Thread Number: 10044
Dating An Old Bag
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Post# 109238   9/25/2010 at 09:30 (3,306 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas)        

eurekastar's profile picture
Does anyone know the approximate dates for when Kirby manufactured this replacement bag? I'm guessing that Kirby began making the bag around 1962. But when did the company switch to the bag with the more widely spaced ovals? This replacement bag was on a Kirby Model 512 that's been sitting out in my garage waiting for my attention. I never examined it carefully until yesterday when I discovered that it is in near new condition. So I removed the bag and laundered it. The bag spring is still nice and tight and there are no nicks, tears, fraying, or discoloration!




Post# 109279 , Reply# 1   9/25/2010 at 19:01 (3,306 days old) by kirbyclassiciii (Milwaukie, Oregon)        
This is a Bojack Bag of Sorts

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This was an aftermarket bag of sorts (genuine in that has the Kirby logos), for while it has the same motif as the Sanitronic 562/VII's bag, AFAIK, circa 1965 Kirby had still been selling the 518 bag as a replacement bag on all its pre-Sanitronic models, going back to the 505.

The first bag with the Kirby ovals (spaced close together like the circle pattern) was for the Dual Sanitronic 50 produced from 1965-1967, and the one with the wider-spaced ovals was for the Dual Sanitronic 80 produced from 1967-1969.

~Ben


Post# 109282 , Reply# 2   9/25/2010 at 19:23 (3,306 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas)        

eurekastar's profile picture
Thanks for that information! I've seen some early aftermarket bags with big gaudy looking Ks on them, but I've never seen this one until I got that 512. It's interesting that whoever made the bag was able to manufacture and market it with the Kirby name on it. I wonder if they had a license to do so from Kirby.

Post# 109283 , Reply# 3   9/25/2010 at 19:37 (3,306 days old) by compactelectra (Rancho Mirage, CA - New home of the Obamas)        
Watch Out

compactelectra's profile picture
For the use of the term "Old Bag!"

Post# 109289 , Reply# 4   9/25/2010 at 20:25 (3,306 days old) by briankirbyclass (Eudora Kansas)        

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LOL!,,no, ive never dated any old bags, but i did date a school teacher once! lol

Post# 109297 , Reply# 5   9/25/2010 at 22:00 (3,306 days old) by electrolux~137 ()        

I was gonna say, the best way to date an old bag is to buy her a corsage, take her out to a fancy restaurant, then get her back to the Golden Acres Senior Residence Home for a quick goodnight kiss on the cheek before Lights Out at 8:30!!



Post# 109298 , Reply# 6   9/25/2010 at 22:02 (3,306 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas)        

eurekastar's profile picture
LOL! Good thing I didn't write "old dirt bag"! I think I should have written "replacement bag". BTW, a friend told me that the bag is a genuine Kirby replacement bag for the 505 through 561. He thinks it was probably introduced around 1963 or 1964 (after the gray bags would have finally sold out).

Post# 109300 , Reply# 7   9/25/2010 at 22:07 (3,306 days old) by electrolux~137 ()        

The earliest I recall seeing that replacement bag (and, yes, it is a genuine Kirby product) is around 1970. It was on an early 500-series Kirby in the vac shop where I worked after school. I thought it was tacky looking at the time, but now I like it. It's not as nice as the original bag, but it does look pretty good on the older Kirbys.



Post# 109313 , Reply# 8   9/26/2010 at 00:51 (3,306 days old) by a007kirbyman (--->> Originally My Mom <<--- (now Wisconsin))        
Cloth bags...

a007kirbyman's profile picture
...old, ...new, ...NOS...


The 'tight' oval Kirby logo started actually on the Sanitronic VII & continued on the Dual Sanitronic 50.

The 'tight' circle Kirby logo in Tan/Beige-Brown was only originally used on the 562/Sanitronic.

The same bag as (eurekastar) Bill has posted, had replaced the gray Kirby bag prior to April of 1968. When exactly before that I have not nailed down yet. Any of the gray bags after that would have been NOS.

Hopefully this helps clarify the 'old bags' & the 'dirty old bags.'



On a little different, but related noted:


Over the years, several of my customers & friends who ride motorcycles have asked...

"Do you know the difference between a Kirby (insert whatever 'vintage' [primarily] brand vacuum) & a motorcycle?"


"On a motorcycle, you can put two dirt bags!"


Cheers & hagn all,

Bill



Post# 109367 , Reply# 9   9/26/2010 at 14:43 (3,305 days old) by dualsanitronic (Omaha)        

Actually, the tight ovals started with the Dual Sanitronic 50 for sure.Around 1966, ny parents got a 505 rebuild with the EXACT bag we're discussing, and my mom has a 1967 pic with me posing with it!

Post# 109388 , Reply# 10   9/26/2010 at 17:32 (3,305 days old) by electrolux~137 ()        
Tight Ovals

began with the 562. This bag was the first to have the Sani-Pocket and Sani-Scraper (zippered pocket on back side of bag where you put your hand inside to dislodge trapped dirt with a cardboard scraper) and a plastic collar at the top of the bag instead of cloth, and the top of the bag was sewn shut instead of folded. (Which I consider unfortunate, as it's more difficult to open the bag and turn it inside-out for thorough cleaning or airing-out).

The "tight circles" bag was ONLY made as a replacement bag, and, I am about 99.99% sure, only in red and gray. I can't ever recall seeing a tan/brown bag with tight circles, only ovals.

Also, something I need to fix on my Kirby history web site is the fact that the "Sirroco" color came out on the 562, but the tan color of some of the earlies 562s the tan color was more of a copper color, and indeed looks somewhat metallic.



Post# 109396 , Reply# 11   9/26/2010 at 18:32 (3,305 days old) by luxflairguy (Wilmington, NC)        

I'm going to do something I rarely do here and weigh-in on this. I have both a 562 and a Sanitronic VII. My 562 has rounds on the bag and my VII has ovals and the manuals for both also repeat that theme. My 562 is from May 1962 and the VII book is from July 1964. Here's a picture. Greg

Post# 109400 , Reply# 12   9/26/2010 at 19:08 (3,305 days old) by electrolux~137 ()        

Cool! Thanks for the correction and clarification. I also have a 562 & S.VII and manuals for both. Now that I can more easily get to my archives I'll have to take a look at the manuals and see if mine are also the same. They probably are, this maybe yet another example of my early senility.

Q - does your 562 have the original bag? If so, does it have a cloth cuff at the top, or the plastic cover? Sani-Zipper & Sani-Scraper??



Post# 109401 , Reply# 13   9/26/2010 at 19:12 (3,305 days old) by luxflairguy (Wilmington, NC)        

Charles! My bag has the plastic cover and the zipper/scraper. I just picked up another complete system for $35.00. Almost never used with the boxes.

Post# 109406 , Reply# 14   9/26/2010 at 20:14 (3,305 days old) by kirbyclassiciii (Milwaukie, Oregon)        
The Very First Sanitronic VIIs

kirbyclassiciii's profile picture
I remember the very first Sanitronic VIIs also still had the circle logo on the nameplate (on the underside of the motor unit), and that the later ones had the oval logo on it.

Post# 109416 , Reply# 15   9/26/2010 at 21:55 (3,305 days old) by normvac (COLUMBUS, OHIO)        
Support for YES, on Org. Kirby replacemnt.

I have to give Bill support on his knowledge of the fact that the Kriby cloth bag with the Kirby in circles, red and gray is an Orginal Kirby replacement cloth bag from the mid 60's.
I remember personally picking up my Grandmothers 512, as well as another family members Kirby 513. From the local Kirby Distriburitor after being completely serviced, bag and cord replaced and polished to it's shiny new self.
Again, when I say "picked them up" means that I was driving at the time. Which would have been 1963,64 or 65. I also agree with Charles, back in the day. I was not real fond of the look after those wonderfull older silk screen prints. Now,
and shortly after the first time of seeing them. They began to
grow on me. Feeling like, it was ok !
Thanks for my 2cents on verifying the orginality and the dates. It just tells you how old I really am !
Norm


Post# 109417 , Reply# 16   9/26/2010 at 21:57 (3,305 days old) by normvac (COLUMBUS, OHIO)        
Support for YES, on Org. Kirby replacemnt.

I have to give Bill support on his knowledge of the fact that the Kriby cloth bag with the Kirby in circles, red and gray is an Orginal Kirby replacement cloth bag from the mid 60's.
I remember personally picking up my Grandmothers 512, as well as another family members Kirby 513. From the local Kirby Distriburitor after being completely serviced, bag and cord replaced and polished to it's shiny new self.
Again, when I say "picked them up" means that I was driving at the time. Which would have been 1963,64 or 65. I also agree with Charles, back in the day. I was not real fond of the look after those wonderfull older silk screen prints. Now,
and shortly after the first time of seeing them. They began to
grow on me. Feeling like, it was ok !
Thanks for my 2cents on verifying the orginality and the dates. It just tells you how old I really am !
Norm


Post# 109427 , Reply# 17   9/27/2010 at 01:39 (3,304 days old) by kirbyvertibles (Independence, KS)        

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I dated an old bag once but it was for her money. Lol just kidding

Post# 109433 , Reply# 18   9/27/2010 at 02:52 (3,304 days old) by electrolux~137 ()        
Bags

Two of the classiest bags in Hollywood History!


CLICK HERE TO GO TO electrolux~137's LINK


Post# 109435 , Reply# 19   9/27/2010 at 03:09 (3,304 days old) by kirbyvertibles (Independence, KS)        

kirbyvertibles's profile picture
Oh Charles omg that is the best movie ever made!!!! Ms.Kahn was such a fox in her day as well as Teri Garr

Post# 109474 , Reply# 20   9/27/2010 at 11:56 (3,304 days old) by electrolux~137 ()        

I agree! I have never laughed so hard during a movie in all my life than the first time I saw this (in the theater). And every time I watch it again, I laugh even harder!

Check YouTube for outtakes and bloopers -- the cast had a very hard time keeping straight faces and not laughing themselves! They had to do some takes over and over and over, including the "get the bags" bit!!





Post# 109629 , Reply# 21   9/28/2010 at 19:03 (3,303 days old) by dualsanitronic (Omaha)        

The 562s and the Sanitronic VII both had tight circles on the bag itself. The 562 introduced many new photos in its book which will verify that. The oval logo DID begin with the Sanitronic VII but did not end up on the bag itself until the Dual Sanitronic 50.

Post# 109705 , Reply# 22   9/29/2010 at 10:49 (3,302 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas)        
Gregor

eurekastar's profile picture
That is such a subtle change in the manuals that I would have never noticed it. You have a good eye! I was looking through my Model 510 manual the other day and noticed how they had recycled a couple of photos that date to the 505. You have to look VERY carefully to notice that too.

Post# 109715 , Reply# 23   9/29/2010 at 12:16 (3,302 days old) by electrolux~137 ()        


Actually, there are photos in the 505-515 manual that go back to the 2C!

Look at the Kirby on the page "know the names of important points of operation" (page 7 in the 514 manual), and "tilting the rug cleaner nozzle" (page 15) -- look closely at the rear axle...





Post# 109733 , Reply# 24   9/29/2010 at 14:34 (3,302 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas)        
Charles

eurekastar's profile picture
I looked at that photo in my 510 manual when I went home for lunch. The rear axle is noticeably different. Another thing I noticed is the fan case is more squared (less rounded) suggesting that it is a 2C in the photo.

Post# 109896 , Reply# 25   9/30/2010 at 20:13 (3,301 days old) by sukething ()        
This is an amazing thread...I love it.

In my past, Charles and I have discussed this before stating that the Kirby manuels were not always correct, passing pictures on to the next manuel, so in a way who knows which was right.
The really early 562's had a model that had the darker bronzish, irradesent like the plastic piece on the top and on and off button all were this darker broanziah color. Did it not also have the white cord with the tan ends? I do have one of these crods and yes it is a true Kirby cord not a fake or a replacement cord it came with one of the Kirbys. I know I also had this same discussion with Michael Pletcher he was a huge Kirby fan and had many, many of the models and manuels.

Also notice that in the 562 book I beleive (I do not have the manuel infront of me) have a pic of the white cord, there is only one picture closer to the back of the book.
Kirby actually made to replace this tan bag on these machines was tan bag that Kirby logos on it but looked like the spaces between the logos on a Dual 80 bag, anyway it had a slider on the top. I also saw one of the bags on a Classic Omega. I also think I still have one of these bags in my box of bags somewhere.
The grey ones you all are talking about is yes the true Kirby replacements. I agree with Bill and Charlie I hated them at first but now well I like them as well. Later on Kirby did make a grey replacement bag for the older machines. I know I had this particular grey bag was on my 509 when I first got it back from being buffed. I really did not like it. It was grey but looked like the tan slider bag I had just discussed, yes it had a slider on top. Both the tan and grey later ones did not blow up like the older original bags nor the older grey replacent bag as well as the replacement Dual 80 bag did not blow up like the original. Somehow I have a disliking if the bag does blow up correctly. Humm...go figure.


To tell you what I have done if the spring is shot in an older bag, and I can save it, I used the spring out of the older grey replacement bag. It would not be easy but I did get the spring sewed back in there. As Charles knows I try as hard as I can to fix, re logo, repaint, those older bags as best I can.

This was a fun thread, has anyone seen my youtube video of me when I was a little tike pushing our brand new Kirby Dual 80 and when I got my Royal Handvac Model 501 brand new? The video is really short and silent becasue that is what we had when I was a kid, well some of us when we were kids..

David


CLICK HERE TO GO TO sukething's LINK


Post# 109898 , Reply# 26   9/30/2010 at 20:47 (3,301 days old) by sukething ()        
Oh I remember one more thing...

The only slight difference between the 562, S VII, and the Dual 50 was the small diamond shaped peice between the Kirby circles, the Dual 50 was darkened and the others 562 and S VII were clear, they were not painted brown. Now this I had asked my local Kirby dealer who has been selling them since the 514 and his dad had the distributorship. But again my memory and his memory mabye be failing.




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