Thread Number: 35350  /  Tag: Brand New Vacuum Cleaners
Internet censorship the new Tacony product!
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Post# 380290   10/26/2017 at 11:24 by vacuumdevil (Denver)        

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I wasn't sure which form to put this in so it will go here.
I got a call at 8:30 this morning that the current company I work for is account is getting suspended. Due to my videos in employee who does stuff on his own time on no associate with the business.
Apparently Simplicity/Riccar cannot handle a little criticism. I will say I have several videos promoting their products as well that are now removed as requested.
As somebody who is sold Tacony products for years and made them a lot of money I see this as a below-the-belt below.
I don't believe anything I've ever said is so bad or exposed anything that needed a cover-up or censoring. They have a right to freedom of business as I have a right to freedom of speech.
I wonder what vacuum lands thoughts are on a vacuum company intimidating people into getting press their way?






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Post# 380292 , Reply# 1   10/26/2017 at 12:21 by Hank (Cali)        

hank's profile picture
That makes me never want to purchase their products actually. Limiting opinions they donít approve of is bad for them in the long run. They should take peoples issues with their stuff as a chance to make it better...

Post# 380293 , Reply# 2   10/26/2017 at 12:41 by FCS3 (Hawaii)        
Hey vacuumdevil

In the U.S. a private company (whether their stocks are "publicly held" or not)
is pretty much a dictatorship. They need only comply with business law, and to
some extent employment law regarding ethical practices.
Companies will uphold the CEO's and major shareholders' personal political
or "moral" views, even if they impinge on employees' or customers' rights.
The Hobby Lobby suit is a good example.
Simplicity/Riccar, Tacony, and whoever will run their companies according to
their best interests, only until compelled by lawsuit to change a given policy.


Post# 380295 , Reply# 3   10/26/2017 at 13:32 by vacuumdevil (Denver)        

vacuumdevil's profile picture
@FCS3 Very true they have every right as a business to run it the way they want. But my point is this makes them look way worse. If they had reached out to me I would have been happy to help them with research and development and fix the problems they have.

Post# 380299 , Reply# 4   10/26/2017 at 15:07 by Kirbysthebest (Wichita, KS)        
Just curious

What are they wanting as a concession in order to Un-suspend the account?

Freedom of Speech is actually only guaranteed in political/government arenas. When it comes to an employer, or someone the employer depends upon for livelihood, they can quash the "freedom" part of your speech in order to insure that their product is presented in the best light as they see it.

This not to say that Tacony is any worse than any other corporate entity. They are just trying to bring the soldiers back in line.



Post# 380300 , Reply# 5   10/26/2017 at 15:25 by dysonman1 (Rolla, Missouri)        

dysonman1's profile picture
I don't believe you.

Let's say the store you work for is ABC Vacuum (made up name). ABC Vacuum has an account with Tacony. Tacony will not suspend ABC Vacuum's account unless it's in arrears (non payment) OR ABC Vacuum has failed to comply with their written dealership agreement with Tacony.

Tacony (as a company) could hardly care less what some random repair man employee does on you tube UNLESS it would be slanderous to them. In which case, ABC Vacuum wouldn't be called, the You Tube account holder (i.e. You) would get a cease and desist letter from the attorneys.


Post# 380304 , Reply# 6   10/26/2017 at 16:16 by FCS3 (Hawaii)        
I totally see your point vacuumdevil

They seemed to relish the idea of unsolicited testimony praising their
products and those of their manufacturing partner. Perhaps they viewed it as
positive to have this freelance advertising on such a popular video site.
But, I take it you are not associated with a professional advertising firm,
nor are under specific contract to promote these products.
Thus, your "free speech" is an asset when all the reviews are splendid.
But it is a liability when any of these companies hears the least negative
comment.
As far as Tacony telling Simplicity/Riccar how to conduct their YouTube campaign,
Any company can apply legal leverage to any other they're contractually
associated with, if the offended company feels they can and should act.
Whichever company pulled your vids did so with the approval of the other.
My guess is the company you represented on YouTube may replace your vids
with slick, professionally produced segments, hosted by a handpicked
professional company spokesperson.


Post# 380305 , Reply# 7   10/26/2017 at 16:28 by carolinaguy1996 (Candler, NC)        

I've seen people review Tacony products on Youtube. It's not fair.

Post# 380306 , Reply# 8   10/26/2017 at 16:36 by vacuumdevil (Denver)        

vacuumdevil's profile picture
@dysonman1 That's what I don't understand why I have never been contacted by them directly it always seems to trickle down through our representative. My channel is relatively small and reaches a small audience. There are much larger YouTube channels example" Doug demuro" who make companies look far worse, Then me simply stating they could improve a few things.

Apparently because I do work for a dealer who sells their products that somehow puts the dealer in violation of of the dealer agreement.


As I have repeatedly stated I do not represent any vacuum shop or any vacuum brand with "performance reviews" . I prefer to keep the dealership I work for as Anonymous as possible.


Post# 380307 , Reply# 9   10/26/2017 at 17:14 by Tseg (World Traveller)        

Public relations is tricky business. Sorry to hear of their path forward.

Post# 380308 , Reply# 10   10/26/2017 at 17:15 by Sharky (Germany)        

Well, I think it is never a smart move for a company to try to silence people on the internet. Nevertheless, you will be the one losing out on this matter. You will be regarded as the troublemaker and your boss will have no other chance than to get everyone in line.

It does not matter if a man heavily affiliated with Tacony believes you or not. I think that you are probably more open and outspoken than it is smart to be in these days, therefore I tend to believe you.

Free speech is important, but so is compliance when running a business. Nevertheless, for my part I'm grateful for the opportunity to see for myself how overly complicated Tacony machines are and how they are doing compared to other brands. This may not be appropriate for an employee to do - but don't put your job at risk for a vacuum cleaner. Let's hope for some sort of Streisand effect and maybe your employer will make up his mind about which partnerships are worth following through.


Post# 380310 , Reply# 11   10/26/2017 at 17:52 by Hank (Cali)        

hank's profile picture
They must not have much faith in their products if they are so worried about your videos, this actually says a lot about them as a company... Ive seen alot of your videos, probably all the tacony ones. I don't recall you ever bashing the machines (even though people on here will say different (fanboy-ism)), I do however remember your praising the symmetry line as will as the supralight varieties. Who knows maybe you are just the tip of the spear so to speak, maybe they will start doing it to everyone else who associates with their products that works in a vac shop.

Post# 380324 , Reply# 12   10/27/2017 at 11:28 by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Oh my word!

I can see both sides. It seems the world of online reviewing is as volatile as the stock market. I take it with a grain of salt. Part fact, part opinion. If I like the review, or have a small doubt, I go to a store and ask to have the product demonstrated in person. Then I hear can real world sounds, etc.
I saw the Riccar product review and didn't find it degrading of the product. Who builds a perfect machine? It would cost a fortune.
That said, I am not one in favor of censorship.
Not a direct parallel, but didn't Larry Flynt win that one?
If I don't like it, I can simply not look at it.
So then, at the preceding introduction to any infomercial is a disclaimer: "Views and opinions of the product do not in any way reflect the advocacy of this station, or it's owners, or share holders."
If you are the registered youtube channel owner, isn't this part of it? Where to draw the line? The vacuum shop wants customers. Tacony wants customers.
A friend purchased a vacuum from a specialty shop and after two weeks decided they din't care for it. The store graciously gave full credit toward another machine.


Post# 380329 , Reply# 13   10/27/2017 at 13:48 by Beko1987 (Stokenchurch, United Kingdom)        

Sorry to hear this has happened to you, it does smack of them shutting you up, although I guess the contract with the shop probably overrides this...

Happy to host your videos in question on my channel if it helps? I don't have the files though...

All the best for the future though, keep us updated on any developments


Post# 380351 , Reply# 14   10/28/2017 at 01:28 by huskyvacs (Indiana)        

huskyvacs's profile picture
I don't know if you knew this or not, but because of everything being on social media now, companies have ghost employees that patrol youtube/facebook/twitter and whatnot on a daily basis for certain words and search terms related to the company.

One of those people likely found your video (whatever the original title was) by searching for that, watched it, and reported you to the company you work for, and because of youtube's rules, you got reprimanded because a 3rd party reported you for hate speech violations and/or what they constitute as harassment.

If anyone here goes dump diving, there is a forum on reddit about it, and on that forum when you are talking about some dumpster finds, you are asked to censor the name of the location you found them at. Like say "paperclips" instead of "staples" because that way the company cannot google it or know where it came from.


Post# 380435 , Reply# 15   10/30/2017 at 11:11 by bisonian (Where the buffalo roamed! (Ocala, FL))        

It's important to keep in mind, as others have noted, that this is NOT a "freedom of speech"/First Amendment issue. The First Amendment protects you ONLY from GOVERNMENT censorship.

That means you are free to say what you want without government interference. It does NOT mean you are free from consequences of what you say. You can say a private company makes bad products. In turn, the company can take legal action against you. Your employer can fire you. Those are the consequences you risk.


Post# 380437 , Reply# 16   10/30/2017 at 12:09 by FantomTechGuy (ND, US)        
Wow

fantomtechguy's profile picture
I can't believe they did this.

If I made a Vacuum and sent it to you, I would WANT you to criticize it.
Thats how I can fix mistakes and make my products better.

To keep it PG, screw Simplicity/Riccar and let's boycott them.
I will be throwing my Riccar in the trash after this post.


Post# 380440 , Reply# 17   10/30/2017 at 16:29 by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
Yeah, I just read that Apple just fired a corporate employee because he allowed his daughter to video him showing her the features of his pre-release iPhone X and the video went viral when she posted it online. Pretty harsh.

The bottom line here is that corporate entities are pretty territorial about their messaging and go to great lengths to maintain control over it. The fact that you are an employee of one of their dealers and presumably shoot your videos at the store, regardless of whether you are on the clock or not, it would be easy for a casual viewer to misinterpret that as meaning that you're speaking for the store and/or the company.

In the corporation's eyes, your actions as an employee are, in essence, the store's actions and your independent videos are seen by the corporation as rogue messaging on the part of the store, especially since you're shooting the videos on their premises. And since they have the store's phone number but not yours, it's easier for them to exert pressure on the store to discipline what they say as a misbehaving employee.

Corporations are often very specific about what their franchisees can and cannot do. Often, there is verbiage written into the franchise agreement to codify those limitations. If the franchisee does things prohibited in the agreement or fails to do things that are required in the agreement, the franchisor has the right to take punitive action, up to and including suspending or even revoking the franchise.


Post# 380450 , Reply# 18   10/30/2017 at 21:42 by luxlife (Under a Pecan Tree)        
Just a curious question......

Have you tested any other brands with the particle meter that "blow" a perfect score of zero? It seems that only the Miele machines do this in your reviews. I'm not bashing Miele. (I've owned a few)

Post# 380545 , Reply# 19   11/1/2017 at 17:20 by laup (alabama)        

There's only 2 solutions to this problem. Become an engineer for tacony and fix their product yourself. Or you could start your own vac company and dominate tacony. lol

Post# 380772 , Reply# 20   11/6/2017 at 11:10 by beko1987 (Stokenchurch, United Kingdom)        

The videos will live!

Mr Devil. I finally got your message! (sorry, I rarely log onto my YT from a PC to read the messages...)

I am uploading the videos on my channel so they can stay alive, and we shall see how the go! Currently scheduled for every Saturday for the next few weeks, to go live at Midnight UK time, so the US guys will hopefully be awake when they go live!

I will say though, that if I get grief from Tacony/Whoever, and have to take the videos down I will, but I'll post the gory details up for all to see here!

http://youtube.com/beko1987 if anyone doesn't already subscribe who wants to be notified when these videos go up!

Also Mr. Devil, please let me know if I need to edit any titles or descriptions, I've just sort of copied and pasted stuff from your files!

Hopefully me not working for any vacuum related company, and being in the UK will help, if they do message me I can sort of tell them to stuff it initially, although if my channel gets jepordised in an annoying way then I'll have to can the videos. We'll let it run as long as it does!

US people - Did any of these machines get sold in the UK under another brand? That would be fun to get hold of one and do a video of!

All the best!

Sam


Post# 380781 , Reply# 21   11/6/2017 at 14:27 by vacuumdevil (Denver)        

vacuumdevil's profile picture
@beko1987 I'm quite honored thank you.

Post# 380784 , Reply# 22   11/6/2017 at 15:37 by vacuumdevil (Denver)        

vacuumdevil's profile picture
Well I just received a call from Tacony.
John was Quiet gentleman like about the situation.
They seem to just be upset about my harsh nature when I refer to things.
He was kind of surprised when I mentioned I was a vacuum collector and didn't have any personal Vendetta against Tacony .
I think they're thoroughly confused now.
Especially after I explained to him that I judge all the product &companies like this. He didn't really make very many points on the phone but he did say he'd call me back I will keep you all posted.


Post# 380785 , Reply# 23   11/6/2017 at 16:42 by KirbyClassicIII (Milwaukie, Oregon)        
vacuumdevil

kirbyclassiciii's profile picture

Nice to hear the fact he had been gentlemanly towards your ordeal... yes, I really do hope you can patch things up with them soon!

 

It would be best not to be too critical about anything!

 

~Ben


Post# 380791 , Reply# 24   11/6/2017 at 18:11 by Tseg (World Traveller)        

Mr. John got pooh in his pants when he heard you were a collector. Marketers know collectors are the thought leaders and can make or break a brand. Their story may change. They'll probably mail you their top of the line product as a peace offering.

Post# 380852 , Reply# 25   11/7/2017 at 15:14 by ralph123 (Little Rock, AR)        

"Mr. John got pooh in his pants when he heard you were a collector. Marketers know collectors are the thought leaders and can make or break a brand. Their story may change. They'll probably mail you their top of the line product as a peace offering."


Maybe they'll deliver the top of the line vacuum in a brand new Mercedes, ha ha.
Highly doubtful on all counts, but there's nothing wrong with dreaming.


Post# 380872 , Reply# 26   11/7/2017 at 20:13 by Sharky (Germany)        
"Thought leaders"

Quote, "Marketers know collectors are the thought leaders and can make or break a brand."

Are you serious or just being sarcastic?


Post# 380907 , Reply# 27   11/8/2017 at 06:17 by Tseg (World Traveller)        

"Thought leaders"

"Are you serious or just being sarcastic?"

Very serious. Especially in the age of social media where consumers frequently do significant on-line research before making a purchase >$100.

Collectors or 'enthusiasts' (I'm more the latter than the former) tend to be very active in the social on-line space related to the product category. This is one reason Tacony wanted to squash a negative video. There are vacuum enthusiasts/collectors pumping out product videos up to several times a week and other subscribed enthusiasts watch them, elevating their views and ratings, which then make them higher in the top left quadrant of the search page. If enthusiasts negatively 'turn' on Tacony it has a cascading effect that makes its way to the consumer market.





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