Thread Number: 26287
Yet more utter garbage from The Daily Mail regarding EU vacuum laws
[Down to Last]

Vacuumland's exclusive eBay Watch:
scroll >>> for more items --- [As an eBay Partner, eBay may compensate vacuumland.org if you make a purchase using any link to eBay on this page]
Post# 294761   8/21/2014 at 10:18 (3,507 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        

turbo500's profile picture
I see The Daily Fail are at it again. They're now encouraging people to panic-buy high power vacuums, which is completely unnecessary and pointless.

And reading some of the comments on this article is making me cringe. People really don't have a clue what they're talking about - "I love my Dyson, it's super powerful blah blah"..."yeh, love, it's only 1200w".


CLICK HERE TO GO TO Turbo500's LINK


Post# 294763 , Reply# 1   8/21/2014 at 10:47 (3,507 days old) by dys0nb0y (Luton)        

dys0nb0y's profile picture
I agree with you it's stupid don't need 2000 what's the clean the carpet The new Dyson have 700w and I've just got the exact same suction as the old ones today I went to go and see the new DC 41 and that has the exact same suction as the old one it is really powerful I will make a theme on that separately later and the Daily Mail is completely wrong And Manufacturers are making better products that don't need 2000w

Post# 294771 , Reply# 2   8/21/2014 at 11:41 (3,506 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture

Well, I wrote a blog post about buying new vacuums quite a few months ago with the new EU law in mind. 

 

Not so much for the purpose of panic buying but rather for the fact to inform buyers that they can snap up good vacuums at reduced cost prices than a lot of the new EU law uprights in particular which have gone on sale WITH far too high asking cost prices. 

 

Witness the "E" version of the Vax Mac Air Reach. It now costs £250 to £300 or even higher for this "new" lower watt model. Compare that to the old Vax Mach Air Reach which always had 1200/1300watts and it really doesn't make sense.

 

A lot of buyers need to know that whilst 2017 will require vacuums to be made with less than 900 watts, it is not yet the rule. What the rule means is that vacuums that have a total of 1600 watts or lower will be allowed to go on sale and that the old stock of "high power" vacuums can be purchased for the benefit of the buyer who might not feel justified to spend £300


Post# 294780 , Reply# 3   8/21/2014 at 13:24 (3,506 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

Who among our European members is going to test the new low wattage vacs against the old dinosaurs? Take pieces of clean, new carpet, a lane for each vac to be tested, put equal amounts of dirt on each lane, give each vac 25 or 50 or whatever number of passes in their lane and measure how much dirt each vac picked up. Maybe measure suction at the hose and at the floor brush for each vac as well. That should settle most arguments, especially if you can test new and old banned machines from the same manufacturer side by side. Speculation is just that, speculation. Data answers questions.

Post# 294781 , Reply# 4   8/21/2014 at 13:24 (3,506 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture

One thing you guys must take into account with E vacuums is that the motors are much more advanced. They cost more to make and suppliers are not as many as with normal motors. Consumers aren't going to settle for less suction .Manufacturers have  have to redesign the motors ( normal brush driven motors ) to get similar suction while spinning much slower. The advantage is that the slower spinning motors make less noise so that is a benefit. The problem is that the costs of these motors are high and as such that gets passed on to the consumer. Go and buy a motor for a green vacuum and it will be almost double the cost of the normal one. I have been really shocked at how much green motors cost straight from the supplier. Were as a Normal 2000watt hs ss motor would cost about $ 5.00 each a green motor of 900watt but with the a similar air speed as the 2000watt will cost between $9 -$13 each. Remember these prices are per unit but with a minimum order of 5000. 

Green does cost more but it will come down as it becomes more popular 


Post# 294784 , Reply# 5   8/21/2014 at 14:01 (3,506 days old) by oliveoiltinfoil (England, UK)        

oliveoiltinfoil's profile picture
I do agree with a few of the comments regarding more European bureaucracy which is ridiculous and I don't buy this "oh saving the environment BS" when you have countries like India and China building coal fuelled power station every week, cutting the wattage on a vacuum motor isn't going to save the day, although it does help, there are many other appliances in homes which consume more energy and are used more frequently.

What I do think is good is that it will force manufacturers to actually put time and effort in R&D, something like the good old days. The Eco vacs I have used and got, from vax especially have very much impressed me.

Brushless, magnetic motors I think is a technology that should be developed properly for vacuum cleaners, and that is something I will give credit to Dyson for, even though he didn't invent the brushless motor, and calling it "digital" is over exaggerating it to be honest.


Post# 294787 , Reply# 6   8/21/2014 at 14:41 (3,506 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

Many years ago California enacted efficiency regulations for home appliances such as light bulbs, air conditioners, refrigerators, washers and driers, etc.. The exact same arguments were made then as are being made over this EU regulation. California's strategy was that the cost of building more new power plants to supply electricity to the increasing number of energy hungry appliances made the old way was far greater than the cost to force manufacturers to design and construct more efficient appliances. There was an additional layer of trying to minimize the amount of investment in upgrading local power delivery grids that were beginning to require higher capacity transformers, switches, everything, as homes loaded up on TVs in every room, big screen TVs, mulitple home computers, appliances of every description that had microprocessors and LED displays on them. Energy demand per home more than quadrupled since many neighborhoods were built and this was putting a severe strain on power companies to keep their grids ahead of demand. The obvious, in hindsight, effective strategy was to use regulation to damp down the growth in energy demand. The alternative was an expensive investment in new power plants and associated power lines and switch yards.

It isn't all about "out of control regulation". There is considerable logic behind these decisions but most consumers have absolutely no clue about the economics of allowing them to turn the lights on with the flip of a switch.


Post# 294789 , Reply# 7   8/21/2014 at 14:48 (3,506 days old) by matt8808 (Teesside - North East - UK)        

That article is true Chris... My house will never be as clean as it once was if I can no longer buy a 2400 watt vax bagless machine. You know the ones I mean... With the cheapo direct filter design.

Once these are outlawed we're all destined to end up like pigs living in our own filth.

I mean a well designed machine with a 900 watt motor, a sebo x1 for example, could NEVER clean as well as a 2000 watt hoover dust manager.

I think I might just end my life now. These imminent changes are too much for me to handle and I just can't bear the thought of my carpets never being as clean lmao


Post# 294790 , Reply# 8   8/21/2014 at 15:00 (3,506 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture

Gareth I don't really believe that smaller motors are going to be quieter from the stats already supplied in the UK for some of the "new" low Eco vacuums. 

 

Take Hoover's Purepower - statistically according to their own website, the 2000 watt Purepower has 82 decibels of noise - the new 700 watt Purepower upright has 89decibels - so much for being quieter!

 

Also if you look at this sound level chart, you can see just how dangerously close Hoover are to the "dangerously noise causing ear damage," levels. 

 

 


  View Full Size
Post# 294795 , Reply# 9   8/21/2014 at 15:55 (3,506 days old) by adamthemieleman (North Yorkshire )        

The comments are hilarious, all idiots that have no idea of what they are talking about! 'Er more power means it takes less time'.
Hmm, in the past have we ever moaned about the vacuums not being powerful enough?

I doubt Which? actually said this because they state on their website:

''Is vacuum cleaner wattage important?
Manufacturers often use the wattage or power of a vacuum cleaner as a selling point. But a good performance is about design and suction, not how high the wattage is. A high wattage doesn't mean you will get a better vacuum cleaner, but it does mean that you will use more energy. From September 2014 the wattage on vacuum cleaners will be restricted to a maximum of 1600 watts, so the design of the vacuum and floorhead will be more important than ever in delivering the best suction.''


I put out the new dc28, with the energy label, on the back it mentions all the nonsense james was spouting.
Ok James, sure. Review it all you like, all he's bothered about is his sales!


Post# 294798 , Reply# 10   8/21/2014 at 16:13 (3,506 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture

Sebo Fan 

 

Technically they should be as the motor is spinning at a far lesser speed, Some of the ones i have tested and much much quieter than their 2000watt counterparts. That said I have not tested a British hoover in a long time. 

 

In South Africa we have no laws in place yet for this, and South Africans are hugely power hungry, If its not 2000watt they don't want it. I do wonder how it will effect AEG and Electrolux here though as the TOR models are all direct EU imports were ass the entry level models come from Chinese factory's. You are going to have a case here were the entry level models will be more powerful than the TOR models .

 

 

On the topic of Noise I am doing some testing on a shopvac style vacuum for a friend of mine, I was given 15 different competitor machines as well as 7 different sample machines to decide which would fair better against the competition. One of the samples the least powerful in suction as well as wattage was the nosiest , 94 db 


Post# 294799 , Reply# 11   8/21/2014 at 16:17 (3,506 days old) by blakaeg (NW London, UK)        

My Dyson DC24 has a 650 watt motor. It's pretty good on carpets and hard floors but the hose suction is just ok for stairs and the mattress. Never found the DC24 great to use for car cleaning due to the small hose and low suction but I either use my parents more powerful machine when I visit or the handheld I have.

I find the SEBO Felix great for car cleaning with its variable power as the whole body just lays across the seat and heats up the car too on a cold day ;)


Post# 294801 , Reply# 12   8/21/2014 at 16:31 (3,506 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

The US uses 120 VAC, 60 Hz power and household circuites are limited to 15 amps for safety reasons. The most powerful vacs in the US outside of home central vacs advertise drawing 12 amps including the floor brush (figure 9.5-10 amps for the vac itself), which is 1440 watts. We are not hurting for cleaning power over here.

As a practical maximum an appliance could draw maybe 14 amps before risking tripping a weak 15 amp breaker, so figure 1680 max watts. In reality vacuums draw 1400 watts or less under most usage. 2000 or more watts seems like wretched overkill, but since I have no experience with such powerful and power hungry vacs I cannot draw a direct comparison. All I can say is that in the US we have made do with 1400 and something watts total draw for as long as any of us have been alive.


Post# 294802 , Reply# 13   8/21/2014 at 16:41 (3,506 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture

I noticed a noticeable difference between my modern USA vacuums and thier 220v counterparts. I have a few machines that I have bought off people who have brought them back to SA after living in the states. 

Most noticeable is the Miele vacuums. The models that come from the USA are good but the 2000watt 220volt ones have much much more suction. the 220v versions stick to the floor like glue were as the 110v versions are easier to move.

 

My AEG Ultra one is also a mean sucker but its 110v Electrolux counterpart was a little unimpressive on the power front although it had the advantage of a cool PN . but using the attachments and the 220v 2100watt wins hands down


Post# 294818 , Reply# 14   8/21/2014 at 18:08 (3,506 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture

As I have said in other threads with a view to the EU laws, the only aspect that worries me is that brands won't be redesigning motors that well, but rather just capping them for a lower wattage to justify the law. 

 

I don't think brands will go far enough to produce efficient vacuums that have low noise, and infact, all the things I've come to like with both Miele and SEBO vacuums. It seems buying German for an easier life may be the way forward, even if the prices are still high. 

 

I have no idea what Electrolux are planning. They have already phased out their name in the UK on their own vacuums with only Zanussi taking the budget end and AEG the premium end. Both brands currently don't have low 700 watt main size vacuums - they may well be the last brands to conform.


Post# 294855 , Reply# 15   8/21/2014 at 23:02 (3,506 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

gsheen, how much power is lost through the step down transformer you have to use and is your power 50 Hz or the 60 Hz of the US?

Post# 294871 , Reply# 16   8/22/2014 at 00:52 (3,506 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)        

gsheen's profile picture

Sebo Fan, AEG already has the green range , with 1300watt motors instead of the 2100 watt used in most of their machines. 

 

Deserttortoise 

 

On the smaller step down a small amount is lost but in my home I have the mother of all step down transformers due to the fact that most of our large appliances are from the USA, It has 380v 3phase power feeding it and is the size of a small ride on lawnmower, 

 

 


Post# 294880 , Reply# 17   8/22/2014 at 04:59 (3,506 days old) by turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        

turbo500's profile picture
I hardly think capping vacuum wattage is comparable to nazi Germany. Isn't there a limit in vacuum wattage in the US already?

One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is how unreliable these cheap, high power vacuums are. The motors run too hot and the filters clog, causing the machine to overheat and wear out altogether in a few years. Then what happens? It goes to the tip and people but a new one, because it's so cheap to do that now. But there's the cost to the local council of getting rid of the old one, and they're building up. I was at my local household waste centre in the summer getting rid of garden waste. I had a sneaky peak in the electrical shed and it was FULL of cheap, high power, bagless vacuums that can't have been more than a few years old.


Post# 294881 , Reply# 18   8/22/2014 at 06:02 (3,506 days old) by parwaz786 ( )        

I am still tempted to go to Argos and get a DC33 Multi floor

Post# 294884 , Reply# 19   8/22/2014 at 06:29 (3,506 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture

Gareth, 1300 watts in the AEG line up is of the older range - a bit like the 1300 watt motors in the Vax Mach Air range, before being replaced later this year with the newer lower watt motors.

 

Still, AEG are also selling vacuums in the UK which have 2000 watts or more, though they do have a green 700 watt model in Germany that I put a thread about on here so many months ago - the UOGREEN 700 watt cylinder vac - but it hasn't arrived here yet - the lowest motor they have is 1250 watts which is a better sign on the Ultra bagged cylinder vac series. 

 

Current range shown from UK website

 


  View Full Size
Post# 294898 , Reply# 20   8/22/2014 at 09:11 (3,506 days old) by adamthemieleman (North Yorkshire )        

Actually AEG do have a low wattage, its called the UltraFlex. looks a bit like the ultracaptic, but a bit more refined. It is 650w

CLICK HERE TO GO TO adamthemieleman's LINK


Post# 294901 , Reply# 21   8/22/2014 at 09:26 (3,506 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

The US has 120 volt 60 Hz single phase (usually, three phase in a home is unusual) domestic power. Home circuits are limited to 15 amps for fire safety. Only outlets for certain appliances like electric driers (which run on 240 volts), the range if it's electric, the air conditioner or heat pump and a few other limited examples will have higher amp breakers. Rgular wall plugs are limited to 15 amps. It is strictly a fire safety measure and has nothing to do with energy conservation. There is separate legislation requiring energy efficient appliances.

Post# 294906 , Reply# 22   8/22/2014 at 09:49 (3,506 days old) by marks_here (_._)        

marks_here's profile picture
Hmmm then why in my box is there are 20, 25 & 30amp oh & several 60amp? I know what they're all for, you must have old wiring circuit breakers then. This house was built in the 80's. I checked the new home that's being newly built & freshly wired in that circuit box the same thing minus the 30amp, no hot tub.

Post# 294911 , Reply# 23   8/22/2014 at 10:04 (3,506 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

What are those breakers for? In my home I have four 20 amp breakers for the kitchen, specifically the disposer, stove, fridge and dishwasher, and all the rest of the breakers are 15 amp. 20 amp is the highest I have.

Post# 294912 , Reply# 24   8/22/2014 at 10:05 (3,506 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

Btw, my house was built in 2007.

Post# 294922 , Reply# 25   8/22/2014 at 11:37 (3,505 days old) by marks_here (_._)        

marks_here's profile picture
20amps are for the outlets/lights, 60amps for the hvac, heat & halogen hob, 30amps for the water heater, dryer & hot tub & for the gfi outlets in the kitchen. That's probably why the didn't run a separate line for the central vacuum, hasn't blown anything plus I checked the breaker & it wasn't hot. One other thing when the hvac kicks on none of the light dim in the house

Post# 294923 , Reply# 26   8/22/2014 at 11:38 (3,505 days old) by marks_here (_._)        

marks_here's profile picture
After you said that it does sound strange I wonder why in this area they boost the breaker amperage??

Post# 294926 , Reply# 27   8/22/2014 at 11:47 (3,505 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

30 amp outlets in the kitchen. Wow, our building codes don't permit more than 15 amps. Interesting the difference in building codes between states. Do you have steel conduit and junction boxes or Romex and plastic junction boxes?

Boy I wish I had 30 amp outlets in the house. I would put one of those new Advantek Ultra motors that Lamb is selling for home central vacuums in one of my old canisters and have a real animal. They have a 5.7 inch motor boasting 650 air watts but it pulls almost 14 amps. I couldn't use a floor brush with that motor here or I'll pop a 15 amp breaker. Now if I had 30 amp outlets it would be a different story. Central vac suction and airflow in a canister. Oh would that be something.



Post# 294935 , Reply# 28   8/22/2014 at 12:29 (3,505 days old) by marks_here (_._)        

marks_here's profile picture
LOL the vacuum would turn inside out from the pull. Just romex & plastic & I would think in the crawl space they would be protected but it's not, just stapled to the joists. For running something like that you would almost have to get a fuel powered generator & just think no more blown anything your testing. Oh & how they wired it here (thank God) the ceiling lights are different from the outlets. I hated that when something blew in the house in Fla the entire room when dark, at least here you can switch a floor lamp on & was also great when I had to change the switch in the bath, just brought in a desk lamp & the power from the wall was still on. BUT here since were high up on the Plateau our power goes out frequently in the winter is the worst

Post# 294947 , Reply# 29   8/22/2014 at 13:05 (3,505 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

Romex stapled to rafters. Isn't that lovely? My dad would have been irate if he saw that! I have a metric crapload of circuits too. Each side of the kitchen is on a differnt breaker and then there are the four 20 amp breakers for the appliances. Same thing throughout the house. It's not a bad thing.

Funny thing but those last generation square Kenmore canister vacs have a support for the lid built into them so they won't suck the lid in. It is either a large filter housing over the fan and cord reel hump with two thick ribs running across the top for and aft, or a thing that looks like a roll cage screwed into the top of the motor and cord housing that the lid touches when it's closed. I guess they learned from the previous generation who's plastic lid flexed in even from the moderate suction of a 2.7 peak hp motor. On the Avocado Bomber if you pop the palm of your hand off and on the hose end with the motor running you can get the tools jumping in their holder.

I have a cream colored last generation of the lunch box 3.5 that is going to get some kind of big motor, as much suction and air watts as I can get and not blow breakers with the Powermate running. I'm thinking a Lamb 119800 if I can suss out how to mount it, otherwise my trusty 115923 bolts up to the existing holes perfectly (but lacks the juice of the more modern motor). There is also a new version of the 115923 with what are called "Eternity Brushes". Just give me time to clear out a couple of other projects. That giant sucking sound from California will be my Frankenvac. Hide your small animals and spare change.


Post# 294948 , Reply# 30   8/22/2014 at 13:12 (3,505 days old) by marks_here (_._)        

marks_here's profile picture
Hay, make it water worthy so it will get ya'll some water to finish off the crisis there. I hear it's pretty bad & neighbours are turning each other in for the $500 reward that was on ALJAM channel.

Post# 294964 , Reply# 31   8/22/2014 at 14:36 (3,505 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

No, we don't have bounties for reporting water wasters that I'm aware of. Most water districts are trying the soft approach using warning citations as an educational tool. Generally no one is fined on a first offense. Fines are for repeat violators. There is one district I read about that is really in dire straits that even offers a "Water School" along the lines of traffic school to those receiving citations that lets you work off the fine by sitting in a classroom receiving water conservation instruction.

There is a saying that dates to the 1800s that in California whiskey is for drinking and water is for fighting. This is far from the worst drought the California has experienced. Western water law is based on the concept that "first in use is first in right", meaning whomever made a claim to the water first and continues to use it has first rights to that water. Those who came later lose water in a drought. What that means is that some farm districts with water rights dating back more than a century are flood irrigating crops of rice while municipal water districts and many agricultural water districts with more junior water rights have lost their allocations of water completely. The courts have, so far, turned back every attemtp to change this situation. Fully 85% of the developed fresh water used in Souther California is owned by the Imperial Irrigation District. They take water from the Colorado River and irrigate low desert croplands through unlined dirt ditches. Because their water rights are senior to every single other Colorado River user except the native tribes, LA, Vegas and every other water user on that river will have to surrender every drop of their allocation before the IID has to give up even one drop. Fair or not, this is the law and it has survived multiple legal challenges all the way up to the US Supreme Court. I vividly recall an IID board member calling a US Senator an "overweight, pig eyed, gas bag sack of sh!t" in a public meeting with the press in the room because the Senator had the temerity to suggest that running water through the open desert in unlined dirt ditches just might not be the highest and best use of scarce water. Such are the temperaments of people with water rights.


Post# 294965 , Reply# 32   8/22/2014 at 14:37 (3,505 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

No, we don't have bounties for reporting water wasters that I'm aware of. Most water districts are trying the soft approach using warning citations as an educational tool. Generally no one is fined on a first offense. Fines are for repeat violators. There is one district I read about that is really in dire straits that even offers a "Water School" along the lines of traffic school to those receiving citations that lets you work off the fine by sitting in a classroom receiving water conservation instruction.

There is a saying that dates to the 1800s that in California whiskey is for drinking and water is for fighting. This is far from the worst drought the California has experienced. Western water law is based on the concept that "first in use is first in right", meaning whomever made a claim to the water first and continues to use it has first rights to that water. Those who came later lose water in a drought. What that means is that some farm districts with water rights dating back more than a century are flood irrigating crops of rice while municipal water districts and many agricultural water districts with more junior water rights have lost their allocations of water completely. The courts have, so far, turned back every attemtp to change this situation. Fully 85% of the developed fresh water used in Souther California is owned by the Imperial Irrigation District. They take water from the Colorado River and irrigate low desert croplands through unlined dirt ditches. Because their water rights are senior to every single other Colorado River user except the native tribes, LA, Vegas and every other water user on that river will have to surrender every drop of their allocation before the IID has to give up even one drop. Fair or not, this is the law and it has survived multiple legal challenges all the way up to the US Supreme Court. I vividly recall an IID board member calling a US Senator an "overweight, pig eyed, gas bag sack of sh!t" in a public meeting with the press in the room because the Senator had the temerity to suggest that running water through the open desert in unlined dirt ditches just might not be the highest and best use of scarce water. Such are the temperaments of people with water rights.


Post# 294968 , Reply# 33   8/22/2014 at 15:11 (3,505 days old) by marks_here (_._)        

marks_here's profile picture
I can say for myself if you ever need water I'm sure I along with other members would be willing to ship to you plus other members on VL in Ca if it gets desperate.

Post# 294976 , Reply# 34   8/22/2014 at 15:42 (3,505 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

You better hang on to your water. Isn't Georgia arguing to move the state border north a mile or so at a place called Nickajack so they can tap into the Tennessee River, so short of water is Georgia? Georgia tried this gambit in 2008 and was shot down but with most of Georgia currently in a drought they are trying again.

We have water here, but I cannot fathom how our laws allow farmers to grow water intensive crops like rice and alfalfa (the desert is dotted with alfalfa fields and increasingly pistachio orchards while desert aquifers are silently sucked dry) in a state that is experiencing a drought. Urban dwellers are being told to stop watering lawns but there is no limit to watering alfalfa, until the wells run dry.


Post# 294980 , Reply# 35   8/22/2014 at 16:04 (3,505 days old) by marks_here (_._)        

marks_here's profile picture
They tried to get the state line closer into Ga a couple years back but it was shot down. I hear ya DT I/we don't make the laws, don't understand them & probably most were created at night behind closed doors without anyone's knowing & passed before anyone can question or bitch about. It's really sad because it hurts a lot of people that really need the help.

Post# 295087 , Reply# 36   8/23/2014 at 06:23 (3,505 days old) by suctionselector (Leeds, England)        
And

suctionselector's profile picture

Even more bull from the Fail reccomending to buy cheap bagless screamers...

 

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...



CLICK HERE TO GO TO suctionselector's LINK

Post# 295102 , Reply# 37   8/23/2014 at 08:54 (3,505 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

Do those "newspapers" still feature a page three girl?

Post# 295104 , Reply# 38   8/23/2014 at 08:58 (3,505 days old) by DesertTortoise ()        

Sounds like the D-M is worried the new vacs won't keep up with the messes the sports reporters leave in their office spaces.

Post# 295466 , Reply# 39   8/26/2014 at 08:41 (3,502 days old) by spiraclean (UK)        

spiraclean's profile picture
Which? subscribers should be demanding a lot better than this. Here they are basically advocating panic buying, which I always thought went against everything the Consumers' Association originally stood for. Wasn't there once a time when they encouraged their readers to employ a little critical thinking (e.g. questioning claims, researching and comparing) when making a major purchase, so as to help them spend their money wisely? I didn't always agree 100% with their product recommendations or slams, but at least the testing articles themselves provided a solid enough foundation for shoppers to know what attributes to look out for and why.

Of course, to find out what these Best Buy vacs we ought to be buying NOW are, one has to sign up for a subscription. Easy to do online, just a few clicks. Not so easy to cancel mind, you'll need to phone and speak to Which? in order to do that. As always, it's sensationalist bilge intended to keep the subscription £££ rolling in.

A fair few manufacturers aren't fully on board with these new regs, and are only complying under duress. Let's not also forget that an awful lot of manufacturers these days are happy to promote Which? by including their Best Buy status on their websites, and applying stickers to products on the assembly line. Something tells me such promotion would come to an abrupt halt if Which? actually had the balls say most vac manufacturers are only interested in advertising more watts than their competition, and hinting that they ought to put on their big girl panties and actually come up with something that performs as it should while meeting the new regs. Especially if they pointed out that some of their competitors (e.g. Numatic) had already done exactly that, ahead of time and without whinging to the press or TV about it.


Post# 295491 , Reply# 40   8/26/2014 at 11:12 (3,501 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)        

sebo_fan's profile picture

The problem I find, is that Which subscribers are often clueless. They won't demand anything, or if they do, Which turn a blind eye to it. Which know best and they won't stand down despite heavy criticism aimed at their report findings on their "member only forum."

 

I subscribed for a year and lost interest. The moment they tested the SEBO D2 and couldn't find the bag fill indicator was a case in point. Thereafter, they continually cut down "Best Buys" in certain Miele models just because they didn't have the upgraded filters. No change of floor head or motor, but suddenly a big change in testing performance. When, or if you are a Miele owner like I have been and had quite a few models pass through your hands, you'll know the salt from the pepper.

 

A filter upgrade does not improve performance. Which fail to recognise that.

 

There was almost a heavy uproar from Numatic owners too, when Which slated Henry. They failed to take into consideration that Henry is most widely used and failed to recognise key points on the vacuum cleaner. I recall the forum well; constant complaints to Which until they finally relented and tested the Henry again; but I still haven't seen that "new" report since unsubscribing...

 

There's a lot more discrepancies as time goes on when reading reports that they do, not just with vacuum cleaners. That's why I gave up on them. 

 

Its about time there was another UK organisation who could take on Which. Perhaps only then, the company concerned would become a lot fairer and not be so controlling for consumer products and services.


Post# 295826 , Reply# 41   8/28/2014 at 12:42 (3,499 days old) by Adamthemieleman (North Yorkshire )        

The daily fail website doesn't seem to be accepting my comment, must be too close to the bone. This is what I had to say, I'll post it here for your delight


''What really amazes me is how stupid people actually are. I think you all need to relearn physics, the principle of vacuum. I sell the things, and I am glad this is coming into effect. People who know about them like me, know it's the overall design which makes it powerful, not the motor.
Vacuums 20 years ago never had high wattages and no one ever whinged on then.

As for the reporter, I think you need to get down to the job centre, as journalism is not your forte. The daily fail is
laughable at this none news.''


Post# 295827 , Reply# 42   8/28/2014 at 12:44 (3,499 days old) by Adamthemieleman (North Yorkshire )        

In fact some customer today had that article, I said to her the best place for it is in the bin!

Post# 295828 , Reply# 43   8/28/2014 at 12:47 (3,499 days old) by vintagerepairer (England)        

"As for the reporter, I think you need to get down to the job centre, as journalism is not your forte"

Maybe, but he/she is reporting in a way that the DM reader wants it to be reported. To that end, they are good at their job. I doubt the DM cares about anything. They just need to sell papers.



Forum Index:       Other Forums:                      



Comes to the Rescue!

Woops, Time to Check the Bag!!!
Either you need to change your vacuum bag or you forgot to LOG-IN?

Discuss-O-MAT Log-In



New Members
Click Here To Sign Up.



                     


automaticwasher.org home
Discuss-o-Mat Forums
Vintage Brochures, Service and Owners Manuals
Fun Vintage Washer Ephemera
See It Wash!
Video Downloads
Audio Downloads
Picture of the Day
Patent of the Day
Photos of our Collections
The Old Aberdeen Farm
Vintage Service Manuals
Vintage washer/dryer/dishwasher to sell?
Technical/service questions?
Looking for Parts?
Website related questions?
Digital Millennium Copyright Act Policy
Our Privacy Policy