Thread Number: 16977
The Cardboard Vax!
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Post# 181662   5/18/2012 at 13:34 (2,881 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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So here's the latest from Vax - the "world's first cardboard" vacuum cleaner. It probably isn't the first, but hat's off to Vax for identifying another substance to wrap a machine into.

www.cardboardvax.com/...





Post# 181663 , Reply# 1   5/18/2012 at 13:41 (2,881 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

What was that about posts on subjects being in the archives?

CLICK HERE TO GO TO twocvbloke's LINK


Post# 181664 , Reply# 2   5/18/2012 at 13:46 (2,881 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas)        

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Thanks for posting!  Like many, I missed the earlier post.

 


Post# 181666 , Reply# 3   5/18/2012 at 14:03 (2,881 days old) by swiveltop (Galveston, TX)        

Thanks for posting, very interesting,not everyone trolls the archives.

Post# 181678 , Reply# 4   5/18/2012 at 16:29 (2,881 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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No, not everybody, but it was just that sebo_fan was going on about how things could be found in the archives instead of being re-posted.

Now, what did the pot call the kettle again...


Post# 181724 , Reply# 5   5/19/2012 at 03:18 (2,881 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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That may well be, but if you actually bothered to look up the new link I provided here, you'll see that it gives you the opportunity to test the product if you wish. The pocket lint listing provided on the original posting merely gives information.

Post# 181725 , Reply# 6   5/19/2012 at 04:11 (2,881 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

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To be Fair Its not actually that much of a great idea. Most designers and engineering departments in the vacuum world make a cardboard working model of a new design, all VAX did was paint a pretty pic on a prototype model. 

 

I have some early hoover rangers prototypes were the whole hood is cardboard , and some were a few other cardboard working prototypes 


Post# 181730 , Reply# 7   5/19/2012 at 05:28 (2,881 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Could that VAX cardboard vacuum be used as a "disposable" vacuum to be used at hazardous waste cleanups?esp if it has a so called real HEPA filter.since its cardboard-the body and contents could be incinerated-the motor remains picked from the ash-if put in a hi temp incinerator-wouldn't be much left of the motor except melted windings and maybe the cores-but would be sterile.

Post# 181731 , Reply# 8   5/19/2012 at 05:29 (2,881 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

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I doubt it, if you dropped it or bumped it you could break the glue that seals it. 


Post# 181736 , Reply# 9   5/19/2012 at 05:41 (2,881 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

If the vacuum is that fragile--what use what it be?And some of us complained about PLASTIC vacuums!The cardboard would be worse-and if you stepped on it by mistake---there goes your vacuum-and you have a MESS!!Then you need another METAL or PLASTIC vac to clean up the cardboard ones mess.

Post# 181738 , Reply# 10   5/19/2012 at 06:17 (2,881 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

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SO TRUE 

 


Post# 181740 , Reply# 11   5/19/2012 at 06:54 (2,881 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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Getting onto the actual subject, I think a cardboard Vacuum Cleaner is the most asinine design yet!

Unless they can find a way to make it as strong as plastic, it will be useless.

Lets say you're vacuuming the stairs one day and it falls - There goes your Vax.

Lets say you're vacuuming the car one day and accidentally kick it when you're reaching under the seat to get a pile of crumbs up - There goes your Vax.

Lets say you have kids who are running around the house and accidentally stand on the Vacuum Cleaner - There goes your Vax...

I could continue.


Post# 181763 , Reply# 12   5/19/2012 at 09:52 (2,881 days old) by Blackheart (North Dakota)        
Hahaha!

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That could be it's slogan "There goes your Vax"

I'm sure it's got some durability to it as the suction motor could otherwise crush the machine if it's hose became blocked


Post# 181764 , Reply# 13   5/19/2012 at 10:06 (2,881 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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Well if you follow the original link I posted here, it does show several layers of the cardboard in terms of how it is made. It isn't just made of up thin cardboard, but rather, several layers of it.

Post# 181782 , Reply# 14   5/19/2012 at 12:27 (2,881 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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I can't see it catching on...

But then again, maybe in 20 years we'll all be buying cardboard appliances.

We've went from wood, to metal then to plastic and now possibly cardboard... Lord help us.


Post# 181784 , Reply# 15   5/19/2012 at 13:39 (2,880 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

With the way things are going in the financial world, lots of people on this earth of ours will be living in cardboard houses too... :P

Post# 181785 , Reply# 16   5/19/2012 at 13:41 (2,880 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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True...

Post# 181801 , Reply# 17   5/19/2012 at 18:01 (2,880 days old) by vintagerepairer (England)        

One can't help but wonder if the wet & dry cleaners will be made of cardboard too.

Post# 181806 , Reply# 18   5/19/2012 at 18:28 (2,880 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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Ha ha, that would be interesting...

Post# 181810 , Reply# 19   5/19/2012 at 18:41 (2,880 days old) by vintagerepairer (England)        

If not a little soggy.


Post# 181827 , Reply# 20   5/19/2012 at 22:28 (2,880 days old) by djtaylor (Salt Lake City, Utah)        

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Good Grief, what's next? Cardboard Cars? Is this a real product, or just some design school student's project? I can't see a vacuum company making a cardboard vacuum, they won't last a year.
Justin


Post# 181829 , Reply# 21   5/19/2012 at 22:41 (2,880 days old) by twocvbloke ()        
"they won't last a year."

About the same as any other modern vac then... :P

Post# 181841 , Reply# 22   5/20/2012 at 01:50 (2,880 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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"About the same as any other modern vac then... :P" That's not true!

The last two modern Vacuum Cleaners I had (red Argos bagless upright & HOOVER Dust Manager) didn't last 6 MONTHS! Both lost their suction and had electrical issues, one (Argos) almost setting the house on fire.


Post# 181842 , Reply# 23   5/20/2012 at 01:51 (2,880 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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Another thing is, how would it pass the strict electrical safety standards these days ?

If there was a fault with the electricals which caused a spark, what material likes flames ? Hmm... Cardboard!


Post# 181846 , Reply# 24   5/20/2012 at 02:30 (2,880 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Cardboard vacuum---21st century Dumpster vacuum!You fill it up--then throw it into the dumpster!

Post# 181849 , Reply# 25   5/20/2012 at 02:56 (2,880 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

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This is a design scholars project sponsored by vax 


Post# 181853 , Reply# 26   5/20/2012 at 03:18 (2,880 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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"You fill it up--then throw it into the dumpster!" That's what you do with modern Vacuum Cleaners anyway, isn't it ?

Post# 181858 , Reply# 27   5/20/2012 at 05:03 (2,880 days old) by jakesvacs ()        

JMurray01- I remember reading that the cardboard is fireproof!

What this cardboard vax is trying to get to is that, you can replace parts cheaply and when you have had enough its entiarly recyclable- minus the hose and motor. When people moan about plastic vacuums always breaking then having to pay a huge amount , a cardboard pannel is going to cost so little. Its taking a new approach to building materials, mabye also allowing most parts of the machine to made in the UK? Who knows?
Anyone remember those vintage vacuums made of cardboard? They stood the test of time!


Post# 181860 , Reply# 28   5/20/2012 at 05:30 (2,880 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

Old cardboard vacuums-the material isn't really cardboard-but like Masonite(hardboard)-a harder,tougher material intended to be a building material.It can be bent into a cylindrical form easily-thus a vacuum cleaner body.Manufactuers then thought metals and plastics would be better materials for a vacuum cleaner body.Masonite type materials can be weakened if they get wet-even tempered grade.
Yes many modern vacuum cleaners--cheap plastic ones esp-and bagless-fill 'em up-toss 'em into the dumpster.The idea of the carboard vacuum is indeed unusual-cardboard body parts easily replaced.Bet this will have to be done often during the life of that machine.We all know the tough,rough life vacuum cleaners have to endure.for the old "cardboard"? or hardboard vacuums as above-remember plastics weren't available then-and the means to use them.


Post# 181862 , Reply# 29   5/20/2012 at 05:46 (2,880 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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Mm not such a silly idea then : )

Frankly I think that it is very much the same with packaging. When you look at the 1970s when oil produced plastics and polythene came into use - food bags previously made of paper were replaced by plastic and thus spun out other variations like the Zip Lock bag (U.S), and Cling film.

However, I much prefer to what the Americans did in our Scottish town - when they came - they also brought huge brown sacks with them to hold their groceries. I remember them well, thinking they were a better idea than the oil based supermarket bags, certainly from a recycled point of view and I also preferred the white paper bags at the local grocers, now replaced by horrible oil based plastic bags.


Post# 181863 , Reply# 30   5/20/2012 at 05:49 (2,880 days old) by jmurray01 (Scotland)        

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Well I remember last year I used a piece of cardboard to light the BBQ and when I had lit the coals, I blew it out, or thought I had and threw the piece into an old Daz box.

Well, 10 minutes later the whole washing powder box was ON FIRE.

Don't tell me cardboard is fireproof, ha ha!


Post# 181865 , Reply# 31   5/20/2012 at 06:20 (2,880 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

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Thinking about it, why put this machine in a retail box , just make the box the machine Smile


Post# 181869 , Reply# 32   5/20/2012 at 07:30 (2,880 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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That could well happen, you never know - just a slip of outer cardboard showing the price from a store - as for the cardboard Vax being fireproof, it is possible to have it fireproof treated. But then, whilst it is justified that cardboard is easy to set fire, appliances made out of the stuff isn't any less lethal than burning plastic. Yes plastic is stronger in some cases, more robust and durable but plastic isn't as eco-friendly when it burns.

Post# 181972 , Reply# 33   5/21/2012 at 07:55 (2,879 days old) by vacbear58 (Sutton In Ashfield & London)        
Cardboard Cleaners

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Well now you have all got your rants about modern cleaners and their poor quality off your chests can I just point out that Goblin in the post WW2 period produced several iterations of one of their cylinder cleaners with a cardboard body. I currenmtly have two at the moment and I know of others in the same model range - actually they seem to have held up quite well compared to metal bodied cleaners.

If I am not mistaken Hans (Kenkart) has at least one vintage US vacuum made of cardboard too.


Post# 181974 , Reply# 34   5/21/2012 at 09:30 (2,879 days old) by rugsucker (Elizabethton TN)        
Cardboard vacuums

Can they make a cardboard vac that works?!As above, they have in the past and many still work just fine.Most common was the BOL Eureka/Montgomery Ward of about 1950 and beyond.It was a tank type with metal cover,cloth bag and then you see from the inside it is similar to cardboard rolls for carpeting.Outside is vinyl covered similar to metal MoXXX.Also the quality,expensive Filtex and dry pick up shop vacs of 60s from Craftsman and others.Any others?

Post# 182003 , Reply# 35   5/21/2012 at 14:08 (2,878 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

Thing is, a lot of the old "cardboard" vacs were basically a plasticised or varnished paper, so it was an early form of plastic construction, rather than being something that looks more like the inside of a toilet roll coated in paint...

Plus, making cardboard vacuums in the sense of the Vax one, it's not really green in an ecological sense, as if it's designed to be thrown out, then it's going against what people are trying to avoid, unnecessary waste, financially and of natural resources. Cos when you think about it, where does most of the paper that makes the cardboard come from? Trees, and I doubt that there'll be any justification to plant forests of trees just to supply the world with disposable vacuums...

And the fire part, well, you cannot make card or paper fire *proof* without making is unusable, just fire *retardant*, meaning it contains chemicals that produce CO2 gas to extinguish flames if it gets hot enough, but if the heat is intense enough, even fire retardants can be overwhelmed...

It's an intriguing project for a student, but to me, that's all it is and will be, it's not a sustainable product, and doubtful that it will make it to market, and even if it does it won't last long...


Post# 182046 , Reply# 36   5/21/2012 at 19:55 (2,878 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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I doubt though that it would become landfill in terms of it being chucked out though - if it is made of CFC friendly cardboard AND inside is also reasonably eco-friendly, it's entirely possible that the whole thing could be burnt. But then again, Vax could do what Dyson did in the early stages with the "Re-Cyclone" process. Get rid of the exterior body, retain the motor and just put it back on sale with a new "shell."

And I've just had a thought spun from this opinion - in the same way that BMW are doing MINI with retro bespoke patterns/creating removable panels, it will probably be the next thing on vacuum cleaners to have removable "colour" coded removable panels to make them blend into the home. If SEBO do it with the Felix already, there's every chance other brands may well offer the same soon. Dirt Devil in Germany already offer "bespoke" patterns on cylinder/compact canister vacs ("Fantasy") that were already on sale in the U.S under the "Tattoo" tagline.

Of course the difference here is that, with the cardboard exterior of the Vax, if it was sold in plain brown could give owners the incentive to design their own without removable panels/transfers -notwithstanding plastic stick on jewels that would go down a storm in certain parts of England...



Post# 182069 , Reply# 37   5/21/2012 at 21:40 (2,878 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

You have to remember, where does the cardboard come from before it's made, and where does it go after it's beyond use? New, strong, structural cardboard comes from trees, and not a lot comes from recycled paper as you can only get so much from recycling as the fibres become too weak, so they have to mix recycled with new to get something strong enough to be useful, until it's got so much recycled fibres in it that it's barely even useful as toilet paper...

So, pretty decals aside, making cardboard vacuums would not be ecologically viable, I prefer my trees to provide structures, furniture and firewood, so personally, I'll stick to my metal and plastic vacs that can actually be molten down and re-cast into something new, if they ever actually end up in the recycling bin (doubtful).... :)


Post# 182133 , Reply# 38   5/22/2012 at 16:28 (2,877 days old) by Rolls_rapide (-)        
Cardboard vacuum cleaner

I am very doubtful that it is sufficiently durable. I have used an industrial Nilfisk which had "cardboard" extension tubes: they were not very durable at all.

I will stick to plastic and metal machines that can be recycled.

No doubt another pointless exercise in "form over function". The watchword should be "Don't."


Post# 182191 , Reply# 39   5/23/2012 at 06:20 (2,877 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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Cardboard extension tubes? Good grief!

Post# 182348 , Reply# 40   5/23/2012 at 17:35 (2,876 days old) by Rolls_rapide (-)        

Yes, they were a combination of glue and cardboard type material, possibly mica might have been in the mix too. They were especially made to be lightweight and non-conductive, important in factories where overhead bus-bars are used carrying 400 odd volts.

Post# 182396 , Reply# 41   5/24/2012 at 04:47 (2,876 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

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Ah I see! Good to know!

Post# 182513 , Reply# 42   5/25/2012 at 13:06 (2,874 days old) by kenkart ()        
Cardboard and Masonite vacs!

I have a late 40s Eureka built Montgomery Ward tank that is basically a cardboard tube covered in a leatherette material, the Filtex was a masonite board type material.




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