Thread Number: 24238
Tacony Experts |
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Post# 271260   3/11/2014 at 12:20 (3,670 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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As I inch ever more closer to getting a Tacony vacuum (Riccar Immaculate Premier Canister), I just have another question...why two lines of the exact same offerings of vacuums?
Simplicity and Riccar offer identical machines except for names. It's not like it's a regional thing. I'm lucky enough to be smack dab in the middle of a Riccar and Simplicity dealer but for some reason leaning toward Riccar. Any insight to why Tacony chose to offer two seemingly different lines of the same vacuum? Just curious. |
Post# 271282 , Reply# 1   3/11/2014 at 14:26 (3,670 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 271286 , Reply# 2   3/11/2014 at 14:39 (3,670 days old) by ctvacman (CT)   |   | |
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Out of curiosity which dealers do you go to in ct |
Post# 271385 , Reply# 3   3/11/2014 at 21:53 (3,670 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 271386 , Reply# 4   3/11/2014 at 21:55 (3,670 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 271392 , Reply# 5   3/11/2014 at 22:22 (3,670 days old) by bimmer740 (Long Island, New York)   |   | |
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I'm so glad this thread was started as I too am very interested in the TOL Riccar/Simplicity canister, but I prefer the color of the Gusto over the Riccar. However there really hasn't been much discussion about these machines on the forum. I'm curious to know more about these vacuums, especially how well the power nozzle cleans. I like that the TOL models have three rows of brushes on the brush roller and the metal base plate. They include a nice array of full size attachments and it's nice to know I can use other attachments with the machine not just the proprietary ones.
I find it a bit frustrating that the website has limited information and does not seem to be updated often. Simplicity/Riccar sells a mini power nozzle but it does not say if it is included with any machine, does the Gusto include this nozzle or a mini turbo nozzle? At that price point I would hope such an attachment is included. Is Tacony planning on updating these machines in the near future? These machines have been around for about 10 years and haven't changed too much, I'm wondering if a major update will be happening. I'm not looking to purchase anything until later in the year so I can be patient and wait for a while. I had already had my mind set on the Guardian Platinum but I'm starting to think the Simplicity can out clean the Lux. |
Post# 271467 , Reply# 9   3/12/2014 at 08:28 (3,669 days old) by gm1982 ()   |   | |
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BTW, you can just ask the dealer about the mini power turbo, and if they can throw it in with the whole package or get you one. |
Post# 271468 , Reply# 10   3/12/2014 at 08:56 (3,669 days old) by dirtmaster37 (Ypsilanti, Michigan USA)   |   | |
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The reason I have been told there are two lines, was that way back one of the brands had a clause ( I believe Simplicity), that you had to carry the like branded sewing machines, to have the vacuums. I believe then ( and this is where I'm a bit unsure) ; that I believe that the Riccar line was created , so those models could be sold by dealers that JUST wanted to carry vacuums.
When we set up the first store I was with to carry Tacony way back in 1998, we ended up with Riccar vacuums. I still have a non tools 8000 series from then. It was explained to me at that time , by my boss, the above reasoning. And he wanted nothing to do with sewing machines. Being a young newby vacuum person, I just nodded my head and played along. Now, honestly, I believe that it's to allow a dealer to select which line fits them best, and also to offer a rival dealer in the same area the opposite line, which blurrs territory lines but it's how it works. There is really no other valid explanation. Honestly, I get scores of people that ask why they do this. And the answer I use today is just that. "to allow a dealer to select which line fits them best, as they DO have some differences"; "and to allow different "shops" to have the rival line if they wish".. Now, lets allow Tom if he wishes to explain the real reason. Chad... |
Post# 271470 , Reply# 11   3/12/2014 at 09:10 (3,669 days old) by rosiembanks (Dayton, OH)   |   | |
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I expect Tom to actually know, but fwiw, I have a Riccar sewing machine from 1975. A wonderful machine. |
Post# 271476 , Reply# 12   3/12/2014 at 10:25 (3,669 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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The Simplicity and Riccar lines were both started to "go along with" the same brand of sewing machine. Dealers, at first, could choose the brand they wanted, but as more dealers came on board, the decision as to brand was taken over by the company. For instance, if one vac shop carries Riccar, the closest shop to that one would carry Simplicity. But two close vac shops should never be carrying the same brand - it's financial suicide for the shops.
Because they are sold in vac shops, the company's website needs only to get you interested enough to go to the dealer, who will put on a "live" demonstration. Any vacuum collector coming to the Convention in June, can purchase a Riccar, Simplicity, or Maytag vacuum at factory outlet store prices. The savings on a top of the line Canister (for example) would pay for the gas and motel stay for the entire convention. |
Post# 271482 , Reply# 13   3/12/2014 at 11:23 (3,669 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 271485 , Reply# 14   3/12/2014 at 11:44 (3,669 days old) by gm1982 ()   |   | |
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You still need a better website than what is currently up... the marketing, wow factor is still lacking. |
Post# 271488 , Reply# 15   3/12/2014 at 11:55 (3,669 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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To be honest, I never look at the website. I introduce people to the Simplicity, Maytag, and Riccar vacuums "in person". I know the dealers sometimes say they wish it was updated more regularly, but none of the dealers (and I've met most of them when they visit the factory) have any trouble selling the vacuums because of any lack to the website.
Personally, word of mouth is my best advertising. All someone has to do is meet me, and they know I'm an expert. When I suggest a certain model, they buy it, go home, and are happy with it. Maybe I'm jaded because I rarely look at any website for information on new vacuums. The Vacuum Dealer Trade Association published the Floor Care Journal every month. I write a monthly column for it. That's where I get my info on upcoming machines. |
Post# 271499 , Reply# 17   3/12/2014 at 12:23 (3,669 days old) by sleepdoc (St. Louis, MO)   |   | |
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I don't have either of the newest models, but I have both of the older offerings: the Simplicity S38 and Riccar 1800. Both of these have the 3-row power nozzle with a dirt sensor. The only models that offer that power nozzle are the TOL full-size canister and the TOL central vacuum kit in each brand lineup. I think it cleans as well as anything, and I'll never get rid of those machines. I hope when they are updated that they don't change too much about them because they are fantastic just as they are. The new Wonder probably is a great vacuum, but I like the fully-featured machines. If you buy a Moxie or Impeccable, the only difference other than the name and color is the power nozzle, which doesn't have a dirt sensor and has a 2-row brush that also is metal with replaceable brush strips. That power nozzle, btw, is identical, except for the color, to the pn that comes with the TOL mid-size canisters, the Simplicity Verve and Riccar Pristine. IMO, the overlap of different features and sizes of canisters lets a customer have the best of every priority or preference other than a dirt sensor on a mid-size machine. That feature is exclusive to the flagship in each brand. I don't think you can go wrong with any Simplicity or Riccar canister.
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Post# 271578 , Reply# 19   3/12/2014 at 21:53 (3,669 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 271661 , Reply# 21   3/13/2014 at 12:52 (3,668 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 271698 , Reply# 23   3/13/2014 at 16:53 (3,668 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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Post# 271737 , Reply# 26   3/13/2014 at 21:41 (3,668 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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Post# 271750 , Reply# 27   3/13/2014 at 22:47 (3,668 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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That looks awesome. Congratulations!
I would also have to get the electric mini brush (I assume you had to purchase the extension wand for the mini power brush, not shown). How long is the hose and is it more "rubbery" than "springy" (when I say springy, I'm talking about the type of material used for Miele hoses that wont get out of it's own way)? How is the noise level? Any other things you like and even more importantly don't like. |
Post# 271755 , Reply# 28   3/13/2014 at 23:20 (3,668 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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This is truly an amazing vacuum cleaner. I have not yet purchased the adapter. To be honest, I haven't even used the mini power nozzle. My work schedule has been absolutely nuts and wednesday we got snowed in at work. I am definitely going to use it this weekend.
The hose on the Moxie is the total opposite of the Miele. I have a Delphi and it is a great canister but the Moxie trumps it. My bf loves the Miele and that is the one he uses. It is so easy to manipulate the hose on the Moxie. The hose and cord are also longer which I like. Now for the noise level..... WOW is this thing ever quiet. Even on full power I think it is quieter than the Miele. I could definitely use this one when people are sleeping. Even the power nozzle is fairly quiet. I will post the short video I took to my youtube about and then will post the link here for you. One major love for me is the way it grooms the carpeting. We live in an apartment and have the cheaper beige carpet. Some vacuums groom it and some do not do so hot. I love how this grooms. Depending which way you vacuum, you get better results. One thing I thought was odd is the shape of the brush that is in the attachment part. Sorry I did not take a pic of them but I could if you would like. It is long and skinny. The brush slides off so you can use it on upholstery too. At first I was like well this is stupid, but it is actually a very useful tool. I actually use it EVERYTIME I vacuum. I also love having the horse hair brush close at hand. That is used everytime as well. It does have a mini barefloor tool in the attachment part which is nice. I have used that on mats that I do not want to use the power nozzle on. The front brush of it pivots back and forth to help agitate I guess you could say. Another nice feature is that the wand sits upright when not in use. Where as the Miele will fall right over. There are 3 things I do not like but they are so minor that it would not stop me from purchasing this vacuum again. One is sometimes the cord winder is hard to push, another is the wand is hard to adust sometimes and another is releasing the nozzle takes me a few times. I think these are A) Mostly user error and B) the vacuum is not even a year old so it is still very new. Once I get more acquainted with the vacuum, I am sure these will no longer be an issue. I am in the process of getting the video uploaded for you. Once it is, I will let you know. |
Post# 271756 , Reply# 29   3/13/2014 at 23:21 (3,668 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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Post# 271757 , Reply# 30   3/13/2014 at 23:32 (3,668 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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Here is the link for the video. When I release the handle from the wand you can hear the suction power.
CLICK HERE TO GO TO starryblues4u's LINK |
Post# 271761 , Reply# 31   3/14/2014 at 00:46 (3,667 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Thanks so much for the video Wayne.
I watched it and some your other videos on Youtube and it sounds quieter than most your other machines. The power head doesn't have that whinny type of sound, it sounds more like a growl. What was that white thing on the floor (looked like pop corn), that the power head pushed away. It mush have been plastic by the sound of it in the power head (and yes I heard the suction power). Oh, and thanks for the great write up you took the time to post. Looks like it's a good addition to your collection and since your BF likes the Miele more he won't be bothering you to use the Simplicity. |
Post# 271762 , Reply# 32   3/14/2014 at 00:49 (3,667 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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Post# 271825 , Reply# 33   3/14/2014 at 11:37 (3,667 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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The model 7850 is retired and no longer in production. There are none left in the warehouse. The current replacement for it is the Simplicity Symmetry Ultra Premium, which uses the same dual fan, dual ball bearing DuraTec motor. It's quieter than the 7850, has a much better hose and wand set up, has a much better bag system, a Lifetime Belt, and yet costs no more than a 7850. Here's a pic showing the 7850 (the last new one left at the outlet store) and the Brand New for 2014 Ultra Premium model. The Ultra Premium is also available, in gorgeous candy apple red, as a Riccar Ultra Premium.
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Post# 272379 , Reply# 35   3/18/2014 at 11:17 (3,663 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 272380 , Reply# 36   3/18/2014 at 11:28 (3,663 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 272385 , Reply# 37   3/18/2014 at 12:00 (3,663 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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The RSL5 (sand or otherwise) is no longer in production. The new SupraLite (Riccar) or Freedom (Simplicity) replacement model for the RSL5 is the Riccar R10PSD ("P" for Premium and "SD" for Sand). For the Simplicity version, it would be S10PSD. The new design features a handle release PEDAL, roller skate ball bearing rear wheels, fully opening dust bag compartment, improved motor and new fan design, as well as the new self sealing Hepa bag.
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Post# 272400 , Reply# 38   3/18/2014 at 14:08 (3,663 days old) by ctvacman (CT)   |   | |
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Thanks for the info, I've just seen it in pics from the VDTA and wasn't aware they re did the model numbers. Is there any way to purchase from you? |
Post# 272506 , Reply# 40   3/19/2014 at 10:12 (3,662 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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Post# 272510 , Reply# 41   3/19/2014 at 10:26 (3,662 days old) by ultralux88 (Denver, Colorado)   |   | |
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I know so many dealers were pretty upset when the Simplicity 7 and Riccar 8000 series were officially discontinued, but I think the Ultra Premium is a very fitting and highly improved replacement. I plan on saving up and making sure to snatch one up when I'm out there in June. My first modern Tacony Machine was my Riccar central vac, the TOL dual motor version which I LOVE! Then my Radiance and now a Simplicity F3700 with special Riccar style swirly color hood. Tom. if you could find a set of the color-transition housings for an Ultra Premium I'd greatly appreciate it! I know they get them every time they switch from molding one color to molding them in another, and usually grind them up, but I'd love to get a set saved for when I get my Ultra Premium.
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Post# 272550 , Reply# 42   3/19/2014 at 16:04 (3,662 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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Reggie: the problem with the swirl color is that it won't be the same on the nozzle housing as on the bag compartment door. Unlike the UltraLite models, which only have one painted housing. My Ultra Premium Riccar (that I use at home, along with the Simplicity Wonder) has a clear nozzle housing and bag door, made from clear Lexan. One of the engineers had it built as a prototype (never for sale). You can see the brush roller, hall sensor, double fan motor, all the inner workings as well as the disposable bag, through the clear housing. Kind of like the clear motor cover I gave you for your Synergy that lets you see the tandem air motors.
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Post# 272558 , Reply# 43   3/19/2014 at 17:50 (3,662 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 272595 , Reply# 44   3/19/2014 at 22:14 (3,662 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 272601 , Reply# 45   3/19/2014 at 22:35 (3,662 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 272612 , Reply# 46   3/20/2014 at 00:34 (3,661 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Ahhh, I just saw your other threads...yeah you would be extremely busy if you did an unboxing of ALL THOSE machines.
Awesome collection you have and read how Riccar/Simplicity full size canisters are your favorite machines (sold through vacuum shops). I made the mistake with Miele (Capricorn) and didn't even want to look at Sebo after that. I think I've made the right choice with an American made machine with greater features (fingers crossed). Buy the way, wit the hoses on the Riccar and Simplicity one is gray and the other black, are they the same material just in a different color or do they differ in plastic material they used? I do want to add an unboxing thread if anyone is interested. |
Post# 272635 , Reply# 47   3/20/2014 at 07:21 (3,661 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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The hose colors are different because they improved the hoses the black hose is the newest hose .
You made an excellent choice and will be very pleased . I am very proud and very lucky to have my collection . I am very grateful and blessed to be able to purchase any vacuum my heart desires 😇 I can't wait to see your pics of your new vacuum . Dan |
Post# 272756 , Reply# 48   3/20/2014 at 20:37 (3,661 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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Post# 272757 , Reply# 49   3/20/2014 at 20:38 (3,661 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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Post# 272762 , Reply# 50   3/20/2014 at 20:50 (3,661 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 272768 , Reply# 51   3/20/2014 at 21:21 (3,661 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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Post# 272784 , Reply# 52   3/20/2014 at 22:23 (3,661 days old) by gm1982 ()   |   | |
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I think the adapter is a bit silly, the Aerus Lux and Kenmore canisters have this down without the need of an adapter. Direct connect |
Post# 272794 , Reply# 53   3/20/2014 at 22:58 (3,661 days old) by georgect (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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I know...right?
It would seem like it was an after thought. I'm sure the next generation will have a direct connection. (And just a heads up, the next generation isn't coming out ant time soon for the Immaculate or Impeccable. I contacted Riccar before I decided on purchasing the Immaculate to be sure there wasn't a refresh or redesign being released any time soon). |
Post# 272797 , Reply# 54   3/20/2014 at 23:08 (3,661 days old) by starryblues4u (Charlotte, NC)   |   | |
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I was a little disappointed when I found out I needed it but I love my moxie so much that I did not mind. I didn't really need the mini power nozzle either but I wanted the complete set. It will be helpful with the adapter as I don't have to bend as far while doing furniture. I have a slightly bad back and I think it will help.
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Post# 272829 , Reply# 55   3/21/2014 at 07:42 (3,660 days old) by gm1982 ()   |   | |
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I think the air driven turbo for this model would be adequate. I can't see the justification in price for the electric turbo plus adapter. |
Post# 272869 , Reply# 56   3/21/2014 at 11:59 (3,660 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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The Wonder and Prima models will not need the adapter for the mini power nozzle. The Full Size canisters are a 10 year old design. All the brand new attachments, wands, etc. are debuting on the Wonder and Prima. In five years, I've only sold 1 Immaculate. When compared to the Verve and Pristine, the size alone turns many people off to the full size machines (weight and maneuverability). However, the biggest majority of purchasers are women. Given the $200 difference in price (at the outlet store) between the Verve and the Moxie (or Pristine and Immaculate in the Riccar line), people always go for the lesser expensive machine. And those are Outlet Store prices. At full retail, the difference is many hundreds of dollars. It pays to visit the Museum/Outlet store when buying a new Simplicity or Riccar (if you're a vacuum collector).
The Vacuum Collectors Convention is the second weekend in June here at the Vacuum Cleaner Museum. I know a number of folks who are buying their new cleaner at that time - and will save enough money buying from the Outlet Store to pay for the entire hotel stay as well as gas and food. |
Post# 273630 , Reply# 57   3/27/2014 at 07:14 (3,654 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 273642 , Reply# 58   3/27/2014 at 08:54 (3,654 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 273766 , Reply# 59   3/27/2014 at 23:39 (3,654 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 273922 , Reply# 60   3/28/2014 at 22:45 (3,653 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 274133 , Reply# 61   3/30/2014 at 13:27 (3,651 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 274153 , Reply# 62   3/30/2014 at 14:16 (3,651 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 274301 , Reply# 63   3/31/2014 at 07:54 (3,650 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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I checked Wayne's video of his Moxie (equivalent) and his "Off" LED doesn't light up either.
I thought it would glow in standby but that doesn't seem the case. When you get a chance, check yours out and let me know what yous does. Thanks! CLICK HERE TO GO TO GeorgeCT's LINK |
Post# 274303 , Reply# 64   3/31/2014 at 09:12 (3,650 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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Do not push the on/off button on the handle. Press the power nozzle button instead. The nozzle will come on, and the machine will start in HI power. Press the down button until the OFF light comes on. The canister motor is now off, but the Power Nozzle remains ON. This is to scrub in the Simplicity dry powder carpet shampoo.
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Post# 274312 , Reply# 65   3/31/2014 at 09:41 (3,650 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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Post# 274412 , Reply# 66   4/1/2014 at 09:52 (3,649 days old) by dysonman1 (the county)   |   | |
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You're welcome George. By the way, just as a little FYI, the motor in your machine will definitely last more than 1200 hours. Last April, the engineering department started an Immaculate and a Moxie, and let them run for 8 hours (the work day) to test the new motors which we were starting to use then. In June, at the Vacuum Collectors Convention (which we hold every year, second weekend in June at the Vacuum Museum), they were STILL RUNNING. Every day, one of the tech services guys would initial the hour log. They ran 8 hours per day, five days per week, for more than 2 months. You should NEVER have problems with the motor of your machine.
If you ever want to meet the people who built your vacuum, and see new ones being made, come by the Museum and Factory Outlet Store - we'll go up into the factory and I'll introduce you to the folks who made your machine. This post was last edited 04/01/2014 at 13:51 |
Post# 274416 , Reply# 67   4/1/2014 at 10:38 (3,649 days old) by GeorgeCT (Fairfield, Connecticut)   |   | |
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I wont be having any issue with the motor of the Immaculate.
It feels more substantial than other canisters I've owned. I was even impressed with the hinge on the accessory hood cover, it's not just clipped on with a spring like on the Miele. The hood has two hinges, one cogged the other for stability and strength and a substantial spring that's not weak at all and provides plenty of tension. |