Thread Number: 33508  /  Tag: Brand New Vacuum Cleaners
Miele C3 Total Solution Allergy or Sebo Airbelt E3 Premium
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Post# 364993   1/11/2017 at 06:26 (556 days old) by Tygar2 (Essex)        

Hello everyone.

I have just discovered your great forum and I am hoping for your expertise in coming to a decision.

So the wife decided she wants a new vacuum because our current and still working cheapo one is "not very good". She had her eye on the Dyson V8 handheld but now way was I going to agree to spending 450 on a vacuum with 20 minutes battery power. She then said she would be happy with the Dyson Cinetic Ball Animal Cylinder currently on sale at 299 with a free tool. We went and checked it out and it's an ok machine but lots of fiddly plastics.

She likes the Dyson for the aesthetics but I want value for money. 300 is quite a bit so I want the best I can get. I have done my research and narrowed down to 2. I hope to get your input through experience as to which is the best. Our house is 80% carpet with 20% laminate and one large thick rug. No pets. We prefer cylinders.

Option 1
Miele Complete C3 Total solution Allergy - 225. Miele have a 30 cashback offer so final price will be 195.
This machine is 1200w
2 year warranty but can be extended to 10 years for 50 so total of 245 if warranty is extended.


Option 2
Sebo E3 Premium with ET - 1 powerhead - 280
This machine is 700w
5 year warranty.

Which is better? Is 700w in the Sebo sufficient? The only sebo I managed to demo was an E1 with 1200w and no motorised powerhead so I wonder how the 700w will be. I have had a play with the Miele and it is better than the dyson for sure.

Which is the better option and why....


Thanks for you comments in advance.





Post# 364996 , Reply# 1   1/11/2017 at 08:36 (556 days old) by Marks_here (Crossville TN & Altoona PA WOO HOO )        
My 2 Both are good

You can't go wrong with either machine but check if the Meile comes with an electric power nozzle w/height adjustment (it will get through the thick carpet) instead of the turbo nozzle & also the Sebo w/height adjustment on the power nozzle is great with thick pile carpets. It comes down to you which one you'd like & which one will perform best on that thick carpet. Also look at the bag capacity too. I've got the Miele Cat/Dog which gets up all the cat fuzz in one pass with the SEB 228 power nozzle which I think works better then the other ones.

*Disclaimer* these are my personal opinions & will differ greatly from others on here.


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Post# 364999 , Reply# 2   1/11/2017 at 09:05 (556 days old) by Tygar2 (Essex)        

Thanks Marks.

Unfortunately here in the UK only the 400+ 800w C3 Electroplus gets the electric brush head.

The C3 Total solution is 1200w with air powered turbo brush.

The Sebo E3 is 700w with 175w electric brush.


Post# 365003 , Reply# 3   1/11/2017 at 09:37 (556 days old) by Tygar2 (Essex)        

Thanks Marks.

Unfortunately here in the UK only the 400+ 800w C3 Electroplus gets the electric brush head.

The C3 Total solution is 1200w with air powered turbo brush.

The Sebo E3 is 700w with 175w electric brush.


Post# 365004 , Reply# 4   1/11/2017 at 09:38 (556 days old) by panasonicvac (Northern Utah)        

panasonicvac's profile picture
I think they are both really good as well. Although my personal opinion, I like the Sebo canisters better because of their durability and cleaning performance. But again it depends on which one you would like better.

Post# 365007 , Reply# 5   1/11/2017 at 11:07 (556 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        

sptyks's profile picture
I vote for SEBO. The ET1 electric power head.comes standard.
You get more for your money with Sebo and the performance can't be beat.


Post# 365008 , Reply# 6   1/11/2017 at 11:48 (556 days old) by Spiraclean (UK)        

spiraclean's profile picture
Definitely the Sebo. An electric powerhead will always clean better than a turbo brush, plus you also get a 5 year guarantee as standard and a slightly longer hose. Bags, filters and spares are reasonably priced for Sebo, whereas Miele consumables tend to be on the dear side to say the least.

I have the D4 Premium Eco, which is the larger cousin to the E3, and the 700 watt motor is plenty powerful. Does a great job, and two years in, I'm still very happy with it.


Post# 365009 , Reply# 7   1/11/2017 at 12:34 (556 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada)        

eurekaprince's profile picture
I much prefer the way the attachments are stored under the hood of the Miele C3. But with all that carpeting, you do indeed need an electric power nozzle. It might be well worth the investment to go for the deluxe Miele with the electric nozzle. It also provides an easier way to shut off the brush roll right on the hose handle, rather than pressing the little button on the Sebo powerhead.

Post# 365011 , Reply# 8   1/11/2017 at 14:17 (556 days old) by Tygar2 (Essex)        

Thanks guys

It's looking like Sebo but as Eurekaprince said, the Miele looks better and stores it's own accessories. The total clean also comes with 4 brush attachments - Floorhead,hard floorbrush,Parquet twister floorbrush and Turbobrush floorhead.

Spiraclean, I have a question for you as my biggest worry with the sebo is the 700w power. How does your Sebo perform when using suction only? The powerbrush will not work in all areas eg. Vacuuming the car, so I need good suction only performance.

Thanks all



Post# 365013 , Reply# 9   1/11/2017 at 15:25 (556 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada)        

eurekaprince's profile picture
If you need to adjust your carpet nozzle for various heights, the Sebo requires you to bend down and adjust the height by hand. With the Miele electric nozzle, you do this with your foot.

If you go for the Miele with electric nozzle, you should ask your seller if he would throw in this handy mini turbo nozzle for free. It's very well designed for car cleaning as it can get into very tight spaces:



CLICK HERE TO GO TO eurekaprince's LINK


Post# 365015 , Reply# 10   1/11/2017 at 16:40 (556 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        

turbo500's profile picture
Another vote for the Sebo. Whilst the Miele's do look more stylish, Sebo's are incredibly robust and the powernozzle will give greater performance on carpets. The Sebo does also store the smaller dusting tools onboard, just the different floorheads that don't (which is the same as the Miele).

Tygar, don't worry about the recent wattage caps. 700w is more than enough to clean well. Wattage is not a direct indicator of suction power, it only tells you how much electricity the machine uses. More power doesn't always mean more suction, it's more about the internals of the machine. Hence a poorly designed 1600w vacuum won't clean as well as a well designed 700w vacuum.

The new Henry's, for example, at 620w - almost half the motor power that they used to be, and yet they've improved performance by 10% due to redesigning the tools and motor.


Post# 365020 , Reply# 11   1/11/2017 at 18:35 (556 days old) by eurekaprince (Montreal, Canada)        

eurekaprince's profile picture
Hi Chris,

Where does the E3 store its small attachments? I only see a slot for the crevice tool. Where are the other tools? I know where they are on the D4, but not the E3....just going by photos on the internet...

EP Brian


Post# 365047 , Reply# 12   1/11/2017 at 22:29 (556 days old) by Sensotronic (Englandshire)        

The E Series also stores the upholstery nozzle at the back of the machine, but Sebo do not supply a dusting brush as standard though this is available with a clip to store it on the wand.

I have the base model with a 700 watt motor and the suction is very good and more than adequate for hard floor and above floor cleaning. The standard carpet/floor head is OK for general carpet cleaning, but poor for pet hair removal, but the power head that comes with the E3 Premium solves that problem.

In a choice between a Miele with an air powered turbo head and a Sebo with a power nozzle, I would choose the Sebo, but they e decision is harder if you were chosing between the Miele with an electric nozzle and the Sebo. On paper the power head Miele gets better results with a claimed AAAA rating, but Miele cleaners aren't as well built as they used to be and previous models with a power head have had reliability problems.

So it's another vote for the Sebo from me, but I don't think you'd be unhappy with the Miele either.


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Post# 365053 , Reply# 13   1/12/2017 at 00:44 (555 days old) by Spiraclean (UK)        

spiraclean's profile picture
Chris and Roger summed it up perfectly. I'd agree that the 700 watt motor has enough power to get the job done, and I've never felt that it needed more oomph.

With regard to the four (!) floor heads supplied with the Miele, it's a nice idea, but you'll likely find most of them will never leave the cupboard. Toting them all around with you, and swapping from one to another each time you go from one surface to another, will soon get tiresome. A rotating brush for carpets, and ONE suction-only head for laminate, will do everything you need while keeping things as simple and practical as possible.


Post# 365076 , Reply# 14   1/13/2017 at 10:05 (554 days old) by n0oxy (Saint Louis Missouri, United States)        
I would also vote for the Sebo

First, I would definitely avoid the Dysons, this is personal opinion but I am not a fan of bagless vacuums, they are a mess to empty and maintain, and Dyson vacuums are overpriced and not very good quality.
Based on your two choices, I would go with the Sebo, if you are cleaning carpet, you should use an Electric power nozzle, I would not even bother with turbo nozzles. They are very prone to cloging, are much louder, and will decrease the suction power of the vacuum in order to spin the turbine. The 700 watt motor should work fine, no issue there. If you can get a Miele with an electric power head at a good price, that would be worth considering, but again, based on the options you mentioned, I would go with the Sebo.


Post# 365097 , Reply# 15   1/14/2017 at 01:37 (553 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

SEBO!!! All the way.Tried an E series Sebo at the dealer here in Greenville-excellent vacuum.The real electric powernozzle is better than the turbine ones by far.

Post# 365206 , Reply# 16   1/16/2017 at 16:20 (551 days old) by floor-a-matic (somewhere)        

tristar cxl has better fitlration & outcleans both the sebo & miele

Post# 365220 , Reply# 17   1/17/2017 at 06:32 (550 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        

turbo500's profile picture
Tristar cleaners are not available in the UK.

Post# 365312 , Reply# 18   1/19/2017 at 03:55 (548 days old) by tygar2 (Essex)        
Couldn't decide so ordered both

Thanks for your input everyone.

After much research on this forum and demos in the shops I was still unsure on which way to go. Concern with the Sebo is suction power and being bottom heavy. With the Miele, it's the shorter warranty and lack of electric brush. I never got a chance to fully demo the E3 premium as I could only find the E1 instore (see pics).

In this case I found the Miele was the better suction only vacuum. The E1 plastics and especially the extention tube felt better quality. I tried a felix with a ET 1 powerhead but wasnt exactly wowed (probably did it wrong!). On low setting the sebo is quieter than the Miele but on full power the Miele is quieter.

Of course this was not an ideal comparison as the powerhead was missing and the E1 is a 1200w model whereas the E3 is 700w.

With that I have decided to order both the Miele C3 and sebo E3...I will return one after trying them out. Picking up C3 today.


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Post# 365481 , Reply# 19   1/22/2017 at 06:06 (545 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        

turbo500's profile picture
How are you finding them both?

Post# 365526 , Reply# 20   1/23/2017 at 06:04 (544 days old) by tygar2 (Essex)        

I am yet to compare. The sebo arrived less than an hour ago so will be doing a comparison shortly. The Euro stickers on the seem to rate the Miele over the Sebo. Strangely looking forward to it...I know, it's just a vacuum!

Miele cost 199 (229 minus 30 cashback promo currently on).
Sebo cost 279 (inc 8 free bags).

So the Sebo will have to be better to justify the extra cost as the difference could buy me an extra 2 years warranty (15) plus a lot of Miele bags which I think evens the long term operating costs.

Have to note that Sebo called to arrange delivery when suitable for me. I did not purchase direct from them so they did not have to do that. I also just realised they threw in a box of bags for free....nice customer service.


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Post# 365527 , Reply# 21   1/23/2017 at 06:24 (544 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

The Sebo E will be in my future.Have several Miele vacuums-will also do my tests.Both are good vacuums.

Post# 365529 , Reply# 22   1/23/2017 at 07:04 (544 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        

turbo500's profile picture
I wouldn't pay any attention to the ratings stickers, they're total nonsense. For example, they rated a Vax upright with no brushroll off function higher on hard floors than a Henry suction cleaner. We all know that cylinders are far better on hard floors. The testing methods don't accurately represent in-home performance and are all carried out by the manufacturers so there is no consistent testing.

I can absolutely guarantee that the Sebo will out-clean the Miele on carpet purely because of the powernozzle. When cleaning carpets, the suction is secondary. The brushroll does the bulk of the work, sweeping the dirt into the suction path which is then sucked into the bag. Because it's motor driven, the powernozzle won't slow down on carpet like a turbo brush, so will lift the pile better.

With regards to long term maintenance, the Sebo bags are 8 bags for 9.99 vs 4 Miele bags for 12.99, so longer term, the Sebo is cheaper to maintain. The Sebo also has a longer guarantee from the start.


Post# 365542 , Reply# 23   1/23/2017 at 10:05 (544 days old) by tygar2 (Essex)        
Surprised

Update.

Just had a short go with both machines and am a bit surprised with the results.

The sebo is very nice and the I used the powerhead on an already vacuumed patch which it somehow managed to make look cleaner.
The sebo hose is a bit chunky and unwieldy due to the electrics. The extention pole is also the same and I'm not a fan of the exposed wire where it connects to the handle. Also when using the tools without the extention pole the electric connectors seem to get in the way - see pic below. Suction is ok but not amazing - I wish it had more. However sebo easily beats the miele in terms of quality of construction materials.

Now the miele...I have to say I'm a bit disappointed. Tried it with the ecotec brush and it is hard work. It is just sticking to the carpet up thereby gets impossible to move - am I doing something wrong? I have tried even the lowest power setting with no success. The bag full indicator also shows as red when the brush is stuck to carpet Quality of platics is below that of the sebo.


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Post# 365543 , Reply# 24   1/23/2017 at 10:27 (544 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        
it is hard work....am I doing something wrong?

turbo500's profile picture
ALL straight suction cleaners are hard work on carpet. You really do need either an electronic powernozzle or, at the very least, an air-driven turbo brush.

Post# 365549 , Reply# 25   1/23/2017 at 14:10 (544 days old) by tygar2 (Essex)        
Verdict - Sebo wins!

Thanks Turbo500 for the input.

Tried both machines again and we are going to keep the Sebo. The quality and performance are better than Miele and as someone else said, the sebo provides fewer accessories but they are the ones most people need.

Was worried about suction but as I discovered with the Miele, there is such a thing as too much suction as I could barely move the thing!

Also, so many complaints online about poor customer service from Miele so that's that.

Thanks all. Any questions feel free to ask as I still have both machines with me.



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Post# 365550 , Reply# 26   1/23/2017 at 14:26 (544 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        

turbo500's profile picture
Arthur, if you're wanting additional tools, check out the Sebo website. They sell a whole heap of tools and a tote bag to carry them all in.

Post# 365551 , Reply# 27   1/23/2017 at 14:52 (544 days old) by tygar2 (Essex)        

Thanks. Will check them out.

Post# 365557 , Reply# 28   1/23/2017 at 17:21 (544 days old) by Luxkid1980 (Richmond, Virginia)        

Did your choice of vacuums to consider depend on what was available to you locally? I ask because there are many other good vacuums out there but I figured your decision was based on what you could go and physically inspect and test in a vacuum store. I also assume you were looking to buy new and did not consider purchasing a previously used machine. Is that right?

Post# 365567 , Reply# 29   1/23/2017 at 23:45 (543 days old) by kirbylux77 (Orillia, Ontario, Canada)        
Arthur

kirbylux77's profile picture
I think you made the right choice here.

First off, your experience with the Miele carpet/floor nozzle sticking to the carpet is spot on. It seems most manufacturers are trying to greatly improve the carpet cleaning efficiency of their powerheads & carpet/floor nozzles to make the most use of the suction/airflow the vacuum produces, since they have to deal with the new EU guidelines for decreased power consumption. However, I think if you had ordered a Miele C3 with the SEB228 powerhead, you would find the Miele to clean equally well, if not slightly better, & you would not have the problem of the head sticking to the floor. In addition, the Miele Airclean bags are superior to most other HEPA Cloth bags on the market, since they are 9 layer bags....they are superior in respect to the fact that you can literally stuff the bag to 3/4 full before you start to see ANY loss of suction, even if you are picking up fine, powdery dust, dirt & sand. Due to this, this more than makes up for the higher price of the bags, since the usable capacity before changing is much greater for Miele.

Having said that, the build quality of Miele's canisters is definitely inferior to that of Sebo's canisters, & might I dare say, extremely overpriced for the build quality you get. For this reason, I would choose Sebo over Miele. One major area Sebo wins points, in particular, is the quality of the powerhead neck, overall design & the wiring used. I owned a 2004 Miele S558 Red Velvet with the SEB236 powerhead, & the 2 major problems I had was with the powerhead neck wiring failing prematurely, & the cordreel. I had it repaired once, & after only 7 or 8 uses, it broke down again! At that point, I was so fed up I jury-rigged the powerhead neck wiring myself & made it so the electric wand was permanently attached to the powerhead, & bought a spare wand from the local vac shop to use with the floor brush. The ONLY WAY now I would recommend anyone to buy a Miele canister, regardless of which powerhead it comes with, is to buy a spare wand & leave the powerhead permanently attached. If you don't touch it, it can't break. It is my opinion that Miele's powerhead neck wiring is too thin & brittle, & not capable of standing up to daily use & repeated inserting & removing the electric wand to use both the powerhead & floor brush. This also applies to generic Wessell Werk powerheads other manufacturers use, since Miele's powerheads are re-badged Wessell Werk products. In addition, the onboard tools for the Miele are unacceptable for a TOL canister in it's price range....the crevice tool is ridiculously short, & the dusting brush is too small. The Parquet Twister floor brush is too big....while it picks up fine dust & sand perfectly fine, any large particles, such as a dried up pea or small pebble, you have to move the tool in a million different directions to pick up large particles. The optional handheld turbo brush, while it works great, gets pet hair wrapped around the brushroll, & unlike other handheld turbo brushes, it cannot be opened up completely to clean out & cut away the hair.

Best of luck with your new Sebo.

Rob


Post# 365574 , Reply# 30   1/24/2017 at 08:00 (543 days old) by tygar2 (Essex)        
Luxkid1980

Hello

The search was limited by the following factors:
Had to be a canister type as more versatile than an upright.

Max price was set at 300. This is because the wife had been carrying on about wanting a Dyson V6 handheld as it was on sale..and I allegedly agreed.
I actually thought that was crazy money for a vacuum and I did not like the whole rechargeable thing. She then switched wanting a Dyson Cinetic Ball - I noticed a trend. Through talking to her I realised her Dyson thing was more about "it looks nice on the wall" and a fashion statement than about its cleaning ability and this set me on my search - if I'm going to spend that much on a vacuum, it better be a damn good vacumm!

You are right about it being available locally as I wanted something I could actually touch and check out. There are so many conflicting and corrupt (paid) reviews out there that it's best to use as a guide and try things yourself. I trust forums such as this one more - had never heard of Sebo till I read about it on here. Of course that limited me to what is available in the UK.

Second hand?? - That was never gonna fly the wife! I'm considered a cheapskate as it is and met a lot of resistance when I suggested getting the Sebo or Miele brand new over the Dyson. I think the wife enjoys opening boxes way too much!

Did you have any suggestions in mind?


Post# 365581 , Reply# 31   1/24/2017 at 12:13 (543 days old) by luxkid1980 (Richmond, Virginia)        
tygar2

You're right.. the canisters are indeed more versatile. I love my Electrolux 1401 for being able to use the crevice and dust upholstery tools on furniture; things I cannot do with my Oreck uprights.

Well, like you, I am all about looking for a "deal" and I don't mind second-hand vacuums, provided I can physically inspect and test it out too. Do many of the vac stores in the UK also sell used machines like many of our stores in the US do? Of course, its all about what is actually available to you. I'm unsure if the older Electrolux machines like the 1205, 1401, 1505 or the newer style Luxes were/are sold overseas. I'm partial to those mostly for sentimental reasons as my mom had the Silverado Deluxe when I was growing up, but I think they are dandy vacuums and clean very well.

Your wife is another story though! Have to keep the spouse happy! :)
But, I too love to get things in the mail. It's exciting when you see a box sitting on your doorstep :)

I've heard good things about the Miele and Sebo, though I have never personally used one.


Post# 382997 , Reply# 32   12/22/2017 at 05:20 (211 days old) by tygar2 (Essex)        
Update and Moving House

Hello All

It's been nearly a year since I purchased the Sebo E3 Premium and I have been very happy with it. It still runs like new and nothing beats a motorised brush head. I am also impressed by the low noise level - quietest vacuum I have owned. I however feel the 700W suction is a bit on the weak side but it does the job.

I with shortly be moving to a house with hardwood floors on the ground floor and carpets upstairs - is the Sebo still the best in this situation? Will now be relying on the 700w suction so not sure - going to test it today.

I will be getting all the carpets replaced so can choose type, plushness etc. Do you guys have any recommendations? The house is a 1920/30s Edwardian with poor insulation and high ceilings so looking to keep it as warm as possible.

Thanks


Post# 383002 , Reply# 33   12/22/2017 at 09:55 (211 days old) by n0oxy (Saint Louis Missouri, United States)        
canisters and hard floors

For hard floors, a canister is the best vacuum you can use, does your Sebo have a good hard floor brush? If so, it should have no problem cleaning the hard floors in the new house. Give it a try and let us know how it works.
Mike





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