dyson dc02

James had a licensing deal with Iona (Fantom Technologies). While the Fantom Lightning used many of the DC02's designs, the two machines were very different inside. Once the DC02 had been designed and on the European market, James was eager to have Iona make their own version for the US market, because quite simply, it meant more money in his pocket. Every Fantom dual cyclone vacuum ever made put money in James' pocket.

The DC02 was designed for efficiency. While James did make money selling filters, and they were not 'washable' at that time, the DC02 made a serious attempt at keeping fine dust out of the motor. He used an pleated electrostatic pre-motor and post motor filter (a HEPA post motor filter was optional). He used two large entrances to his high efficiency cyclone, allowing for excellent airflow. He used a cross beam in the vortex finder to make the high efficiency cyclone even better.

Fantom was in the business of selling VERY expensive Hepa filters for their vacuums. At $75 a piece, a Fantom filter was very profitable for the company. The Fantom Lightning was designed to fill the Hepa filter within one to two years, causing the need for a replacement. Fantom did this in three ways:

Fantom Lightning's entrance to the high efficiency cyclone was, by contrast to the large double entrances on the DC02, a small opening one inch long, one inch wide. The high efficiency cyclone was far more tapered than the DC02's. The Lightning's clear bin did not have baffles in the bottom to aid the low efficiency cyclone, another difference from DC02. Also, the Fantom did not have the cross beam in the vortex finder.

Yet the biggest difference was the steel mesh pre-motor filter. Large, open stainless steel holes let virtually all the fine dust into the motor. Stopping only the lint and hair, Fantom's entire dual cyclonic range always did nothing to stop the fine dust - to sell more Hepa exhaust filters. You must remember that James had invented the MEMA filters (washable lifetime filters) by the time the Lightning was launched, and Fantom COULD have used them. They chose not to, due simply to the desire for profit from Hepa filter sales. That shortsightedness is what ultimately led to their failure.

Some would argue that build quality was the problem with Fantom. While it was a factor in a far higher than average warranty repair cost to the company, the motor failure caused by the fine dust going through it on the Fury models is what really cost them consumer confidence. The Fury had, in reality, an Electrolux Discovery II motor in it. Made by Ametek, if you stood it next to an Electrolux DII motor, it would look identical. The fans in both motors were smaller than 'normal'. I would give a fair estimate that at least half of all Fury vacuums died of motor failure within four to six years.

Lightning's had their share of motor failure too, as did the Cyclone XT. But nothing like the Fury, as both the Lightning and Cyclone XT had some sort of pre-motor filter. The Fury's wire 'lint guard' kept virtually nothing out of the motor.

Since the Fury was about $100 less expensive, they sold significantly more of them than they did the Thunder.


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Post# 247673 8/25/2013 at 16:08 (3,886 days old) by citroenbx (england)
Checkrate/Likes the dyson dc02 looked like a fantom fury canister hav a good look

Post# 247675 , Reply# 1 8/25/2013 at 16:09 (3,886 days old) by citroenbx (england)
Checkrate/Likes *dyson dc02*

Post# 247751 , Reply# 2 8/26/2013 at 03:28 (3,886 days old) by hoover119dude (england)
Checkrate/Likes I THOUGHT THE SAME THING WHEN I CAME BACK HERE IN 98. I HAD NEVER HEARD OF DYSON BEFORE THEN. I SAW A FEW FANTOM 1/2 HOUR COMMERCIALS YEARS BACK ABOUT THE SAME TIME AS DYSON STARTED. THEY DO LOOK THE SAME ALMOST. I WONDER WHO STOLE THE DESIGN OFF WHO??

Post# 247781 , Reply# 3 8/26/2013 at 09:36 (3,886 days old) by thekirbylover (Warrington, cheshire )
Checkrate/Likes 1 *I WONDER WHO STOLE THE DESIGN OFF WHO??* dyson sold the patents the fantom in 1997 as long as fantom gave james dyson some money for every machine that came off the market

Post# 247786 , Reply# 4 8/26/2013 at 10:39 (3,886 days old) by RootCyclone (East Midlands,UK.)
Checkrate/Likes That is odd. Although at the time the DC02 was released in 1995 it was no where near selling as much as it's big brother, the DC01. Hence why I think Dyson sold off the patent. Also, the DC05 was probably in prototyping, the DC02s replacement.

Post# 247796 , Reply# 5 8/26/2013 at 12:02 (3,886 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)
Checkrate/Likes James had a licensing deal with Iona (Fantom Technologies). While the Fantom Lightning used many of the DC02's designs, the two machines were very different inside. Once the DC02 had been designed and on the European market, James was eager to have Iona make their own version for the US market, because quite simply, it meant more money in his pocket. Every Fantom dual cyclone vacuum ever made put money in James' pocket. The DC02 was designed for efficiency. While James did make money selling filters, and they were not 'washable' at that time, the DC02 made a serious attempt at keeping fine dust out of the motor. He used an pleated electrostatic pre-motor and post motor filter (a HEPA post motor filter was optional). He used two large entrances to his high efficiency cyclone, allowing for excellent airflow. He used a cross beam in the vortex finder to make the high efficiency cyclone even better. Fantom was in the business of selling VERY expensive Hepa filters for their vacuums. At $75 a piece, a Fantom filter was very profitable for the company. The Fantom Lightning was designed to fill the Hepa filter within one to two years, causing the need for a replacement. Fantom did this in three ways: Fantom Lightning's entrance to the high efficiency cyclone was, by contrast to the large double entrances on the DC02, a small opening one inch long, one inch wide. The high efficiency cyclone was far more tapered than the DC02's. The Lightning's clear bin did not have baffles in the bottom to aid the low efficiency cyclone, another difference from DC02. Also, the Fantom did not have the cross beam in the vortex finder. Yet the biggest difference was the steel mesh pre-motor filter. Large, open stainless steel holes let virtually all the fine dust into the motor. Stopping only the lint and hair, Fantom's entire dual cyclonic range always did nothing to stop the fine dust - to sell more Hepa exhaust filters. You must remember that James had invented the MEMA filters (washable lifetime filters) by the time the Lightning was launched, and Fantom COULD have used them. They chose not to, due simply to the desire for profit from Hepa filter sales. That shortsightedness is what ultimately led to their failure. Some would argue that build quality was the problem with Fantom. While it was a factor in a far higher than average warranty repair cost to the company, the motor failure caused by the fine dust going through it on the Fury models is what really cost them consumer confidence. The Fury had, in reality, an Electrolux Discovery II motor in it. Made by Ametek, if you stood it next to an Electrolux DII motor, it would look identical. The fans in both motors were smaller than 'normal'. I would give a fair estimate that at least half of all Fury vacuums died of motor failure within four to six years. Lightning's had their share of motor failure too, as did the Cyclone XT. But nothing like the Fury, as both the Lightning and Cyclone XT had some sort of pre-motor filter. The Fury's wire 'lint guard' kept virtually nothing out of the motor. Since the Fury was about $100 less expensive, they sold significantly more of them than they did the Thunder.

Post# 247882 , Reply# 6 8/27/2013 at 01:57 (3,885 days old) by madabouthoovers ()
Checkrate/Likes That is exactly what I have noticed they do on the Bissell Cleanview upright I have - the pre-motor ring filter that fits into the base of the filter cup does not have any kind of gasket between it and the filter cup, and this allows dust and hairs to escape through the motor in small quantities, and get trapped in the post motor filter. Now, the pre motor filter is washable, as is the sponge sleeve that fits over it, but the post motor filter, a poor quality paper pleated filter which itself is not sealed, is not washable. These post motor filters are surprisingly expensive for what they are. Its the same old story - they sell the vac cheaply on washable filters, but design it so that the pre motor filter allows some dust to get round it to go through the motor and make the post motor filter dirty quicker, thus meaning that owners will have to fork out for new filters. I made a carboard gasket to go between the pre-motor filter and the filter cup housing, and it works a treat - the post motor filter stays clean now - only showing traces of carbon dust. Its the ultimate in greed and deceit - sign of the times. Needless to say, I wont buy another Bissell! The Bissell in question is shown here, next to the Miele S7

Post# 247921 , Reply# 7 8/27/2013 at 10:49 (3,885 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)
Checkrate/Likes 2 What bothers me the most about Fantom Technologies (as a company) is that they COULD have been in the US where Dyson is today. They had the freedom to copy Dyson designs exactly, but chose not to. James Dyson wrote 2 more, additional chapters to his autobiography "Against The Odds" detailing his dislike for Fantom (both the cleaners and the owners of the company), but lamented his ten year original 'deal' with them to be able to use his patents as something he wished he hadn't done. While it certainly put money in his pocket, from the first Vectron (commercial Thunder made for Johnson Wax Co.), to the Dry Tech shampooer, to the four Fantom models, it gave dual cyclonic cleaners a very bad rap in the US. The copies (Eureka, Hoover, etc.) which were filtered single cyclonic machines, were sometimes better than the dual cyclonic models. Of course, all that changed when the DC07 launched after James refused to resign a licensing deal with Fantom in 2001. Brining "real" Dysons to America. It seems most consumers, burned by the Fantom, have totally forgotten about it because the Dyson actually worked "properly" (to use James favorite word).