Thread Number: 16068
Tristar CXL, DXL and Miracle Mate Mk1 and Platinum: What's the difference, really?
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Post# 171376   2/29/2012 at 15:22 (2,950 days old) by sanifan ()        

The more I look into Miracle Mates the more I realize they are pretty much repackaged Tristar CXL's. Yet I've read on this forum some opinions that Tristar CXL may be more powerful and less harsh on the ears. On paper they seem pretty much the same (I know the Platinum uses the covered bags instead of the open ones. Apart from the output filters and PN, the Tristar CXL and both Miracle Mates appear to use the same motor and bagging system).

So a question to those in the know. What are the ultimate differences and is there really a difference in performance?





Post# 171379 , Reply# 1   2/29/2012 at 16:08 (2,950 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

I don't thing there's really much difference in performance between the three, as they're basically the same design with the same principles on the cyclonic scrubbing action on the back of the bag. The one main difference I can think of is the MiracleMate uses bags which have card lids on them, rather than just a thin card ring like the Compact/Tristar bags have, so the filtration is about the same...

The main difference in the actual cleaning is the PN, the MiracleMate uses a completely different PN to the Tristar, and the VortechFroce too uses another brand PN (I forget the brands), so there is variation there, but, that's about all I know... :)

Personally I prefer the smooth and refined looks of the Tristar, the others seem too angular and "blocky" for my tastes, but that's just me... :)


Post# 171388 , Reply# 2   2/29/2012 at 18:40 (2,950 days old) by venson ()        
But there's more!!!

Out of the cast-body vacuums, Vortech Force and Miracle Mate have cord reels.

Regarding all, the hose fitting are the same though I won't swear re Vortech Force. The virtue of these machines is good suction, sheer durability and not a lot in the designs to promote air leaks.

My own theory here, the intake directs the incoming air stream at the inner back wall of the dust bag and helps that small area stay freed up a bit from dust and thus helps keep suction level up as the bag fills. I noticed this particularly on the Miracle Mate I owned but it seems to apply for Air Storm and Patriot as well. The bags don't appear all that big but can carry quite a way due to the way the literally seem to pack dirt in.


Post# 171390 , Reply# 3   2/29/2012 at 18:51 (2,950 days old) by twocvbloke ()        

Someone I know who used to own a MiracleMate claimed that the cable attached to the cord reel was too short compared to compacts & tristars, meaning more socket hopping while cleaning, so there is a drawback to having neat cable storage aswell as adding more maintenance issues... :)

Post# 171454 , Reply# 4   3/1/2012 at 03:41 (2,949 days old) by venson ()        
@twocvbloke . . .

Hi,

The Miracle Mate never posed much of a problem for me regarding cord length save for doing the stairs that led to the street at the place I used to live in. But, thatís what extension cords are for.

A bigger issue for me was making sure I had enough bags and filters on hand as neither of the two local vac shops in my area carried consumables for the brand. Ordering them meant a wait of several days for delivery via ground if I happened to be fresh out of bags.

Besides the cord reel being my idea of tee-rific, the exhaust filters were by design made to fit into the machine. Schoettlerís Patriot and Air Storm, as at least two examples, have exhaust filters that are basically afterthoughts that can make maneuvering and use awkward.

Miracle Mate canít be let off the hook as far as dubious ideas go either. Pretty obviously tugging at the heart strings of the germophobe, the company has now come up with the XIF. Itís a UV light device that slaps on top of the machine for air purification purposes. Is it effective? Who knows. In any event a caveat here is in order since having had one in the house, the Miracle Mate doesnít roar but is a little loud just for air purification duty.

I believe the XIF is powered off the electrical port for the power nozzle meaning you might be able to use it in tandem while youíre doing just straight-suction cleaning.

My big wish is that, someday soon, Consumer Reports or some other testing organization will thoroughly test a broader number of the pricey D-T-D brands to reduce the level of mystery as to actual worth. They do check out the more popular niche brands like Kirby, Aerus, and Rainbow regularly enough and even get around to Filter Queen now and then. However, Vortech Force (a new model with a facelift has come out), Patriot, Air Storm and other heftily priced machines seem to remain completely off the radar even though they obviously continue to sell and turn up just about everywhere.


CLICK HERE TO GO TO venson's LINK


Post# 171455 , Reply# 5   3/1/2012 at 03:45 (2,949 days old) by venson ()        

Just throwing this out there so those not familiar with Miracle Mate can get a look-see . . .

Post# 171475 , Reply# 6   3/1/2012 at 07:21 (2,949 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
I've had a Miracle Mate and Vortech Force. The Miracle Mate is quite heavy. For the most part I liked both machines but what I did not like about them (as well as the Compact, Tristar, Patriot, etc.) is that the way the hose is made/positioned, it extends the length of the machine quite a bit so maneuvering in tight quarters is difficult.

Gary


Post# 171476 , Reply# 7   3/1/2012 at 07:31 (2,949 days old) by venson ()        
@countryguy . . .

Hi Gary,

I didn't mind the weight of my Miracle Mate too much but I did opt to buy a 14-foot electrified hose from Shoettler (Patriot/Air Storm -- same fittings) to lessen having to move the machine around.

Vortech always interested me because of the super-duper HEPA it has up front in the bag compartment. Is it worth its salt?


Post# 171477 , Reply# 8   3/1/2012 at 07:45 (2,949 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
Hi Venson,

It has been awhile since I've had the Vortech but I don't recall it having a HEPA in the bag compartment but then I don't remember a lot of things these days LOL. I did buy it new. I don't have allergies so having a HEPA filter doesn't really make any difference to me. I did like that the Vortech had the separate non electrified hose - it was so much lighter than the electric hose and it had the regular handle instead of the pistol grip like on the electric hose.

Gary


Post# 171478 , Reply# 9   3/1/2012 at 07:47 (2,949 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
BTW, if you ever find a place where you can buy that Lux Intelligence for 120V use, I'd be interested!

Gary


Post# 171481 , Reply# 10   3/1/2012 at 08:39 (2,949 days old) by venson ()        
@countryguy . . .

Hey Gary,

I will certainly put you on the list as part of the "Intelligence" posse.

PS -- Couldn't find an image of the Vortech filter I mentioned but I'm posting a shot of the new model anyway.


Post# 171486 , Reply# 11   3/1/2012 at 09:29 (2,949 days old) by kirbykid63 (Wilmington Delaware)        
All the Tristar type canisters

I have owned tristar,miracle mate,and patriot.I feel they are all well made machines that perform great,the motors used in them are good quality double ball bearing lamb style motors that should last for many years. I would recommend any of these machines over the newer electrolux's or filterqueens because of the quality of their motors.

Post# 171487 , Reply# 12   3/1/2012 at 09:41 (2,949 days old) by sanifan ()        

Is that a Sebo powerhead on the current Miracle Mate?

This is what it says on the Miracle Mate website: The Platinum Cleaning System wouldnít be complete without an incredible powerhead. Designed and manufactured in Germany by Stein & Co. GMBH, a company known for making powerheads that clean the red carpets at the White House and Buckingham Palace.

I'm not sure how I feel about the new Vortech design. My initial feeling is that it's too "racy" looking to fit into a classy home. Maybe into a very bold contemporary home, yes, but it would draw too much attention to itself inside subtler decor. It reminds me of cross between those cartoony Hot Wheels diecast toy cars and a small carpet steamer.

I'm assuming all of these Tristar/Compact offspring brands came about after the patent on the bagging design expired? Or was it never patented?

I've been lucky enough to pick up two Tristar 50th Anniversary models and a Miracle Mate Platinum (with Lindhaus PN) in the last half year. After I got the MM, I realized there really isn't too much difference in internal workings of the main body. Just some execution differences, arguably some make-or-break, like the cord winder and shorter cord and covered bag in the Platinum, but they are essentially the same. The bigger difference would be in the PNs that come with them. Oh, and the looks, of course.

Great machines!


CLICK HERE TO GO TO sanifan's LINK


Post# 171488 , Reply# 13   3/1/2012 at 09:44 (2,949 days old) by kirbykid63 (Wilmington Delaware)        
one more detail

When I said Tristar has a good motor I meant to say,the older CXL's and DXL's. not the current Aerus owned models.

Post# 171490 , Reply# 14   3/1/2012 at 09:49 (2,949 days old) by sanifan ()        
Tristar bag in Miracle Mate?

I forgot to ask, can the open Tristar bag be used in the Miracle Mate Platinum? From the cutaway pic of the Platinum, it seems like it would be backwards compatible with the Tristar's open topped bags. Anyone know for sure?

I would try it myself, but the MM was a recent acquisition and needs some serious cleaning before I can play around with it.


Post# 171491 , Reply# 15   3/1/2012 at 09:50 (2,949 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
Wow, the Vortech has really changed in appearance.

Gary


Post# 171493 , Reply# 16   3/1/2012 at 09:58 (2,949 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
@venson,

Is this the filter you were referring to?


CLICK HERE TO GO TO countryguy's LINK


Post# 171494 , Reply# 17   3/1/2012 at 10:00 (2,949 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
Here's a pic including the power nozzle, from the website.



CLICK HERE TO GO TO countryguy's LINK


Post# 171495 , Reply# 18   3/1/2012 at 10:12 (2,949 days old) by venson ()        
@sanifan . . .

Hi,

I would not advise a bag switch. The round TriStar outer bag may fit in your Miracle Mate but the round, wide-mouth disposable bag is all wrong.

The bag compartment's cover might not close properly as it depends on its disposable bag's stiff cardboard cover to promote a complete seal. (The Miracle Mate bag has a cardboard cover with only an opening large enough to accommodate the fill-tube attached to the inner lid of the cleaner.) The cardboard cover also has a notch in it, if I recall correctly, for properly positioning it on the machine.

Of course, do what you want but I don't think the results will be enthusing.

Good luck,

Venson


Post# 171496 , Reply# 19   3/1/2012 at 10:19 (2,949 days old) by venson ()        
@countryguy . . .

Thanks for the links Gary. Especially for the power nozzle Vortech has taken on. Looks like Wessel Werk and Sebo have the PN source sewed up.

Venson


Post# 171501 , Reply# 20   3/1/2012 at 11:49 (2,949 days old) by Blackheart (North Dakota)        
Using tristar bags in a Miracle Mate

blackheart's profile picture
It will not seal completely a solution to it is to cut out a piece of cardboard to complete the seal i noticed an improvement in the suction and airflow at the hose end after adding it

Post# 171502 , Reply# 21   3/1/2012 at 12:17 (2,949 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
You are welcome Venson. The Vortech that I had came with the Wessel Werk power nozzle - that was about 7 or 8 years ago so they have been using them for awhile now.

Gary


Post# 171529 , Reply# 22   3/1/2012 at 16:57 (2,949 days old) by sanifan ()        
Gasket...

I guess the cardboard forms or contributes to the gasket effect, sealing up the leaks. I'm tempted to fashion something out of a sheet of silicon rubber. Not a flat sheet like the cardboard, but a gasket around the rim.

Of course, I could always order a bunch of Miracle Mate bags, too.

I notice that Vortec uses a similar bag. There's a cardboard cover with a hole in the middle, which is ringed by thin gasket rubber. Come to think of it, this style bag is no different than any number of other bags: Eureka/Sanitaire Mighty Mite, Electrolux uprights, Electrolux tanks, Windsor Versamatic, etc. All use cardboard as the structural element. The bag material is glued onto the cardboard. The hose mates to a hole in the cardboard. There is a thin rubber gasket around the hole to form a seal between the bag and hose.

You come to your senses and realize Tristar's open top design is the oddball, here. All the others actually make more sense in terms of containing dust during and after removal.

Are the Miracle Mate and Vortex bags interchangeable? I notice the Vortec's has a flip up handle.


Post# 171531 , Reply# 23   3/1/2012 at 17:07 (2,949 days old) by sanifan ()        
Wessel Works...

A similar Wessel Werks PN was used on the Hyla NST. Are the Wessel Werks PNs any good?

I notice Miracle Mate is using a different PN now. I don't know the entire history, but I know at some point they used Lindhaus and then Edgelift after that. Now a German model (Sebo?). Were the previous ones just no good?


Post# 171536 , Reply# 24   3/1/2012 at 17:25 (2,949 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)        

countryguy's profile picture
IMO, the Wessel Werks power nozzle is one of the best, if not the best, power nozzle currently on the market.

Gary


Post# 171664 , Reply# 25   3/2/2012 at 17:16 (2,948 days old) by floor-a-matic (somewhere)        

I think Compact/TriStar (IEC) Air Storm/Patriot, Miracle Mate, & Vortec Force were all designed by the same engineers? Or are they all affiliated together?

Post# 171668 , Reply# 26   3/2/2012 at 17:45 (2,948 days old) by venson ()        
Nope . . .

"I think Compact/TriStar (IEC) Air Storm/Patriot, Miracle Mate, & Vortec Force were all designed by the same engineers? Or are they all affiliated together?"

I think more the case is that several companies saw the molded design as a bankable idea and put their own spin on it. TriStar and Compact may be related but check the URLs following:

www.miraclemateusa.com/our_compan...

www.tristarvacuumscausa.com/about...

www.homedefensesystem.com/corp.ht...

vortechnorthamerica.com/page137.h...



Post# 173919 , Reply# 27   3/18/2012 at 15:11 (2,932 days old) by Koobam ()        
Poor suction

I have a near-new Miracle Mate Platinum with the Lindhause power nozzle and while it IS a very well built machine - the suction is barely average at best. And it loses it, quickly.


Our $80 Eureka Maxima canister has more suction, and any Miele, SEBO, Electrolux (newer models), and Kenmore will have more to MUCH more suction - this is a fact.


It's got decent enough airflow and pretty decent suction on a BRAND NEW BAG - but even after one vacuuming the suction noticeably diminishes and thus I'm looking to get rid of it. Even if it had pretty good suction all the time it's just too bulky, cumbersome, and tiring to keep for myself.


I'll put it this way - I'd take a Kenmore Magic Blue or any decent quality budget plastic canister over a Miracle Mate anyday, but that's just me.

Now that new Vortech looks quite interesting...!


Post# 173960 , Reply# 28   3/18/2012 at 19:02 (2,932 days old) by sanifan ()        
It's a curious thing...

When fired up my CXL for the first time, I also thought "what's the big deal?" My Dyson DC23 seemed to pull much harder, noticeably harder.

And while I'm still figuring out if my Tristar really is cleaning better than I think it is, I've grown to love the thing. It's become my daily driver. In fact, I've picked up two more CXL's and the same Miracle Mate with Lindhaus PN that you have.

All have similar suction. It's been said these have great airflow. While I haven't tested it myself, I'm inclined to believe that. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the idea of airflow and suction though. I don't know what the airflow numbers for my Dyson are, but it sucks a lot harder than my Tristar. I also get the impression that it's pulling more dirt, but again I haven't done a real test.

So my question is: is the Tristar really cleaning as well as we all believe, i.e., the best performance of anything out there, despite the impression that suction does not seem to be as great as some more modern canisters? Or is that a still-held belief based on something that was once true but may now not be?

Also, is greater airflow only an advantage when used in conjunction with good agitation, which loosens up the dirt so that the airflow can move it? In a straight suction situation, i.e. vacuuming hard floors, would there be a benefit from greater suction vs. airflow, since there's no agitation to loosen dirt and the vac relies mostly on the power of its suction to move dirt and debris?

What do you think? Based on side-to-side comparison, does the CXL really still clean better than some of the newest offering? I mean, I love my CXL, but sometimes I wonder.


Post# 173970 , Reply# 29   3/18/2012 at 20:34 (2,932 days old) by floor-a-matic (somewhere)        
@Koobam

If you're going to get rid of your Miracle Mate, I'll take it!

btw, a TriStar CXL WILL OUTCLEAN ANYTHING made today! :)

TriStar vacs have more powerful suction; & their PNs REALLY vibrate the carpet, even with a bristles-only brush roller w/o beater bars or bristle stiffeners.


Post# 173976 , Reply# 30   3/18/2012 at 21:13 (2,932 days old) by Koobam ()        

I'd wager my Electrolux UltraSilencer Deep Clean will out clean a TriStar, and outclean the Miracle Mate even more so. The suction is easily two and half times more than the Miracle Mate Platinum - and the Miracle Mate and TriStar are equal - then sorry, but drugs must be a hell of a thing...


floor-o-matic - It's all yours, but we need to discuss a price. It's a quality vacuum, for sure. I'd love to donate it but that's just not an option for us at the moment, that cool?

Hit up my email - Infinatesound@gmail.com


Post# 173977 , Reply# 31   3/18/2012 at 21:14 (2,932 days old) by Koobam ()        

And IF* the Miracle Mate and TriStart are equal, sorry




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