Thread Number: 33828  /  Tag: Brand New Vacuum Cleaners
New Brushroll?
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Post# 367397   2/23/2017 at 03:46 by Mixman (Central NJ)        

Hi,

When do you know it's time for a new brushroll? I have an older Miele S7 and a newer Miele U1. The U1's bristles are stiffer than those on the older S7. Could it be that they just made them less stiff several years ago compared to the newer U1's? I notice that the U1 agitates better too. Just wanted to know whether I should change out the brushroll? Knowing that Miele brushrolls aren't cheap is why I am asking.

Mike





Post# 367399 , Reply# 1   2/23/2017 at 07:09 by vacerator (Macomb Michigan)        
Good question Mike.

I'd go to a vac shop with your vac and compare it to the newer brush rolls. I don't own a Miele, but I have two Beam power nozzles, and one has stiffer brushes than the other. One is a Eureka Express style design with a steel beater bar. It has the stiffer. The other has a polymer beater bar with softer bristles, and no beater bumps for delicate area rugs.

Post# 367400 , Reply# 2   2/23/2017 at 08:27 by dysonman1 (Rolla, Missouri)        

dysonman1's profile picture
Miele's profit makers are brushes, bags, and HEPA filters. Way, way overpriced.
Here's how to tell if you need new brushes: Lay a business card across the brush opening. Move the card back and forth (left and right). If the protruding brushes snap the card, they are long enough to penetrate into the rug. If not, it's time for a new, extremely expensive brush roll (think $125).


Post# 367414 , Reply# 3   2/23/2017 at 12:29 by Mixman (Central NJ)        

The length of the bristles is still there but the stiffness isn't.

Neither Miele nor Sebo are great when it comes to those profit makes. At least with Sebo the brushrolls are $24 and are easy to change. Although with Miele you can catch discounts here or there, Sebo there are no discounts to be had.


Post# 367416 , Reply# 4   2/23/2017 at 13:11 by hooverkid (PA,USA)        

hooverkid's profile picture
That's exactly why I like my simplicity synergy. After about 4 years the brushes got soft, I was able to change them out for something to the tune of $10. If your U1 agitates better than I'm sure that a new brushroll would help out the S7 but they are as you know pretty expensive.

Post# 367420 , Reply# 5   2/23/2017 at 15:40 by Ctvacman (CT)        

Let's not forget expensive brands tend to be expensive to fix. Someone paying $1,000 for a vacuum shouldn't care how much bags or filters cost.

Post# 367734 , Reply# 6   3/2/2017 at 15:47 by Rolls_rapide (Scotland)        

Perhaps part of the reason for the difference in brush flexibility is the silly EU vacuum regulations?

The older European Miele S uprights were more powerful. The current European U uprights have lower power. Maybe the stiffer bristles are there to compensate for lower power? (even though the USA is not covered by the EU nonsense).And perhaps it was easier for Miele just to make one type of brushroll for all markets.

Alternatively, Miele might since have identified that American carpets are plusher, thus needing a more aggressive agitation.

I don't know, I am only surmising.


Post# 368374 , Reply# 7   3/13/2017 at 21:54 by Mixman (Central NJ)        
Could Be the EU Regulations?

I just tested my Miele U1 Auto Eco against my S7 Salsa and the Auto Eco is both louder and more aggressive when it come to the brushroll. It seems like the bristles are stiffer and longer on the Auto Eco which makes it louder, but it does have more aggression too. I think this was done on purpose. Now whether or not it is because of the EU regulations or not I am not sure, but it does seem lime a design decision was taken as of late to make the brushrolls more aggressive.....even at the expense of a little more noise.

Post# 368377 , Reply# 8   3/13/2017 at 23:21 by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
My litmus test for determining when a brush roll needs replacing involves what I affectionately call the cat hair test. If I have difficulty getting cat hair up from my Persian rugs in more than a two or three passes, it's time for a new brush roll.

I know Kirby changed their brush roll design during the run of the Sentria. Previous G series Kibys came with medium to stiff brush roll. Beginning with the Sentria, the brush roll came much stiffer, so much so that it can damage more delicate grades of carpet, so Kirby also came out with a softer brush roll for more delicate carpets. The original G series brush roll, which was a good all-arounder, was discontinued after the two newer styles were introduced so now when users of G3-G7 machines need to replace their brush rolls, they must now choose which style will better suit their needs. When I replaced the brush roll in my G5, I got the stiffer style and it performs quite well. Both of my Gsixes still have their original brush rolls.


Post# 368378 , Reply# 9   3/14/2017 at 00:02 by kirbylux77 (Orillia, Ontario, Canada)        

kirbylux77's profile picture
Mike - I highly doubt the EU regulations would make a difference in the U1 Auto Eco's performance, or influence Miele's decision to make the brushes on the brushroll more stiffer than the previous S7 Salsa you own. I think Rolls_Rapide is right on this one, it may have to do with the company realizing a stiffer brushroll for North American carpeting was needed, or more likely, feedback from consumers communicating with Miele or also from their authorized dealers & what their customers have been telling them. Even though this upright range is sold in Europe, it's important to remember that this was not only Miele's first upright they designed from scratch themselves, but it was specifically intended for America & Canada as they needed a product to compete with Sebo & Simplicity/Riccar.

Colby - I agree with you, if you're spending over $500 for a quality machine you have to realize the cost of parts & consumables are going to be in line with the cost of the vacuum. But try telling that to normal consumers who are sick & tired of low & mid range vacuums breaking down & giving them headaches, & then decide to try a high end brand like Miele, convinced by their own research & by consulting with a vac shop it will last longer without problems. It's one thing to spend $700, $800, or $1,000 for a new upright or canister, thinking you're buying better quality. But in the average family home, with a husband, wife, 1 or more kids dragging in dirt, & a dog or cat shedding fur, the average consumer is going to find it hard to justify spending up to $5 per bag or $50 for a HEPA filter for Miele, Sebo or some other high end brand, when in their mind, the Dyson or Shark they just got rid of cleaned just as well WITHOUT ridiculous bag, filter or belt costs. You don't think people consider it a issue with their vacuum? Go ahead & look on Amazon at all the people buying generic bags & filters for their vacuums & leaving reviews, they feel like they have no choice but to buy generic parts online to keep operating costs reasonable. That's the whole reason people buy bagless vacuums to begin with. IMHO, it's a problem the vacuum industry is going to have to address.

Tom - I wouldn't start bashing Miele bag & filter costs so quick there. One thing I'm sure you don't want customers coming to the Museum, or members here on Vacuumland to know, is that your Simplicity & Riccar vacuums actually cost MORE MONEY than Miele's vacuums do to operate. On my Simplicity Gusto, the HEPA filter costs $35 to buy alone, or $50 to buy as a set with the carbon prefilter (if you use the filter kit for the previous S38 & buy the S38 filter holder, not the newer HEPA filter & pre-motor granulated carbon filter kit), & it's rated for only 25 hours. Miele's HEPA filter is rated for 50 hours, & costs $50. So that means for 50 hours of operation, the Simplicity filter costs $70, which is $20 more than operating a Miele canister the same amount of hours. In addition, a 6 pack of Simplicity Type H bags costs $20, which is $3.33 per bag, vs Miele G/N bags costing $4.38 per bag if you buy the 8 bag value pack. But not only is the Simplicity bag slightly smaller, but because it's only a 3 ply HEPA bag, the HEPA Cloth material clogs easier & I find with my Gusto the bag needs to be changed at 1/2 full. The Miele Airclean bags maintain full power up to 3/4 full, so not only do you get better cleaning performance, you get longer bag life, so it's really a dead heat as to whether the Simplicity/Riccar or Miele bags are more expensive.

Rob

Rob


Post# 368423 , Reply# 10   3/14/2017 at 17:21 by crazykirbydude (Lexington, KY)        

I bought a Eureka Maxima for $10. Turned it on, it sounded terrible. One of the brush bearings had exploded. THAT'S when you replace a brushroll. LOL.

Post# 368426 , Reply# 11   3/14/2017 at 17:51 by ocscott3085 (DMV)        

Sidenote - I actually reached out to Miele today to inquire whether or not the brushrolls have changed on the uprights since their introduction and I was told no. The brushrolls have remained the same since the series came out.

Post# 368434 , Reply# 12   3/14/2017 at 18:59 by Mixman (Central NJ)        
oscott3085

While that may be true in an overall design sense, I can tell you that some have longer bristles and some have different color gearing (white vs black). I am sure they have made smaller changes along the way as they went along, one of those changes might have been the stiffness of the bristles.

Post# 368435 , Reply# 13   3/14/2017 at 19:30 by Mixman (Central NJ)        
Rob

Yes, I totally agree with you that the industry needs to get the bag and filter costs under control. Those high costs are playing right into the bagless makers(Shark and Dyson)hands. $70 a year for bags and filters minimum is a bit much, on top of the already high cost of the bagged vac. Heck this is the biggest selling point for the Dyson Cinectic, their most expensive vac. Their point being that you not only don't have to worry about buying filters or bags, you don't have to maintain the filters either. Even though we know this is not true, most of the public does not and never will know that.

Never the less the greed with the vac supplies costs may be what does the bagged vacs in or more likely, makes them into expensive niche items in the long run.





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