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Thread Number: 35654
/ Tag: 50s/60s/70s Vacuum Cleaners
Convertible Maintenance Questions |
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| Post# 383018 , Reply# 1 12/22/2017 at 17:52 (2,315 days old) by bnsd60m9200 (Akron OH) | ||
dont replace the bearing. just oil it. ive serviced many convertibles over the years and i find original top sleeve bearing to be better quality and less friction than the new replacements. i would only replace it if the bearing is scored from grease or a bent armature (both ive seen but extremely rare cases)
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| Post# 383024 , Reply# 2 12/22/2017 at 20:15 (2,315 days old) by hooverU4089 (CT) | ||
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Interesting piece of advice! This is actually a follow-up of an older thread in which other members recommended replacing the bearing since the top shaft of the armature appeared to many of them to have overheated. CLICK HERE TO GO TO hooverU4089's LINK | ||
| Post# 383025 , Reply# 3 12/22/2017 at 20:18 (2,315 days old) by hooverU4089 (CT) | ||
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I should also mention that I will be replacing the carbon brushes. I noticed that the new ones have ridges on the seating surface. Do these just seat themselves while running? This is my first time replacing brushes on an electric motor before so I am curious. | ||
| Post# 383043 , Reply# 4 12/23/2017 at 04:57 (2,315 days old) by broomvac (N/A) | ||
Are you working on the same machine you discussed in your link? I didn't read the entire thread, but I gathered that you are trying to eliminate unexpected motor noises after the vacuum sits unused for a while.
My experience has been that the culprit for such a noise is usually the ball bearing, not the brass sleeve bearing. I know it's always tempting to try to lube or replace the sleeve bearing (because it's cheap/easy, right?) but after doing so, I find the unwanted noise usually persists. The best solution I have come up with for addressing the noise, then, is to either lube or replace the sealed ball bearing. On Hoover vacuums, this usually involves drilling out the rivets which hold on the steel retaining plate and replacing the ball bearing. Simply drill out the rivets and slide out the bearing. Now that the bearing is free, you can pry off both the rubber seals, blast the bearing with break cleaner, dry it thoroughly, re-pack it with high-temperature grease, and press the seals back on. This will fix the noise, however you still can't "roll back the miles" that were put on the bearing--it will never be as good as new. Much better is to simply go to a bearing shop (or shop online) to buy an identical replacement for only a few dollars. If you look hard enough, you will spot a combination of a few numbers/letters on the bearing. This is the bearing's "size." It is standardized; you do NOT have to buy a "Hoover" brand bearing. Hoover doesn't even manufacture their own bearings. They simply buy from a bearing supplier just like you. Popping in a brand new bearing is the way to make it work like new again. Now simply find suitable rivets or screws which can re-fasten the lower bearing retainer plate and...voila! Smooth operation again! See below for some pics. I have done this to my Concept One U3317, and I suspect the same can be done for you Convertible. I put in a brand new sealed ball bearing and three new blind rivets. Washers were added as reinforcement to keep the rivets from possibly pulling through the bearing retainer plate as I installed the new rivets. Disclaimer: Attempt this only if you are sure you can drill out the rivets without ruining the base or bearing retainer plate AND if you are sure you have the correct hardware to re-assemble everything. You do run the risk of ruining things if you do it wrong, however, if properly executed, this service produces great results. I know it sounds like a lot of work, but if you have the right tools and hardware, you can get it done in a matter of minutes. Good luck, and let us know how it works out. | ||
| Post# 383059 , Reply# 6 12/23/2017 at 14:26 (2,314 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA) | ||
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The brushes will have to seat themselves and unless you use an armature/commutator 'stone' there will be a lot of carbon dust all over. You can Youtube the process, as it's not hard to do...just have to be mindful of the LIVE current in the armature.
Kevin | ||
| Post# 383090 , Reply# 10 12/24/2017 at 14:11 (2,313 days old) by bnsd60m9200 (Akron OH) | ||
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| Post# 383095 , Reply# 11 12/24/2017 at 16:35 (2,313 days old) by Vaclover (Freestate, Virginia, South Africa) | ||
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Grease or oil? The top of my Hoover U4006 is a sleeve bearing. Do i oil or grease it? I greased mine and it sounds better. | ||
| Post# 383097 , Reply# 12 12/24/2017 at 17:10 (2,313 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA) | ||
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Absolutely, nothing coarser than 1000 grit wet & dry paper. Use the stone and you won't have to worry about the paper/type.
You can clean things with denatured alcohol.....you don't want to remove any potting finish on the armature itself.
Kevin
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| Post# 383135 , Reply# 13 12/26/2017 at 14:46 (2,311 days old) by hooveru4089 (CT) | ||
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Thanks for the tips! I did use 220 at first just to remove residue, but I will finish it off with 1000+ before seating the new brushes. Is denatured alcohol the same as isopropyl? | ||
| Post# 383157 , Reply# 14 12/27/2017 at 10:57 (2,310 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA) | ||
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No, it's a lot stonger. You can find denatured alcohol at places that sell painting supplies or a good hardware stores....pretty common chem. Cleans up vacs especially well, even the cord.
Kevin | ||
| Post# 383159 , Reply# 15 12/27/2017 at 11:25 (2,310 days old) by hooverU4089 (CT) | ||
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I'll have to get my hands on that stuff. Do you soak the commutator in it or apply it with a paintbrush or likewise? | ||
| Post# 383160 , Reply# 16 12/27/2017 at 12:02 (2,310 days old) by jade_angel (Fort Collins, CO) | ||
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Denatured alcohol is pretty much just ethanol with enough methanol, pyridine or other chemicals added to make it toxic. Home Depot should carry it. 91% isopropyl alcohol or 91% ethyl rubbing alcohol should serve roughly the same purpose. | ||
| Post# 383165 , Reply# 18 12/27/2017 at 14:23 (2,310 days old) by jade_angel (Fort Collins, CO) | ||
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I did a little more looking into it, and yeah, I was all wet. Disregard my post. | ||
| Post# 383482 , Reply# 29 1/3/2018 at 02:50 (2,304 days old) by broomvac (N/A) | ||
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Hate to say it.
I would not have sanded the upper bearing surface on the shaft. Not only will the diameter be smaller now (more play), but the shaft surface will likely never be as true or as smooth as it was before. If the surface is not as smooth as it was before, any bearing, new or used, lubricated or not, has the potential to wear out the bearing more quickly now.
But do not panic. Although it may be less than ideal, I'm sure it will last just fine. Replace the upper bearing if you want, but If you have already lubricated the original one and it doesn't sound or look terrible, the original should work just fine too. The honest truth is, it's a pretty robust vacuum motor that is likely never going to see enough use to wear out any of its components ever again. Use it to your heart's content, let the motor break in after all the work you have performed on it, and enjoy your Hoover. I would be surprised if it ever failed you. | ||
Post# 383494 , Reply# 31 1/3/2018 at 09:27 (2,303 days old) by vacuumlad1650  (Wauponsee, IL) |
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The reason an upper bearing will be stiff is it has not been seated. The original bearings wear down from Round to an Egg shape. You don't want to give an armature spinning at 7000rpm the opportunity to shift back and forth.
Install the new upper bearing, and then rotate the fan by hand. Then, while spinning the fan as fast as you can, give the upper bearing some decent smacks with a rubber mallet. This will seat it, and allow the motor to freely spin with no resistance. Make sure the felt pads around the bearing were soaked with the proper oil (i use 3-in-1 MOTOR oil) so it will continue to self lubricate. | ||
| Post# 383559 , Reply# 32 1/4/2018 at 15:41 (2,302 days old) by hooverU4089 (CT) | ||
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I take it that I need to lubricate the new bearing before installing. Is that correct? Once again, thanks for all your help. | ||
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Post# 383592 , Reply# 33 1/4/2018 at 23:19 (2,302 days old) by vacuumlad1650 (Wauponsee, IL) |
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| Post# 383601 , Reply# 34 1/5/2018 at 09:15 (2,301 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA) | ||
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Agreed...always 'prime' a sintered bearing like that....then the wick oil will take over. Just make sure the new sintered bushing you use isn't the 'dry' lubricated type.
Kevin
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| Post# 383833 , Reply# 37 1/8/2018 at 10:21 (2,298 days old) by hooveru4089 (CT) | ||
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Commutator stones would indeed be tricky. It looks like the only way to do this would be to run the motor with only 1 brush. My only other option would be to connect a drill to the armature and run that, as I had done seating the brushes. | ||
| Post# 383877 , Reply# 38 1/8/2018 at 17:05 (2,298 days old) by hooverU4089 (CT) | ||
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Check out the first picture in this thread. What do you think of this? CLICK HERE TO GO TO hooverU4089's LINK | ||
| Post# 383939 , Reply# 39 1/9/2018 at 12:32 (2,297 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA) | ||
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Best way is to access the commutator while everything is in place. Stonning it that way works to seat the brushes. Maybe that's why that hole was drilled...dunno. If you can get to the commutator somehow by shaping the stone or drilling a hole....that would be the best way. Stones are like $5 for small ones.
Kevin | ||
| Post# 384148 , Reply# 40 1/12/2018 at 14:11 (2,294 days old) by hooverU4089 (CT) | ||
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Where in particular are they most readily available online? I've seen few listings on Amazon for bulk quantities but not much. I think I will probably end up drilling a hole and plugging it up somehow with a plastic plug or cap. | ||
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