2

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A closer view of the dirt cup. It's hard to see, but the hinge is to the right of the picture.

Post# 281088 , Reply# 2   5/19/2014 at 15:12 (3,622 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Pic 3

niclonnic's profile picture
A close-up of the cracked hinge.

Post# 281089 , Reply# 3   5/19/2014 at 15:13 (3,622 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Pic 4

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Me holding the cracked off hinge piece. It's on my index finger.

Post# 281094 , Reply# 4   5/19/2014 at 16:16 (3,622 days old) by kirbylux77 (London, Ontario, Canada)        
Warranty

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If this vacuum is only 10 months old, & the cord clip has also broken off, I think you would have a strong case to have Hoover replace your dirt cup under warranty. Your vacuum doesn't look like it has been abused. Even if you do have to pay to get another dirt cup, I would just bite the bullet & do it! The vacuum is only 10 months old, has LOTS of life left in it, & would outclean your Dyson.

Rob


Post# 281096 , Reply# 5   5/19/2014 at 16:21 (3,622 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
NEVER go back to Dyson!

super-sweeper's profile picture

Even the plastic HOOVER could out-clean a Dyson! Try your best at the warranty for claim, and if that doesn't work, try super-glue!Wink


Post# 281106 , Reply# 6   5/19/2014 at 17:38 (3,622 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Rob and Super-sweeper...

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I'll tell my parents about this issue and see what they say. Because of the way the dirt cup is designed, debris ALWAYS gets stuck in there, particularly if you have a dog that sheds a lot (I have 3 dogs of varying sizes plus a cat). I have to slap the side of the cup to get all the dirt out, which is probably the reason why the hinge broke. I'll try the super-glue method sometime.

As for the cord clip, it broke back in January of this year. I used super-glue to mend it together. It took a couple days for the glue to bond, but it held very well. The clip hasn't broken to this day. I thought that was a normal issue, due to pushing the cord into the cord clip before vacuuming, and pulling it out when finished.

Yes, the Hoover has out-cleaned my Dyson. I ran a little test last year to prove this. First, I vacuumed my downstairs floor with my Dyson really well. Then I went over the same area with the Hoover and got a handful of pet hair out of the carpet, plus a small pile of dust and sand. However, I still use my Dyson once in a while, mainly for attachment use (it has a longer hose and wand than the Hoover). I have repeated this test a few times.

Lastly, the Hoover usually costs $140, but my dad got it for free from the Amazon Vine program. For those of you who don't know, Amazon Vine is an invitation-only program where you get free products sent to you. After you try out a product from Vine, you write a review about it. I have attached a link here that explains the Amazon Vine program.


CLICK HERE TO GO TO niclonnic's LINK


Post# 281172 , Reply# 7   5/20/2014 at 09:46 (3,622 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

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I have had this happen with two Hoover bagless uprights that I have owned. A friend had same model I had and her's did too. I try to be careful with my Windtunnel Air, it feels like it could too:(

Post# 281184 , Reply# 8   5/20/2014 at 12:58 (3,622 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        
Nick, why put up with a plastic vacuum...

sptyks's profile picture

That will last only a couple of years? 

For what you spent on that Windtunnel, you could purchase a nice used Kirby G series vac on ebay that will last for another 3 decades or longer. Yes it has a bag but it is quite large and will last months before needing to be changed. There is no need to empty a messy dirt cup or wash filters with a Kirby.


Post# 281247 , Reply# 9   5/20/2014 at 19:58 (3,621 days old) by jscarlato (Clairton, PA)        
If you want to stay withHoover . . .

And not spend money to break your budget, abandon the plastic bagless Hoover vacs and go for a Windtunnel self-propelled vac with a HEPA bag. Yes, they're plastic, too, but they are super powerful. Yes, they are heavier, but they'll suck your carpets cleaner than any Dyson. The Windtunnel self-propelled vac was designed by Hoover years ago when Hoover was still its own company before selling out to TTI and the cheap mass market. Also, don't be fooled by the 12-amp baloney used in advertising. Amps don't clean carpets. Brushing and airflow clean carpets. The suggestion to seek out a nice Kirby from the Generation series is good advice. Go for the G6 or higher. You'll wind up with a super machine that is efficient and comes with more and better cleaning tools than a Hoover.

Post# 281258 , Reply# 10   5/20/2014 at 21:36 (3,621 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Well...

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Suckolux, which Hoover bagless uprights have had this problem? I'm hoping your Windtunnel Air doesn't have that same issue. How is your friend's vacuum holding up? Maybe the dirt cup's hinge is a widespread issue.

Sptyks, I live with my parents & older sister. My parents pay for the vacuums we use. I'm the main person who vacuums in the house. However, this Windtunnel was FREE from the Amazon Vine program. My dad did not pay for it. I have never used a Kirby, although I have a couple neighbors who each own Kirby Sentria vacuums. I saw a Kirby Generation 3 at a yard sale last weekend, but I didn't take it. In the end, my family prefers bagless vacuums, having started with a Fantom Fury back in the late 90s. Unfortunately, my parents got rid of the Fantom when we moved to my new house in 2001. Since then, following the Fury, my parents bought a few bagless vacuums over the years, including Dirt Devil, Bissell and Dyson. We received the Windtunnel back in July of 2013, like I said.

Jscarlato, thanks for the advice, but I'm not getting that Hoover Self-Propelled Windtunnel or a Kirby in the future. I am not a fan of bagged vacuums. I enjoy seeing what's come out of the carpet. Plus, we don't have to keep buying bags. Also, I found out that using the attachments on a Kirby is a cumbersome process. I'd much rather have a bagless upright with on-board attachments.

So yeah, that's all I have to say for now.


Post# 281266 , Reply# 11   5/20/2014 at 22:39 (3,621 days old) by TASE (Colorado)        

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Well, then you're at a loss. A lot of plastic machines end up like this. Little pieces break bit by bit until it's no longer a vacuum but a mass of plastic that can barely hold itself together.

 

While I am a Kirby man myself, I can tell you that this quality of a machine is probably some of the best you will see out of these plastic machines.

 

If you can, contact Hoover about this machine. Finding parts is going to be hard since this machine is so cheap.

 

Does the flap still stay on if you press it with your hand? It may not be ideal but that's the best you are going to get.

 

I wouldn't know how to fix this besides taking a wooden dowell of the same circumference and molding strong putty around it. That may work, but it's such a cheap machine at $140 MSRP that most people wouldn't bother fixing it up.


Post# 281274 , Reply# 12   5/20/2014 at 23:33 (3,621 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Hmm...

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First of all, it depends on the price. My dad bought a Bissell Cleanview back in early 2004, and it was a great vacuum, costing only $80. After a few years of use, the handle release pedal broke and the vacuum would no longer stand upright. It still worked great, but I decided we needed a new vacuum.

My dad picked up a Dyson DC07 Animal shortly after Christmas 2007 for $500 and it became our daily driver for years to come. 6 years later, not a SINGLE plastic piece has broken. Talk about quality! The Dyson is still going strong, but has been relegated to occasional use now.

After getting the Hoover Windtunnel last summer, it became our new daily driver because it out-cleaned the Dyson. It held up really well...until 6 months later, the cord clip broke off. I managed to fix it using super-glue. It takes a couple days to bond, but it held really well. It is still holding up to this day.

The dirt cup hinge just broke on Sunday. The flap still stays on when I insert it back into the hinge and press it shut. On Monday night, I took some super-glue, applied some liberally on the broken hinge, pressed the broken piece on and let it dry for about 19 hours. When I came home from work earlier this afternoon, it seemed to hold really well. BUT, I went to tilt the flap away from the dirt cup, and the broken hinge piece just came flying right back off. I am going to try to talk my parents into taking the vacuum into the repair shop.

However, I devised a workaround:
I am going to continue using the Windtunnel. When I go to empty the dirt cup, I am going to twist the cyclonic filter assembly counterclockwise and remove it from the dirt cup to empty it. Then I won't have to bang it as much.

Oh, and on a side note, the retractable cord hasn't broken yet. I expected it to be the first part that breaks, but I was proven wrong! It still extends and retracts the same way it did from day one.


Post# 281293 , Reply# 13   5/21/2014 at 08:34 (3,621 days old) by joshdonnell ()        

Well since you don't care for bagged vacuums .... What about a Rainbow ?
They are much better made then big box store vacuums, and no bag to buy,
You can maybe find one for cheap, like eBay. They make great vacuums, also the Sirena brand which is like Rainbow , i heard were great vacuums at half the price.


Post# 281297 , Reply# 14   5/21/2014 at 09:11 (3,621 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        
That's the problem...

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with cheap plastic vacuums. They simply start falling apart after a couple of years. Will your dad always be able to get free vacuums?

If not, then you'll be buying a new vacuum every 2-3 years. Almost all plastic vacuums are now made in China. Even the Dysons are now made in Malasia. These plastic Chinese vacuums are designed so that either they start falling apart or the motor burns out within 3 years or so. That is because they want you to spend another $100 to $150 on a new vac every few years.

 

This will not happen with a Kirby or other fine American made vacuum which are designed to last decades. So if you buy 3 plastic vacs in ten years you will spend $400 to $500. For $300 or less you can get a used Kirby which will never need to be replaced if maintained properly.

 

If you want to see the dirt the Kirby picks up, you can purchase a Kirby Dirtmeter which attaches where the bag goes. You will see exactly what your Kirby picks up. You can get a Dirtmeter online for just $18.00.

 

 


Post# 281300 , Reply# 15   5/21/2014 at 09:29 (3,621 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Joshdonnell...

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The Rainbow's water filtration technology sounds cool. However, I found out that it requires a lot of maintenance -- emptying and cleaning the water tank after every use (and letting it dry VERY thoroughly, otherwise it develops odors, germs and bacteria).

I already have to deal with this when I use my Bissell Lift-Off Deep Cleaner. With that machine after EVERY use, I have to take the entire thing apart and clean it very thoroughly to keep it in good condition and make it last longer (I've had it for two years). Then I lay everything out to dry completely, and then put it back together.

From my viewpoint, a Rainbow is not very practical for my uses.


Post# 281311 , Reply# 16   5/21/2014 at 10:23 (3,621 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)        

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The problem with the dirt cup happened because you bang it to get the dirt out. That jars the open dirt cup bottom, causing the plastic to break. Happens all the time, but it's not the fault of the cleaner. Since you have no money invested in it, just buy a new dirt cup. You can get one from hoover dot com. Try a different method of emptying it. This is what I recommend to customers: Remove the dirt cup and tap the closed cup on the floor, which brings all the dirt to the bottom. Once the bottom is OPEN, do NOT bang on the side of the bin. All the dirt should fall out without hitting the open bin.

Be SURE to clean the pre-motor filter at least once a month.



Post# 281315 , Reply# 17   5/21/2014 at 11:19 (3,621 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)        
Tom

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Is Correct many people love to just bang dirt containers to empty and all it takes is paitence and extra care . Hoover nor other manufacturers will warrant abuse and banging a dirt container to empty is abuse .


Dan


Post# 281332 , Reply# 18   5/21/2014 at 13:48 (3,621 days old) by dustin (Jackson, MI)        

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It seems like such a poor design to *have* to bang the cup to empty it! Any bagless machine I currently have does not need to be beaten to empty it- either open the top or bottom, depending on the machine, and the dirt falls into the trash. I did have a Hoover bagless with a similarly designed dirt bin, and it either had to be beaten on the trash can or had to have the cyclone removed from the top to get lint and dog hair out. Hoover needs to do more testing *before* their machines go out for sale. If it is less than a year old, it should be under warranty anyway.

Post# 281334 , Reply# 19   5/21/2014 at 13:54 (3,621 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)        
Dustin

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No manufacture will cover abuse and that's considered abuse . I have several bag less Hoovers that my great friend John Gregory of Sweeper Central gifted me I push the release and out falls the dirt NEVER a problem of anything getting stuck inside and I NEVER bang the container either .

Dan


Post# 281349 , Reply# 20   5/21/2014 at 17:39 (3,620 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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It doesn't matter where a vacuum cleaner is made - if it has a bottom trapdoor release with a weak hinge, then common sense would tell you not to bang the bin to dislodge the dirt. If the dirt gets stuck then use the crevice tool to push the dirt out or use your fingers.

It is never a clean business with a bagless vacuum cleaner. Many user manuals also suggest using the on board dusting brush to clean the filter shroud too.


Post# 281351 , Reply# 21   5/21/2014 at 17:42 (3,620 days old) by dustin (Jackson, MI)        

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The machine *I* had an issue emptying was a Hoover Fusion, which had basically the same bin as the one above -however- it never broke. The problem was that dog hair, strings, fuzz, etc. would get caught above the lower cyclone "deflector" and would either have to be jarred loose, or the entire cyclone assemby would need to removed from the top. I never had an issue with the hinge. I never really cared for the vacuum, it had terrible filtration, and smelled, but it was given to me so I used it at my church for about a year until it was stolen. I think it is a design flaw to have -that- specific part made out of plastic so thin. Surprised it didn't break sooner. That wouldn't have happened on a Kirby :}

Post# 281360 , Reply# 22   5/21/2014 at 18:51 (3,620 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Well, guys...

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Sptyks, it depends on if my dad looks at vacuums on Amazon.com. Then, when the Amazon Vine newsletter comes up, he might get another free vacuum to try out and review. I have never had a motor burn out on any vacuum I've owned. I found a replacement dirt cup online at Hoover.com. It costs $37.40; however, it's sold out. Screw it!

Dysonman1, to clarify, the way the dirt cup is designed, there's a "lip" at the bottom of the inner cyclone assembly that traps dirt and won't let it fall out immediately, so I HAD to bang my hand on the side to get all the dirt out. My alternate method of emptying is this: twist the cyclone assembly counterclockwise and remove it from the dirt cup. Dump the dirt cup the traditional way into the trash can. Put the cyclone assembly back in and twist clockwise to lock it. And yes, I do rinse the pre-motor filter every two months. It collects hair and stuff that the dual-cyclonic action can't separate.

Dan, I have also banged the canister on my Dyson DC07, and the bottom flap has never broken. With the Dyson, everything falls out when I empty it. You probably don't have any pets in your home. I have 3 dogs and a cat, and that's why their hair ALWAYS gets stuck. My vacuum always collects dust on the outside of the dirt cup when I empty it.

Sebo_fan, I could've also pulled out the dirt by hand, but that's a messy job. With my Dyson, I would use the on-board brush tool to clean the shroud when necessary.

Below is a picture of the dirt cup, with the bottom flap open. It's kind of hard to see, but there is a lip that traps dirt.


Post# 281361 , Reply# 23   5/21/2014 at 18:53 (3,620 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Another pic

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A better picture of the cyclone assembly, removed from the dirt cup. You can see how the bottom of the assembly has a skirt shape to prevent dirt from falling out.

Post# 281523 , Reply# 24   5/23/2014 at 03:37 (3,619 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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niclonnic - "I could've also pulled out the dirt by hand, but that's a messy job. With my Dyson, I would use the on-board brush tool to clean the shroud when necessary..."

Well I have to pull dirt off my Hoover cordless dust buster hand held on occasion- sadly its a joy of ALL bagless cyclonic vacs, whether they are compact or full size. It is reality over the fantasy of brands who use HEPA as a smoke screen.

My Hoover Slalom (NLOS European upright) suffers from the same problem - dust gets stuck right at the top of the shroud filter and there's a poor hinge on the bottom release at the back that seldom opens properly. There's an inner ring that often falls out covered in dust too that has to be cleaned off. This is really where a dust bag makes a lot more sense.


Post# 281589 , Reply# 25   5/23/2014 at 19:23 (3,618 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Yeah

niclonnic's profile picture
I have to bang out the filters on my hand vacs (Black & Decker Platinum Dust Buster and Bissell Auto-Mate corded hand vac) every now and then. I have owned two filter-based bagless vacuums (Dirt Devil and Bissell) and my parents have had to bang out and shake the filters on those machines (I was too young to use a vacuum back then). Luckily, they did it outside. I agree with you about this "joy."

With my Windtunnel, I have a similar issue: Dust and hair gets stuck in the bottom of the inner cyclone (the red cone), and has to be pulled out by hand. You can kind of see it in the two pictures above. However, I just have to wash my hands afterward. I'm not a fan of bagged vacuums.


Post# 281636 , Reply# 26   5/24/2014 at 05:00 (3,618 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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Why are you not a fan of bagged vacuums? Surely that would eliminate touching the dust and having to deal with messy filters?

Post# 281670 , Reply# 27   5/24/2014 at 14:41 (3,618 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
Hold the Rotary phone!

super-sweeper's profile picture

Did I just see someone call a DYSON "QUALITY"? Who's paying you to tell us THAT information?! My DC07 looks like it's fallen off a plane-Every plastic bit that could possibly break is broken-And I didn't vacuum the house with it more than 5 times! Maybe 2.

Hose release, suction tube thingy, the bin and it's components, carry handle, the list goes on! The FANTOM on the other hand hasn't broken a BIT in 20 years of household service! Fantom proves plastic isn't always cheap, but Dyson sets the bar for how cheap plastic goes! Have you seen the newer Dyson uprights (I wouldn't care to see them if Dyson didn't flood the air-ways with all his plastic status symbol propaganda!)-They BEND from the force of the user, Bend! What vacuum on earth should BEND itself under normal use!?


Post# 281671 , Reply# 28   5/24/2014 at 14:48 (3,618 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

A Dyson is no better quality than the average TTI machine - they are both mass produced in the Far East, but Dyson has the cheek to think his machines are worth 3 times the value of  the average TTI machine. TTI might produce budget machines, but they do have the decency to charge budget prices.


Post# 281673 , Reply# 29   5/24/2014 at 14:54 (3,618 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Does that Windtunnel have the changeover valve like on my Vax Mach 9 pictured below - they look very similar styled machines. (Yes, I know, its a Dyson - even I own a few of them)


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Post# 281683 , Reply# 30   5/24/2014 at 16:19 (3,617 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        
I just don't understand...

sptyks's profile picture

why anyone would prefer a messy dirty bagless vacuum over a nice clean bagged machine. You only need to replace the bag once every few months and there's absolutely no mess or dirty hands when you do replace the bag. Most bags are only $2.00-$3.00 each so cost shouldn't be an issue. Again - I just don't get it!

 

 

 

 

 

 


Post# 281684 , Reply# 31   5/24/2014 at 16:25 (3,617 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Its the power of Dyson's clever marketing - he has had a very powerful influence on people's opinions about bagged vacs. You could say that he has "brainwashed" them like a clever hypnotist.


Post# 281685 , Reply# 32   5/24/2014 at 16:25 (3,617 days old) by TASE (Colorado)        

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Even if you're cheap you can buy the brown paper bags for a Kirby for $1.12 a bag! The cloth HEPA bags are a lot more expensive though.

 

Also, my Kenmore PowerMate bags were $3 a piece and the vacuum cleans 10 times better than my Dyson DC07...


Post# 281686 , Reply# 33   5/24/2014 at 16:29 (3,617 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

The problem is that people don't realise that bagless vacs will cost them more in filters than a bagged vac would, and that bags don't clog now like the old single layer paper bags that Dyson refers to when he goes on about bags losing suction. Dyson is a very clever businessman, and will tell you the earth was square if it made him a profit!


Post# 281693 , Reply# 34   5/24/2014 at 17:03 (3,617 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
Square Earths,

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People try to save $$$$$ (Or ££££££, Mind you Mr.AlexHoovers!) in the modern "El-Cheapo" economy. I agree about Dyson's brain-washing, HOOVER got it right when he told Mr.Dyson square in the face, "Bags have always been best, Bags will always be best!". Now if only people would see the faults in Dyson's words, and buy back into Bags! But that's in a perfect would, and in a perfect world, HOOVERS are metal and everyone drives a Bel-Air!Tongue out


Post# 281697 , Reply# 35   5/24/2014 at 17:41 (3,617 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        
57 Chevy...

Specially for you Super_sweeper, and this one was customised here in the UK!


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Post# 281699 , Reply# 36   5/24/2014 at 18:02 (3,617 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

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I watched that Chevy be done over a while back on Wheeler Dealer.

Post# 281703 , Reply# 37   5/24/2014 at 18:47 (3,617 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
Thanks!

super-sweeper's profile picture

That Bel-Air is lovely-My only complaint is the wheels they put on the thing! Chrome Hubcaps would be lovely. I cringe when I see the youth of today (And i'm still a youth!) restore a Beautiful old car, And then drop gigantic, shining tires and a sub-woofer into it. I find it disrespectful to the car itself! 

 

I attempted uploading a Bel-Air in turquoise, Only since the new multiple picture uploading feature was installed, I find I cannot upload any!Laughing


Post# 281708 , Reply# 38   5/24/2014 at 20:30 (3,617 days old) by Loganvac (Kennett Square, Pennsylvania)        
Anyway...

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Why use TTI Hoover or a Dyson? We all know they are crappy cheaply built plastic vacs, ( just stating the obvious). Do you have the option of buying a good used vacuum like a Kirby or a Rainbow? Or if you want to spend a larger amount of money on a vacuum that will last you many years, I suggest a good well built American brand of vacuum, Riccar.

Post# 281742 , Reply# 39   5/25/2014 at 01:53 (3,617 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        

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Sebo_fan, the reasons why I'm not a fan of bagged vacuums are:
- You have to keep buying bags
- They lose suction as they fill up
- If you run out of bags, you can't vacuum
- It's hard to figure out what kind of bag your vacuum uses
- Throwing away bags creates waste

Every vacuum my family has owned following the Fantom Fury has been bagless.

Super-sweeper, nobody paid me to tell me that information. It was my own experience. Please do not hate me for this. My own DC07 Animal, which has been used for countless hours since December 2007, is still FULLY intact and runs PERFECTLY with NO problems whatsoever. My family had a Fantom Fury for a few years and ended up getting rid of it when we moved to my new house in 2001. Yes, I have seen the newer Dysons. My grandmother had a DC40 Animal for about 6 months and then returned it to Costco because it (gasp!) lost suction. In addition, there were a few things I didn't like about it. Sure, I liked the ball steering, but the machine felt cheap. The vacuum locks into the upright position, but it doesn't always work and can fall to the floor. In addition, when using the hose to clean stairs, the vacuum was wobbling. Not a very good design for a $400 vacuum. It hurts me to say this, but Dyson is declining. I will defend Dyson constantly every day; lately, I can't do it anymore because of this.

Madabouthoovers, my DC07 was sturdier than the Windtunnel, surprisingly. And no, my Windtunnel doesn't have a changeover valve. Like most vacuums, all of the dirt goes through the attachment hose when cleaning carpets and floors. Also, my family has never purchased any replacement filters over the years.

Sptyks, I prefer bagless because I get to see what I've picked up. Plus, bagless vacuums are always ready to go.

Loganvac, my family has always bought vacuums from regular stores. We have never owned any high-end vacuums from door-to-door salesmen or niche markets. I'm not buying a Kirby or Rainbow because both brands cost a fortune on eBay. I'm also not buying a Riccar. I'm not trying to be a jerk, but here's what I found out with those vacuums:

- Kirby requires a cumbersome process in order to use attachments
- Rainbow's water filtration system requires lots of maintenance
- Riccar vacuums are bagged; bags are expensive and hard to find

Here are some pictures of my vacuums.


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Post# 281743 , Reply# 40   5/25/2014 at 02:20 (3,617 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Thanks for posting those pics of your Windtunnel - although it looks similar to my Vax Mach 9 - there are more differences than I thought when looking at the back of it - even though both are TTI machines.

I realise that bagged machines are not for everyone, and as long as you are happy with bagless that's all that matters really.

 

FWIW, I found the Dyson DC07 a pretty good machine, and worked on many of these in the past - They do suffer from brittle plastics though when they get old, and especially if they are stored in the sunlight rather than a dark closet. They are also unforgivably noisy, which was addressed in the DC14 when the cyclones were inverted. Nevertheless I would rather use a DC07 than a DC41, and indeed, I still own a couple of DC07's.

You make valid points about Kirby - whilst I own 4 Kirbys, they are best for carpet cleaning, and not very quick or convenient for hose use, and yes, in the UK bags are very expensive for Kirbys.

 

Bags are harder to obtain than they used to be, with many stores now not stocking them any more, but they can still be obtained online, but they are much better at filtering than they used to be, if a bit more expensive.


Post# 281777 , Reply# 41   5/25/2014 at 10:02 (3,617 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture
Each to their own but LOL it always amuses me when someone says, with reference to bagged vacuums:

"You have to keep buying bags." Like you have to keep buying drive belts or filters for ANY upright vacuum, or of course just filters for the canister type.

"They lose suction as they fill up" - sorry, not with all brands and not in my experience.

"If you run out of bags you can't vacuum" - if you wash your bagless vac filter you have to wait 24 hours for it dry out before using it - in the same time you can shop around 24 hours to buy as many bags as you want - and some bags are reusable after the first empty.

"Its hard to figure what kind of bag your vacuum uses" - not with every brand - and it can be just as hard to figure out what drive belt or filter your bagless vac may require…

"Throwing away bags creates waste" - just like using a polythene carrier bag to put the bagless dust in that won't decompose as fast as a paper bag…


Post# 281785 , Reply# 42   5/25/2014 at 12:27 (3,617 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
Dyson told you

super-sweeper's profile picture

Those things about BAGS as a way to make people see past the plasticy cheapness of his 'new' cyclonic vacuum. Dyson didn't even invent cyclonic action, he didn't invent the clear bin, either. Both credits go to Rainbow, has had cyclonic action and clear bins since the 1950s. Bags are in no way expensive, common models such as HOOVER Elites, Concepts, Convertibles made after 1981, and most HOOVER uprights of the 1990s and 1980s at any dollar general store for 99¢. Of course those aren't the best bags (quality and original HOOVER bags from when HOOVER was the American superpower it was can be found at thrift shops for pennies on the dollar). Genuine modern bags from TTI are not the same as the original Green bags, but the modern consumer couldn't care less. Those bags can be had at any vacuum Shop.of course,but many modern consumers wouldn't care to make a stop over vacuum bags (although they WILL have to when they get upset at Wal-Mart for not carrying the replacement $40 filters their 'money saving' bagless consumes every 6 months). Many retailers carries their own line of bags, such as WAL-MART carries Arm & Hammer, or Winn-Dixie carries Rug Doctor brand. Bags are everywhere. Besides, as Sebo_Fan has stated above, ALL vacuums require the periodic replacement of parts of which wear down over time. These include things such as drive belts, brushes, carbon brushes, and filters. ALL of which BOTH your Dyson and your Hoover requires over time. In no way do bags create waste. With any vacuum you are removing dirt from your household, and in most cases throwing it away. a bagless bin spews dirt and dust into both the air and your tag rubbish bin upon emptying. A paper bag provides a convenient way to dispose of dirt in a hygienic sac. Would you not use a trash bag in your rubbish bin because it 'creates waste'? Of course not, such an idea is preposterous.bags last a long time, not many are required for most people. If you go through bags like HOOVERS go through dirt, then purchase a package every 2 shopping trips. Forgetting what bags to buy is like forgetting what kind of cereal you purchase regularly. I remember what style bags I need for vacuums I haven't used in years (that and every HOOVER since the Style W hygienisac!).many bag packages have pictures and lists of the models they are compatible with, which serve to help the average modern consumer in the event they forget which bags to purchase.you are already required to remember what filters and belts to purchase for your Dyson and Hoover. I could replace the belt in a HOOVER Convertible or Elite blindfolded. You're going to need a degree in engineering to replace the belt on that Dyson! Don't break it (although it will wear out in time). You said it yourself, even the Dyson lost suction. ALL vacuums lose suction. ALL vacuums use a filtering medium to separate dust from air.whether it be a disposable bag or an (also disposable) filter. The Dyson would lose suction at fine dust, even the Kirby Omega introduced a new, rubbery filter bag that was known to explode off the vacuum itself upon becoming clogged with fine dust. My Kirby 1-CR has a bag half full of household grime. I haven't noticed the slightest bit of a decrease in performance.
 
I was joking about Dyson paying you. I hope in time you will be able to see past Dyson's bagless hype.Wink


Post# 281791 , Reply# 43   5/25/2014 at 13:11 (3,617 days old) by joshdonnell ()        

I see your point, but in my opinon i wouldn't want to breath in what i just vacuumed.
I also think when you buy a Dyson , or any other cheaper made brand they will not last as long . I
I call them throw away vacuums . I would rather have a vacuum like Kirby or Riccar that had a throw a bag and have the motor last longer. The motor in bagless vacs dont last as long.


Post# 281797 , Reply# 44   5/25/2014 at 14:20 (3,617 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
you're not saying,

super-sweeper's profile picture

That dumping a BAG will release crap into the air, are you? You're reading it the wrong way if you are.


Post# 281826 , Reply# 45   5/25/2014 at 20:00 (3,616 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        

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Madabouthoovers, I'm still happy with bagless. I'll probably never own a bagged machine. My DC07 is still a good machine; however it smells dirty every time I turn it on. Mine is one of the later models, and the cyclone assembly is noisy.

Sebo_fan and Super-sweeper, I like bagless because I get to see what I've picked up. Such a thing is not possible with bagged machines. And yes, I do use trash bags in my house.

The Hoover has two filters: a rinsable pre-motor filter and a HEPA exhaust filter with a layer of carbon to absorb pet odors. The pre-motor filter needs to be rinsed every 2 months and let dry for 24 hours. The HEPA filter only needs to be banged out when needed. The Hoover uses a standard belt that usually needs to be replaced every year. Both filters can be found on Hoover.com. Belts can be found practically anywhere.

The Dyson has two lifetime filters: a washable pre-motor filter and a HEPA exhaust filter. The pre-motor filter needs to be rinsed every 6 months and will never need replacing. The HEPA filter is a permanent non-user-replaceable filter that never needs replacing for the lifetime of the vacuum. The Dyson utilizes a clutch system with rubber belts. It is also not user-replaceable. Dyson only sells pre-motor filters through their website. They don't sell HEPA filters or clutches.

Both of my vacuums have NEVER lost suction. I take very good care of my machines. I don't usually have a problem with dust clouds, unless you hold the canister high above the trash can.

Joshdonnell, you think bagless vacuums don't last? It depends on the model. My Dyson DC07 is a 2007, so it's still going strong 6-7 years later. As I've explained before, none of my vacuums have had motors burnt out.


Post# 281870 , Reply# 46   5/26/2014 at 03:35 (3,616 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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You've certainly been hit by the Dyson bug, haven't you? I was like that when I first started collecting, only I owned the models that weren't available in the U.S, such as early Dyson vacs. I soon learnt they weren't that well built, no matter how gentle I was with them.

In the UK you can pick up most spares for most Dyson models. Spares for the DC07 are unusually high. There's a reason for that. You might not have a problem for 7 years because your vacuum cleaner hasn't been troublesome - but in my experience Dyson, the brand hardly tops the list for reliability. I don't think there is a perfect vacuum cleaner but in my experience there is near perfection from brands who offer the bagged way to capture dirt.

Would you have a clear/acrylic toilet in your home so that you can personally watch your faeces float away? I'd rather not and same with the dust that comes off my carpets for all the world to see.



Post# 281932 , Reply# 47   5/26/2014 at 14:28 (3,616 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Yep!

niclonnic's profile picture
I am a total Dyson fan. The one I have was indeed well built, and my family has somewhat abused it.

On Amazon.com and eBay, you can find Dyson filters, clutches and belts. Like I said I never have had an issue with my DC07.

I also wouldn't want a clear toilet in my home. However, I own an LG front-load washing machine. From time to time, I can watch my laundry get washed. I like seeing how technology works. Plus it's rather satisfying to see what I've picked up from the carpets.


Post# 281939 , Reply# 48   5/26/2014 at 15:24 (3,615 days old) by FantomFan (Rochester, New York)        
I respect your opinion

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You are not a collector, you are an average user. Many people like bagless better, as you don't need to buy bags. That is exactly why they sell, even if filters for them cost more in the long run.Personally, I see the Rainbow as a better alternative for a bagless. You never need to touch the dirt, and it doesn't smell. A rainbow isn't difficult to use and maintain once you get used to the whole water idea. The rainbow is very reliable an can run for many years with proper care, without needing a service. I hate the idea of dust blowing back in my face with my bagless machines (not rainbow) so that is why I laugh at those Shark infomercials whose happy customers state that the Shark helps with their allergies. It is simply a fact that bagless is here to stay, whether collectors like it or not.

Post# 281949 , Reply# 49   5/26/2014 at 18:00 (3,615 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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Bagless may well be here to stay.

But the issue that this new member had was the hinge on the back of a bagless dust bin which has broken off and may not be under warranty. Now, if ALL bagless vacs were like this, brands wouldn't be able to get away with it.

At this point, I feel that most bagged cleaners simply don't suffer from this. Most in my experience have a better made release for the dust bag - if for example you are going to compare like for like.



Post# 281982 , Reply# 50   5/26/2014 at 22:50 (3,615 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        

niclonnic's profile picture
FantomFan, a Rainbow sounds cool, but I am already used to maintaining a similar water-based machine: a carpet cleaner. I own a Bissell Lift-Off Deep Cleaner, which is a great machine. After every use, I go overboard with cleaning out the machine. I rinse out both tanks and let them dry completely near a window. If I clean carpets with the full-sized machine, I also take the entire thing apart and rinse the nozzle, end caps and brush rolls, then let them dry completely. It might sound like overkill, but that's how I am. I do that after every use to keep my machine in great condition. It also prevents mold and mildew buildup.

On a side note, my grandmother owns a Shark Navigator Lift-Away Deluxe vacuum. I used it at her house last summer, and thought it was a pretty good machine.

Sebo_fan, I will keep using bagless vacuums. I've had many brands of bagless vacuums, including Fantom, Dirt Devil and Bissell, and they have never had their canisters broken. As I've said before, my Dyson has never had a part break, including the hinge. The cracked hinge on the Windtunnel might just be something wrong with the manufacturing of my dirt cup.

So far, this has been a great start to my Vacuumland membership. I have found a wealth of knowledge from other members on here. Thanks, everybody, for your suggestions. I will continue to use the Windtunnel. Whenever I go to empty it, I just need to twist the cyclone assembly off. Emptying the cup from the bottom WILL cause the bottom flap to fall off and into the trash can. I have to reattach the bottom flap when that happens.


Post# 281994 , Reply# 51   5/27/2014 at 06:38 (3,615 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
Fantom,

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And Amway are my 2 exceptions to bagless, they were quality machines! 


Post# 282008 , Reply# 52   5/27/2014 at 10:36 (3,615 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        
This is a known fact...

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A good Direct Air vacuum such as Kirby, Royal metal upright, or the Riccar Tandem Air vacuum will outclean and out perform ANY Bagless upright vacuum ever made.

 

You might like to see the dirt your bagless vac pulls out of your carpet, but the fact is that a good Direct Air vacuum will get all of the dirt your cheap bagless vac leaves behind in your carpet. This is the fine dirt and sand that destroys your carpet when walked on by slowly grinding away the fibers of your carpet. There is not a bagless upright vacuum ever made including Dyson, that can pull more dirt out of a carpet than a good Direct Air vacuum!


Post# 282012 , Reply# 53   5/27/2014 at 11:09 (3,615 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture
Well dont forget the classic soft bag Hoover uprights and Orecks are also Direct Air designs.

Post# 282014 , Reply# 54   5/27/2014 at 12:21 (3,615 days old) by FantomFan (Rochester, New York)        
I have seen this problem on a pervious Dyson Dc14 that I had

fantomfan's profile picture
The clip was broken, so I had to find another way to close it. I baby the lid on my Dc07, as It seems flimsy to me. I also am very careful with the dust bin on my Hoover Elite Cyclonic. It seems the best way to avoid this problem is to be very careful when dumping out dirt, it was different on the original fantoms, as they did not have the "dump-from bottom" system. I prefer that method, As there aren't any lids to break.

Post# 282036 , Reply# 55   5/27/2014 at 14:07 (3,615 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        

sptyks's profile picture

Sebo_Fan: Sorry I didn't name the Hoover and Oreck, but you are correct they are also good Direct Air machines.

 

 

Niclonnic: If you are still doubtful about the superior cleaning ability of Direct Air vacuums, then I suggest you watch

this video.

 




 

 


Post# 282072 , Reply# 56   5/27/2014 at 20:51 (3,614 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Nice!

niclonnic's profile picture
Super_sweeper, I agree with you. As I've said, I had a Fantom Fury a long time ago. Sadly, my parents got rid of it because they wanted a new vacuum for the new house in 2001.

Sptyks, that video looked very convincing. However, I'm not getting any more vacuums in the foreseeable future, though.

FantomFan, I'm sorry to hear that that happened to you too! Especially on such a nice vacuum. I do not need to baby my DC07. Its strong build quality has stood the test of time. I prefer the bottom-empty dirt cups because dirt doesn't spill out when you carry the canister to the trash can.

Good thing my Windtunnel was free, because at this point I wouldn't want to buy it again.


Post# 282162 , Reply# 57   5/28/2014 at 18:02 (3,613 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
Dirt spilling out,

super-sweeper's profile picture

Are you holding the canister upside-down? I've never heard of that before!Tongue out


Post# 282179 , Reply# 58   5/28/2014 at 19:50 (3,613 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
No I don't

niclonnic's profile picture
I never hold the canister upside down. I never have had a problem with dirt spilling out. The "dirt spilling out" problem only applies to dirt cups where the top is uncovered (I'm looking at you, Bissell). Bottom-empty dirt cups are nice because you don't have to breathe in the dust right away; it has time to settle.

One problem with bagged vacuums is this: when you remove the bag, dust flies up and out of the bag.


Post# 282262 , Reply# 59   5/29/2014 at 11:15 (3,613 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        
Fact vs Fiction...

sptyks's profile picture

Niclonnic: most everything you believe about bagless vacuum cleaners is incorrect.  There are at least three misconceptions about bagless vacuum cleaners, so I will try to correct them here.

 

1.      1. Bagged vacuum cleaners lose suction as the bag fills up.  This was true about the early paper bags in the older bagged vacuum cleaners.  However today’s modern bagged vacuum cleaners use a synthetic type of cloth bag which does not have pores that can clog up with dust.  These bags also provide HEPA filtration so the vacuum cleaner cleans the air as you vacuum.  I have proven this with my Kirby Sentria which uses this new type of cloth bag.  I have a Baird air flow meter which is used to measure the suction and airflow of any vacuum cleaner.  My Kirby Sentria reads a 7 ½ out of 10 with the air flow meter connected to the hose with an empty bag.  When the bag is ¾ full the reading on the air flow meter  is just under  7.  So you see hardly any suction or airflow is lost even when the bag is ¾ full.

 

2.    2. Bags are expensive to buy.   Actually in the long run, the filters in Bagless vacuums cost much more to replace than bags.  Some of these filters can cost more than $40.00.  However a six pack of cloth HEPA filter bags for my Sentria costs about $18.00.  This is enough bags to last me for two years of normal vacuuming.  I can vacuum my home for 3 to 4 months before needing to replace the bag.

 

 

3.    3. Dust flies out of the bag when it is being changed.  The fact is almost all of the bags used in newer bagged vacuum cleaners have a flap that closes over the opening of the bag as it is being removed from the cleaner which prevents any dust or dirt to escape from the bag during disposal.  You just drop it in the trash bin and that’s it. Therefore replacing the bag is a much cleaner process than emptying the dirt cup on a bagless vac.


Post# 282264 , Reply# 60   5/29/2014 at 11:31 (3,613 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Stan - I don't think Niclonnic is actually listening to anything anyone has to say against his bagless machines. Most young people know no better as they have been brought up around bagless vacs. Its only the older generation that appreciate the benefits of bagged, before James Dyson came on the scene, and started his media brainwashing against bagged machines. The fact that Niclonnic is so devoted to his bagless machines shows how effective Dyson marketing has been over the last 20 years. I don't think anything we say will change his mind, so its best to let him get on with enjoying his bagless machines, while we carry on enjoying our bagged machines.


Post# 282266 , Reply# 61   5/29/2014 at 11:48 (3,613 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        

sptyks's profile picture

Steve: I am starting to believe what you said about Niclonnic. He has definitely been BRAINWASHED by Mr. Dyson so I will not try to persuade him any further on this thread.

 


Post# 282267 , Reply# 62   5/29/2014 at 12:16 (3,613 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

I will admit though that I was brainwashed by Dyson too, buying my first brand new Dyson DC07 in 2002, which replaced a Hoover bagged Turbopower 3. I replaced the DC07 in 2006 for a DC15, again swallowing all the hype about the "ball" which was all new and the latest technology blah blah blah. Its only in the last few years that I've gone right off Dyson, and seen through his marketing spin. Whilst I still own 7 early Dysons in my collection, I will not be buying any more. I have decided to go back to bags in a big way, and no more of this "made in the Far East" nonsense either. I simply will not waste any more of my money on cheap rubbish, and will more than likely be selling off most of my TTI machines in the future as they are now all in the attic not getting used, just like my Dysons.


Post# 282308 , Reply# 63   5/29/2014 at 17:12 (3,612 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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One other issue I have, and its not just with Dyson but with quite a few upright vacs is that they don't clean flat to the floor.

Even if the soft bags drag on the floor, a vintage Hoover Senior or Junior can happily get under a low bed. Not so with Dyson or modern bagless uprights where the round bin gets in the way. Its all well having a slim floor head but if the rest of the vacuum isn't slim and thin enough to get under low furniture ALL THE WAY, its hardly the way forward.

Also the more I get older, the less I'm likely to put up with high motor noise.

The only bagless upright I can think of that has so far managed it has been my "vintage" 1990s Electrolux Cyclone PowerLite (sold in the U.S under the Eureka Super Lite name)


Post# 282313 , Reply# 64   5/29/2014 at 18:03 (3,612 days old) by SUPER-SWEEPER (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
You almost feel bad for the guy-

super-sweeper's profile picture

Our attempts to show him the ease and joy of a bagged vacuum have proved futile. Dirt certainly does not "Fly out" of the top-loading bag-less machines, at least on the quality bagless models, such as Fantom. What makes you think a bottom-opening bagless bin won't spew dirt everywhere upon being opened over a trash bin?


Post# 282318 , Reply# 65   5/29/2014 at 18:35 (3,612 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture
Im puzzled - what do you mean top loading bagless vacs?

Post# 282323 , Reply# 66   5/29/2014 at 19:08 (3,612 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Well...

niclonnic's profile picture
Sptyks, those are some interesting facts.

As a boy who grew up in the late 90s/early 2000s, (I'm 19 now), I am more familiar with bagless vacuums. Around the late 90s (I think. I was too young to even remember any of this), my parents were "brainwashed" by Fantom after seeing an infomercial about it. They ordered one and used it for a few years in my old apartment. Since then, after moving into my new house, we picked up a few brands of bagless vacuums over the years (Dirt Devil, Bissell, Dyson). So the bagless marketing was effective!

We all have our likes and dislikes. I honestly don't hate bagged vacuums, it's just that I love bagless and some of you guys like bags. Bagged machines have their uses, and are very good in their own right.

Sebo_fan, I agree with you. I can't really get under anything with my vacuums. But that's no big deal, since I don't vacuum under beds or low furnishings anyway. Dyson did make a "low reach floor tool" and packed it in with some of their vacuums in the past. That tool is nice, but it utilizes straight suction.

SUPER_SWEEPER, it helps if you start with an empty trash bag. Then you must hold the canister down into the trash can and open the bottom flap. This way, the dust doesn't make a mess all over.


Post# 282333 , Reply# 67   5/30/2014 at 01:46 (3,612 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Just something to say here-not being mean---but if you use a bagless vacuum no matter what brand--and dump its bin into a trash bag---well you end up using BAGS after all-why not just have the vacuum put the dust into the bag to begin with?Only bagless machines I use are my Water Matic canister and a Rainbow.The WaterMatics been gets slurped out by my NSS M1 and into its giant disposable bag.The Rainbow water bin gets dumpted outside into the plant bed--so the dirt goes outside.If the Rainbow ingested a bit of paper or carpet fluff-pick that out and put it in the trash.

Post# 282345 , Reply# 68   5/30/2014 at 07:03 (3,612 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Maybe Niclonnic thinks that regular trash bags for his trash can cost much less than vacuum bags, so it saving him money? Bagless is fine if you like to maintain the vac more yourself by washing its filters, and replacing them when advised in the instructions, and also like to get your hands in all the dirt when its emptying time, as usually much of the dirt gets trapped between the bin and the cyclone sieve assembly. I can live with bagless, but my personal preference is I don't mind paying £10 a year ($17) for a pack of dustbags, many of which contain the filters you need too.

 

Don't forget that the savings in bags is usually negated by the fact that a bagless vac is more expensive than a bagged vac an many cases, and that bagless vacs like Bissell are deliberately designed to allow small amounts of dirt to get round the gasket-less pre-motor filter (which is washable) to soil the post motor filter (which is not washable and must be replaced - at a cost, usually quite a high cost too). Obviously Niclonnic believes that all these extra costs associated with an average bagless and all the extra maintenance and hassle are still less than a $17 a year pack of dustbags. As long as Niclonnic is happy with this state of affairs, that's the main thing.

 

Just wondering if Americans actually use trash bags in their outdoor trash cans? in the UK, most of us don't.


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This post was last edited 05/30/2014 at 07:24
Post# 282349 , Reply# 69   5/30/2014 at 09:42 (3,612 days old) by joshdonnell ()        

He likes bagless vacuums so i think we need to leave him alone about.

Post# 282352 , Reply# 70   5/30/2014 at 10:39 (3,612 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

joshdonnell - I see you own a Miele Capricorn - now that IS a quality machine, someone with very good taste in vacs. I have the UK equivalent


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Post# 282380 , Reply# 71   5/30/2014 at 18:02 (3,611 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
MadaboutHoovers-

super-sweeper's profile picture

No-Us Americas use a disposable bag (Ring a bell-Niclonic?) in our indoor bins, then deposit the full bag into a outdoor can-which is usally set to the curb on a set date for collection.

 

Fantom couldn't brain-wash a cat (Cats are fun). The Fantom was a great vacuum, your parents made an excellant choice in home cleaning. It would be cleaning carpets to this day if your parent's didn't replace it (Many Fantoms still are). That Fantom left a impression on your parents. The Fantom was easy to maintain, a great bagless design. This same impression they implied to the cheaper Dirt Devil and Hoovers of your average big-chain super store (Let's say WAL-MART!). This was a mistake. There is a huge diffrence between the Fantom (Or Amway) to modern bagless cleaners. The Fantom had the cyclones, the filtering power, the cleaning power. The Cheaper models had a paper filter. You've needed those couple of cheaper vacuums you have "Picked up" in the Fantom's absence. I doubt the carpet has been any cleaner since the Fantom was replaced. There is no other bagless that could've topped, nor match that Fantom of which is on the market today. The Hoover above is a Honda in terms of Bagless technology, where the Fantom and Amway crowd are the Rolls Royce of bagless. Go out to a thrift store or garage sale, and find a Fantom, You'll never need another bagless again!

 

wheter you like it or not, you will have to replace a filter in a bagless machine, or a bag in a bagged machine. If you bought a bagless to "Save money" as so many consumers have been lead in to, expect to break out the check book!wink


Post# 282390 , Reply# 72   5/30/2014 at 18:58 (3,611 days old) by floor-a-matic (somewhere)        

Or U can go for a Hoover Savvy; U can use it either bagged or bagless.  Maybe even a Filter Queen?

 

Bagless vacuums should NOT have bottom that can open; the old Fantom Fury, Lightning & Thunder had a solid dirt cup bottom




This post was last edited 05/30/2014 at 23:16
Post# 282403 , Reply# 73   5/30/2014 at 20:39 (3,611 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
In the end...

niclonnic's profile picture
Yes, I use trash bags in all of my indoor trash cans. My parents always buy the Kirkland Signature white kitchen bags from Costco. They only cost $18 for a box of 200 bags. For the smaller bins, in the laundry room, bathrooms and bedrooms, I use regular plastic shopping bags.

On my Bissell Cleanview, when I had it, it also had an issue where dust got to the pre-motor filter. Luckily, all three filters on that vacuum were washable, so we didn't have to keep buying replacements. And yes, I know full well how to keep a vacuum cleaner healthy.

Joshdonnell, I am a total bagless fan, and would like to not be persuaded into buying a bagged vacuum, or any high-end machine from a brand I've never heard of.

Madabouthoovers, that Miele vacuum looks really nice! How well do Miele's work?

Super_sweeper, I do the exact same thing at my house. You were exactly right; when we got the Fantom, it was THE vacuum to buy. It was so wicked! While my Fantom Fury is long gone, we are still avid users of bagless vacuums. Fantoms are getting rare these days. I'm still looking for one. It would be a shock if I found one at Goodwill, a thrift store, a garage sale, etc. If I found one, I would buy it right away, then cross my fingers and hope it works.

With my Dyson, I haven't had to buy a single replacement part for it over the 6.5 years I've owned it.

Floor-a-matic, I remember seeing the Hoover Savvy on the Hoover website back in the day. I didn't pay much attention to it, though. And no, I've never heard of Filter Queen.

The reason why bottom-open dirt cups were invented was so that the dirt could be disposed of in a more hygienic way.


Post# 282427 , Reply# 74   5/31/2014 at 01:39 (3,611 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Often in the US the large plastic trash bag is put on the curb for the trashman to pick up and throw into the truck.The neat thing about the plastic trash bags is the POP or whistling sounds they make as they go thru the compactor.At where I dump my trash have the attendent run the compactor there to hear the bags pop and whistle.And if a can is used the bag is put inside.This works good on trash routes that have auto load trash trucks.Besides vacuums--I also like trash trucks-unfortunatly they are too big and expensive to collect.

Post# 282431 , Reply# 75   5/31/2014 at 06:08 (3,611 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture
I am slightly puzzled about how the U.S recycle household waste IF liner bags are put in trash cans or as we know the term, refuse bins. If the bins are lined, are they lined with special bags that decompose quickly over time compared to average Polythene bags - otherwise what would the point be? I love the idea of dumping my refuse into another bag in my bin - it would minimise the yearly clean out that I do on my wheelie bins.

Niclonnic - Miele vacuums are very well designed and some models are better built in my opinion. I have owned a few models over the years but unlike the U.S or Canada markets, our Miele vacuums go by the model number and very rarely a unique name such as the S4 Carina, which is a U.S model.

I have owned quite a few Miele vacuums, mostly canisters but also the S7 upright and now have a new S8 Ecoline model. They are beautifully made, but the later current ones have thinner plastics than the heavier S500 and S300 models I had back in the 1990s. They're not as well built as SEBO canisters though they are slightly quieter than SEBO and Miele offer a lot of optional cost accessories that at times are a mix of helpful to not that essential.


Post# 282432 , Reply# 76   5/31/2014 at 06:10 (3,611 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture
Forgot to add that I also find Miele vacuums can be expensive to run - the company only have 4 dust bags in a box compared to almost double the quantity you get with SEBO.

Post# 282449 , Reply# 77   5/31/2014 at 07:16 (3,611 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        
Trash Cans and Trash Bags

Most people in the UK do use liners in INDOOR trash cans, because it makes it easier to transfer the trash to the outdoor trash can. In the UK we have very strict and rigid re-cycling of trash rules, and many homes have more than 1 outdoor trash can. We have 1 for recyclable trash like glass, plastic bottles, cardboard, and tin cans. We have another for non-re-cyclables, like babys disposable diapers, the contents of our vacuum cleaners, cat litter, dog waste and other trash that goes to land fill sites. And we usually have another trash box for paper. Many homes also have a trash can for garden waste. As these trash cans get dumped directly into the trash wagon, we never use liners in them, and many people employ a service to come round from time to time to wash the trash cans.

Trash cans have now become a menace in many neighborhoods, as there are just so many of them, and they blight the look of the streets.


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Post# 282468 , Reply# 78   5/31/2014 at 10:44 (3,611 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture
In Scotland dependent on the region there are only two types of bin found outside the home - general refuse and a separate bin for recycling paper. Only some selected areas that don't have a nearby landfill site usually have 4 or 5 different bins or if that area is in a heritage trust protected site. Same goes with some parts of England.

Post# 282475 , Reply# 79   5/31/2014 at 10:56 (3,611 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        
Bin Police..

Whilst I support the idea of re-cycling our trash, I have to think about every item I throw out, in the house, I have a trash can for non-recyclables like plastic food wrapping, paper towels, vacuum bags etc, and it has a polythene trash can liner. I also have trash bags hanging on hooks which I put re-cyclables in, such as food cans, milk containers, and jars which I usually wash out before putting them in. When the indoor trash containers get full, I transfer the entire non recyclables trash bag to the outdoor can, and tip the re-cyclables bag into the outdoor recyling can, but not the bag itself, as these are not recyclable. Cat litter goes straight into the non-recycling can, unwrapped, so needless to say, that trash can always stinks and gets riddled with maggots in the summer.

We have "bin police" that work for the council that come round and inspect our trash cans on collection days, and they fine us if we place the wrong items in each can.

Each week a different can gets emptied, so one week, the re-cycling cans will get emptied by the trash man, and the next week the non-recyling bin will get emptied. People complained bitterly about this as their cans can get overfull and full of maggots in summer with a collection only once a fortnight.


Post# 282477 , Reply# 80   5/31/2014 at 11:00 (3,611 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture
Well in Scotland we don't have such things in place.

However my best friend in Letchworth has to do the usual separating out of rubbish. Whenever I've stayed there, I've often been confused as to what goes where.

In Scotland, grass cuttings can be combined with the weekly general household waste but the council only stipulate that grass cuttings have to be bagged separately but can still be added to the same bin.



Post# 282486 , Reply# 81   5/31/2014 at 11:15 (3,611 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Here are our trash cans - I have 2 large ones, and 2 small ones. The blue ones are for re-cyclables, and the small ones are for paper and magazines. The large grey ones are for the non-recyclables. The third pic is the result of only having collections for each trash can once a fortnight


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Post# 282518 , Reply# 82   5/31/2014 at 13:26 (3,611 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        

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Sebo_fan, Miele's are nice machines, but the bags are expensive! One box of bags costs $18.95 at most places. One box comes with 4 bags, one pre-motor filter and one "Super Air Clean" exhaust filter. Two other exhaust filters, the Active Air Clean filter and HEPA filter can be bought separately. The HEPA filter is $50 and the Active Air Clean filter is cheaper. Both of those filters should be replaced approximately once a year. The pre-filter and Super Air Clean filter should be replaced every time you start a new box of bags.

Since when did we get on the subject of trash cans? This subject should belong in the Household forum. This thread started out as a vacuum issue, then it turned into a persuasive discussion to try to get me to buy a high-end vacuum from brands I've never heard of.

In the end, I will stick with the vacuums I have right now. I don't think I'm going to take my Windtunnel into a vacuum store for repairs. However, I might lose a vacuum in my parents' divorce pretty soon.


Post# 282519 , Reply# 83   5/31/2014 at 13:31 (3,611 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Thats just how some threads go sometimes - they do wander onto other subjects. Trash cans and vacuum bins are related though - after all, what do you dump your vacuum dust into?


Post# 282521 , Reply# 84   5/31/2014 at 13:41 (3,611 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture
Dont take this wrongly but just because you create a thread doesn't mean it will necessarily stick to the topic in question.

Besides, dumping dust connects instantly with bagless vacuums - not so with bagged dirt.

As for Miele - well it comes down to average ownership. The bags may well be expensive to buy but it depends on the model - the large GN bags in my experience can last up to 3 months maximum before requiring to be disposed - less months use with the smaller FJM size but it depends on the size of your home and the kinds of dirt your Miele vacuum will likely pick up.

Furthermore the filters should be changed "every year," in the same way that some Dyson filters stipulate being changed every 6 months to a year. Again it depends really on what kind of pick up and dust averages those filters are designed to outlast.

I had an Active Air Clean filter installed in my old Miele S5211 Red Pearl for 3 YEARS before requiring to be replaced.


Post# 282523 , Reply# 85   5/31/2014 at 13:47 (3,611 days old) by citroenbx (england)        

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I COULD SEE dyson dc07 parts

are you throwing them away


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Post# 282525 , Reply# 86   5/31/2014 at 13:52 (3,611 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

No Citroen - those DC07 parts are mostly all broken, they have been there since the days I used to refurb Dysons to sell on, which I dont do any more, as there's no money in it.


Post# 282526 , Reply# 87   5/31/2014 at 14:08 (3,611 days old) by citroenbx (england)        

citroenbx's profile picture
this in the on at mums work a bit worse for where it hoover up carbon dust like of motors but its of lorry's and stones the size of 5p the bin some times wants the bin empting after one use

bottom bit off dc33

brush bar dc03

p.s all that dust out cyclone

they once had hoover turbopower 3 for 10 year's

I don't know why that pic is so big


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Post# 282527 , Reply# 88   5/31/2014 at 14:16 (3,611 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Just goes to show how brittle and fragile they are - just look at all that black tape holding it together. ANd it managed to pass a PAC test lol


Post# 282531 , Reply# 89   5/31/2014 at 14:31 (3,611 days old) by citroenbx (england)        

citroenbx's profile picture
that one is sun bleached but this dc07 has new updated plastic like a dc25

and is free new cyclone/ brush /soleplate/ new motor / wand /tools /hose

have a look

this one is not sun bleached


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Post# 282535 , Reply# 90   5/31/2014 at 14:36 (3,611 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
I agree

niclonnic's profile picture
We all dump the dirt into trash cans, whether it's bags or bagless dirt cups.

Sebo_fan, that is some good advice on Miele vacuums. Dyson filters need to be washed every 3 to 6 months or so, and don't need to be replaced.

Citroenbx, that is ONE NASTY DYSON! I've never seen a Dyson, or any other vacuum for that matter, in such rough shape!


Post# 282538 , Reply# 91   5/31/2014 at 14:38 (3,611 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Oh Citroenbx...

niclonnic's profile picture
That Dyson is in MUCH better shape than the other one!

Post# 282541 , Reply# 92   5/31/2014 at 14:39 (3,611 days old) by citroenbx (england)        
dyson dc07

citroenbx's profile picture
what wrong with them parts that you have out side

mainly the dyson dc07 spine's


Post# 282551 , Reply# 93   5/31/2014 at 14:52 (3,611 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

They all have bits snapped off them citroen, so are no good any more, and the Cyclone assy is smashed


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Post# 282552 , Reply# 94   5/31/2014 at 14:54 (3,611 days old) by citroenbx (england)        

citroenbx's profile picture
oh dear thanks for your time

Post# 282559 , Reply# 95   5/31/2014 at 15:04 (3,610 days old) by madabouthoovers ()        

Those tabs on the back of the spine are a common breakage point on the DC07, they are what holds the handle and wand in position, and they break off one by one, until the handle wont stay attached to the machine. The DC07 Animal with the purple spine was the worst for it. The cyclone chambers become egg shell brittle over time, and the picture of the turquiose one is what happened when I dropped it on the floor.

 

Here's some DC07s I did up to sell on a couple of years back:

 

 


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Post# 282615 , Reply# 96   5/31/2014 at 20:05 (3,610 days old) by niclonnic (Bonney Lake, WA)        
Wow...

niclonnic's profile picture
Those are some beat-up Dyson parts!

Those good Dyson DC07's look nice! Are those rare models? Like I said, I never have had an issue with my own DC07 Animal.



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