Thread Number: 33805  /  Tag: Pre-1950 Vacuum Cleaners
How much restoration is acceptable?
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Post# 367184   2/19/2017 at 21:56 (2,593 days old) by Warren_L (Georgia, USA)        

A question I've been ruminating about for a month now; how much restoration is acceptable?
I've seen several Constellations getting painted and powder coated, brought back to looking new.
Is there a cut-off date?
Would you paint and buff an 1890's vacuum?
Does too much restoration remove the value?
Is it acceptable to reproduce broken/missing parts and decals/stencils?

There was an antique collectors joke, "how much is it worth when you've buffed all the value off".

What is your opinion?


Post# 367190 , Reply# 1   2/19/2017 at 22:45 (2,593 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture
I have always gone full Monty, I return it to new condition.
With alloy machines that's easy, You simply rebuff them and from a antique point of view very little is done to remove the machines originality.

On painted machines it depends on what condition I fond them in, a few are in really good condition with only a few tiny scratches, Others look like they were used as boat anchors and need a respray.

I don't collect vacuums as an investment, Probably the opposite. I collect them to restore them to new condition and display and share them. I am sure some of them have some decent value to them just due to their age but like so many have said their value is only what someone will pay for them. At the end of the day they are mine for my enjoyment and as such I will keep them in a condition that pleases me.

I think that if done right a good restoration job can increase the value and appeal of a item like a vacuum, Very few people are going to want a scrappy looking machine , or pay good money for it because its original, If it looks good they will pay more for it. Look at vintage Coke dispensers and fridges. when restored they go for ridiculous prices.



Post# 367194 , Reply# 2   2/20/2017 at 02:53 (2,593 days old) by midcenturyfan (Kings Lynn, Norfolk, England)        

midcenturyfan's profile picture
I have to admit that I tend to be the other extreme. I would, generally, rather see a tatty original machine than one that has been painted. That, of course, depends upon the condition of the machine when you get it, and each case has to be judged on it's merits. Obviously, I try to buy machines that are in as good a condition as I can find.

I don't use any of my machines, so a perished original cable does not cause a problem, but if you want the thing to work, then it must be safe.

Robin.


Post# 367195 , Reply# 3   2/20/2017 at 03:51 (2,593 days old) by kenkart ()        
I try

To keep it ALL ORIGINAL, If I can, so if I find a nice machine with a new cord on it, the first thing is find a original cord and plug , same for the motor, if it had a 4250 or 4450 Lamb, then that is what is going back, If a machine is rusty and banged up, I don't keep it , I try to get fairly nice examples and clean and polish them, and I use ALL of my machines, some of course more than others, Right now I have been using a 68 Convertible and a 55 Wards canister by Apex.

Post# 367199 , Reply# 4   2/20/2017 at 06:36 (2,593 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture
I think it also depends on whats available, Here were I live finding a good conditioned machine is nearly impossible, But them I love to restore them, I must admit my favorite machines are the ones that caused me the most headaches in restoration.

I do try and keep the parts original, Motors and Cords but their is only so much you can do and if the motor is gone and a original replacement is not available then I will make a plan to get it running with the next most suitable motor. No butchering though. Even if I must fit a newer style motor into the machine as was in the case of my Electrolux d70 twin motor, it must look like it belongs their.

Some times things dont go to plan though, The light green/white came out to dark but after spraying it I liked it so much I kept it that way. I like to see it as giveing a wreck a new lease on life rather than becoming a part of the fender for your new Buick.


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Post# 367211 , Reply# 5   2/20/2017 at 11:31 (2,592 days old) by human (Pines of Carolina)        

human's profile picture
The answer to your question is totally subjective. It's in the eye of the beholder and as others have stated, it depends on a lot of variables:

•how old is it?
•how rare is it?
•how complete is it?
•how readily available are replacement parts?
•are there compatible parts available that will significantly improve design and/or function?

The older an item is, the more rare it is, and the more complete it is, the more I'm likely to err on the side of being a preservationist because it's only original once. But if the item has a lot of missing or broken parts, I'll likely be more open to restoration but depending on the situation, I may opt to improve upon the original by incorporating newer or better parts because I'm not opposed to creating a frankenvac.

Case in point: A few years ago, I bought my G5 and while I paid what felt at the time like a good price for it, I ended up spending more than twice as much on replacement parts as I paid for the machine in the first place. It came to me with a handle back panel from a G4 so it was already not original and because I was shopping price, most of the parts I bought were fully compatible but were for other models. It needed a brush roll, so I got one for a Sentria because it was cheaper and arguably superior to the original. The outer bag was shot, so I managed to come up with an entire outer bag assembly for an Ultimate G, including emptor and fill tube, for less than the cost of a new outer bag and gained a few minor design improvements in the process. The light gray G3 cord was a matter of taking one for a third the normal retail price. It's functional and the light gray color ties in with the similarly colored emptor on the other side. What I ended up with doesn't look bad at all, kind of reminiscent of a Classic III color scheme, and functions at least as well as it did when new. It's also not a particularly rare machine, so no harm done. I use it and enjoy it the way it is.


Post# 367214 , Reply# 6   2/20/2017 at 11:39 (2,592 days old) by crazykirbydude (Lexington, KY)        
Well...

crazykirbydude's profile picture
They did restore a lot of machines at the HHC. They all look gorgeous.

Post# 367225 , Reply# 7   2/20/2017 at 14:13 (2,592 days old) by anthony (leeds uk)        
heres one i did

anthony's profile picture
This machine was an absolute wreck .Its original gold and brown paint job was practically gone [i have never seen one of these with so much paint worn away]and its bag was so full it was dragging on the floor and full of holes but just as you would expect it ran beautifully so i did a nut and bolt strip[ motor as well] and because it had a grey handle grip and the replacement bag was grey i decided on this colour scheme.When i do this to a machine i strip everything off [and i mean everything.I have seen machines suposedly refurbished where wheels /furniture guard and other bits are left on the machine] .Thats not good enough for me .when finished these machines have to look as good as i can possibly make them look .I enjoy doing this but once finished i completely loose interest and am looking for the next one .I think this machine looks just as good in grey and black as it would in its original garb

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Post# 367226 , Reply# 8   2/20/2017 at 14:27 (2,592 days old) by anthony (leeds uk)        
i have to say

anthony's profile picture
Gsheens senior looks great i like the green better than its original colour I am currently doing up a tired old 375 whose bag while original is literally disintegrating before my eyes and has been poorley repaired before so i am going to have a go at making a new one .I am using the old one as a pattern once i get the thing made i will dye it black and then have a go at replicating the Hoover logo

Post# 367227 , Reply# 9   2/20/2017 at 14:43 (2,592 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture
Anthony The 612 looks awesome. I have a few of them, One is restored already , it was a daily driver right up until the lady traded it in about 4 years ago for something smaller and lighetr for her retirement home. But I have two more mmmmmm I see a grey and black one in my future.

This was the Hoover stripped down. Do it properly the first time I say. The only rubber part I left in place was the handle grip because they are near impossible to remove and about the same going back on


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Post# 367234 , Reply# 10   2/20/2017 at 15:53 (2,592 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
I think it's...

totally subjective and there is no written  'standard' in vacuum collecting with respect to restoration. We'd all love to find that 'dream vac' in flawless condition, but they sometimes avoid us.

 

And it also depends on whether or not it will be used frequently. You can restore about anything to a shelf queen, but will the paint & fabrication hold up to everyday use? Personally, I would rather see something a little worn, but still fully factory functional...than a shelf queen with paint ready to peel off, or weak repairs that would show up with daily use. In most all hobbies, a 'full restoration' implies that it's equal to factory new and/or better.

 

In vintage racing bicycles that sell for thousands, you never touch the paint job unless it's particularly gruesome and rusty.

 

Then again, I wouldn't own anything really ratty looking, just because it was rare or irreplaceable. That doesn't turn my crank.

 

Kevin


Post# 367237 , Reply# 11   2/20/2017 at 16:26 (2,592 days old) by anthony (leeds uk)        
the paint

anthony's profile picture
on my restorations paint will not peel off and is more durable than the original stuff .What you cant see is the coat after coat of clear cellulose on top of the colour .this means that you can bang the machine into most things without doing any damage in order to spoil the paint job you literally have to hit it with a hammer [i have tested this out ]and usually my machines are as good[and safer] than the day they left the factory .Gsheen its great to see that senior stripped and repainted love the green .i have to say i only do this to a machine when its a complete basket case [the sort of thing most people would write off ]

Post# 367239 , Reply# 12   2/20/2017 at 16:55 (2,592 days old) by toddk13 (Milwaukee, WI)        
What do YOU want it for

Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. Really. An original beat up machine may look like a diamond to you, but a piece of coal to others. As a neophyte vacuum / floor machine collector, I am personally interested in "does it work", and "is is safe"? A Hoover 105 that I picked up is beat. It needs a serious cleanup, new cord, new bag, and strip off old paint to be presentable in my eyes. I even bought a lamp socket plug end to match the original specs. Then I thought "WHY"? I'll keep the lamp socket for discussion, but put a regular plug on. It has a cracked rubber cord. For $30.00 or so, I can get a made-in-USA cloth cord that is at least reasonably correct. So - I'll make it look like I want it to look, and it'll be safe to run.

Post# 367241 , Reply# 13   2/20/2017 at 17:42 (2,592 days old) by Warren_L (Georgia, USA)        
What wonderful people here!

Thank you for all your replies!
This forum is like no other I've joined, everyone is so helpful and giving.
There's so much competition and narcissism on other forums, every post degenerates to name calling and harsh language.
I'm not used to civilized discussion.

Such wonderful restorations, skills on the level of artists!
Thank you for sharing the pictures.
I'm in the process of putting together some photos to share.
While many of my Nilfisks are contemporary designs, and only required a good scrubbing in the laundry sink, I have two vintage vacuums that are candidates for a real restoration
Hopefully I can "do no harm" and make something fun to share & show.
Thanks again!


Post# 367287 , Reply# 14   2/21/2017 at 11:53 (2,591 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        

Plastic it tough to paint....to get it to adhere under daily use conditions....in spite of the products out there that claim to do so. Aluminum the same. Auto paint shops are a good source for the correct paints and clear coat. A lot of the manufacturers baked the paint on in controlled ovens....so just a rattle can could lead to early failure.

 

I've certainly seen a LOT more botched paint jobs than good ones.

 

 

Kevin


Post# 367310 , Reply# 15   2/21/2017 at 16:33 (2,591 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture
I must admit I feel sorry for future collectors who like many of us long for the machines of their childhood. I am sure many will abound still but as far as restoration. Most of today's machines are painted plastic for the metallic effect.
Its about impossible to match that correctly.




Post# 367317 , Reply# 16   2/21/2017 at 19:34 (2,591 days old) by kenkart ()        
I Agree

Being born in 65 , most of the machines I remember were 30, 60 E ,F and G Electroluxes and a very few Kirbys and TONS of GE swivel tops, all good metal machines, now all you see is PLASTIC stuff, I'm sorry but Hoover Elites, Eureka Bravos and Dirt Devils will always be cheap Wall Mart vacuums to me.

Post# 367324 , Reply# 17   2/21/2017 at 21:10 (2,591 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
Somebody......

on the Net who is selling restored Elux metal vacs is automatically repainting them. Not a big deal on the metal bodies unless he's not matching the original paint perfectly. But those OE cords that were turquoise powering the PN......I had a heck of time finding one particular size;the one that goes from the power head up the wand.....a short one, then a longer one(easier to find). Eventually, I had to buy a used one off eBay.

 

Kevin

 

 


Post# 367663 , Reply# 18   2/28/2017 at 11:40 (2,584 days old) by anthony (leeds uk)        
the finished 375 bag

anthony's profile picture
well guys i finished the bag and thought you might like to see it .looks good dont it well let me tell you its not perfect as you will see in the next few photos

Post# 367664 , Reply# 19   2/28/2017 at 11:47 (2,584 days old) by anthony (leeds uk)        
some more photos

anthony's profile picture
making the bag was not a problem but how to do the graphics Hmmm so i simply cut out the bit of cloth with them on and stitched it onto the new bag yes i know i cheated but i just couldn't think of any other way .I used a bit of shoe lace for the loop

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Post# 367665 , Reply# 20   2/28/2017 at 12:14 (2,584 days old) by Real1shep (Walla Walla, WA)        
Awesome.....

Anthony! I praise anyone willing to make a bag like that. Graphics would probably have to be silk screened. People do that still, but it can be cost prohibitive as a service.

 

Kevin


Post# 367670 , Reply# 21   2/28/2017 at 16:11 (2,584 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture
I am considering the same thing for my hoover. Its not cheeting.

Post# 367673 , Reply# 22   2/28/2017 at 17:20 (2,584 days old) by felix1stv (Boston Mass)        
G.E.Kenmore,older

agree with Kencart thats what i grew up wit as well and im trying to get all the one's i grew up with been very lucky so far have most .......off ebay no less top price was 40.00 dollors for a Royal blue canester like the eureka 500-800's
ron



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