Thread Number: 23464
Rainbow vs. Fantom Thunder, last vac wins the demo, in response to Kill a Kirby 		[Down to Last]

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Post# 262768   1/11/2014 at 06:43 (3,756 days old) by man114 (Buffalo NY)        

In regards to the Kill a Kirby thread , I decided to do a test of Fantom vs. Rainbow in the same light. My wife has a Rainbow demo coming up and wanted to practice, so when it came to vac comparisons I chose my Fantom Thunder vs. the Rainbow.

You could pull cloths all day with the Rainbow (we hadn't vacuumed that area rug in a few days), but using the Cyclone XT floor tool it was easy to pull another cloth with the Fantom in the same spot.

50 stroke test, Fantom nearly filled the Bin, Rainbow still easily pulled cloths from the power head following that. Vacuumed the whole rug with the Rainbow water was a mess.

While it is a deviation from their demo I Vacuumed with the Fantom afterwards and still got more in the bin. You can probably guess Rainbow the second time had more dirty water.

The moral of the story, as in the Kill a Kirby thread is whatever vac goes last wins the demo. Better vacuums make the demo less impressive, but if you haven't vacuumed a rug in a while you will get results like mine you can pull cloths either way.



Post# 263163 , Reply# 1   1/13/2014 at 10:09 (3,754 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        

What a Rainbow saleperson would be doing in this demo is not only show how much more dirt you were pulling, but also reemphasizing again and again that the Rainbow is not emiting any dust back into the air, where as the test machine is spewing like Mt. St. Helen.

The Rainbow sales person would no only pull the one pad that is dry, but would wet a few others and put them in succession at each wand extension junction and hose to show how much dust gets buy a bag/filter and the Rainbow is drowning in the water bath. Wet dust can't fly.

Unless the Rainbow demo has changed recently you still have that big ole floodlight to show the dust flying in the air. With a Fantom it won't be hard to find an air stream of dust flying.



Post# 263164 , Reply# 2   1/13/2014 at 10:17 (3,754 days old) by jade_angel (Fort Collins, CO)        

I remember as a kid watching a Rainbow demo with that floodlight. The salesman was demoing a D4, I think, against my mother's Filter Queen (model 31, IIRC), and the floodlight test wasn't especially impressive. That said, the Rainbow sure did pull up a lot of dirt - mostly because it had a power nozzle and the FQ did not.

But then, if you want to demonstrate filtration, an FQ isn't the ideal machine to test against. Demo a Rainbow vs. the majority of other bagless machines, and yeah, the floodlight test will be pretty freaky. Heck, even a lot of older bagged machines won't look so hot.

Post# 263193 , Reply# 3   1/13/2014 at 15:16 (3,754 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
In a Rainbow demonstration

 Much like any other vacuum demo, you are not only demonstrating what you can do better i.e pick up more dirt. You are also building value: The Rainbow can replace your air cleaner, your vacuum, you carpet washer, your mop, dust mop, dust pan, dusting rag . . .
This is building value that the machine is worth more because it can do more, and better. You don't want to in a Rainbow, anymore than any other demo to keep "bashing", putting down or "killing" another machine, because you then put the customer on the defense. You are selling them on how much they want and need your machine.


Post# 263195 , Reply# 4   1/13/2014 at 15:23 (3,754 days old) by ralph123 (Little Rock, AR)        
why does Rainbow perform poorly in Consumer Reports tests?

 Rainbow salespersons certainly spin a great yarn, but when Consumer Reports runs their tests, the Rainbow has very disappointing results. Kirby, on the other hand, aces the carpet cleaning test. Any ideas why this is?

Post# 263197 , Reply# 5   1/13/2014 at 16:08 (3,754 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        
It all comes down to Airflow + Agitation!

 sptyks's profile picture
Although the Rainbow has good airflow and suction at the hose connection, it becomes much less effective after 6 + feet of hose and wand.

The Kirby puts all 115 CFM of airflow just 3 inches from the carpet surface not to mention the Kirby's brushroll is larger and more aggressive than the Rainbow's PN.


Post# 263213 , Reply# 6   1/13/2014 at 18:32 (3,754 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
why does Rainbow perform poorly in Consumer Reports tests?

 CR being a guide and not a Bible can sometimes be rather biased in their own unbiased way.

They tend to judge items that are costly with a much harsher stick than the cheaper counterparts. I remember one CR review of the Kirby back in 1981 or so, though for years they were rating some plastic machines better because of the purchase price they finally broke down and wrote ". . .though still costly, the Kirby at least does what it advertises it will do. . . "

Though I don't think they publish their test criteria any longer their testing usually produces some top picks, at least they place Rainbow at the top for trouble free ownership. (at least they used to, havent read their review lately."

Post# 263224 , Reply# 7   1/13/2014 at 20:38 (3,754 days old) by man114 (Buffalo NY)        

A properly maintained Fantom does not create a massive dust cloud when turned on, at least the Thunder doesn't. I doubt many would maintain the Thunder to that level. I clean the seal to the canister and the bottom cone seal, and the seal to the HEPA any time I remove the filter housing.

I agree that is is not about killing another machine, that was the other thread, the Rainbow demo is about showing what the other vacuum is not doing.

In the past Consumer Reports used non wettable dirt, which would render the Rainbow ineffective in their test, and they have tested no recent model.

Rainbow's current powerhead is far superior to the previous version. Having tried both it is night and day. It does give a Kirby a run for the money In a demo, I have seen that first hand.

My main point here is the vacuum that performs the tests last wins, particularly the 50 stroke test. Even the mini vac.



Post# 263563 , Reply# 8   1/16/2014 at 08:53 (3,751 days old) by ralph123 (Little Rock, AR)        

Kirby's the best said: "In a Rainbow demonstration, much like any other vacuum demo, you are not only demonstrating what you can do better i.e pick up more dirt..."

I would disagree with you about your interpretation of the results.
It's not just you, every dtd salesman seems to think that if his vacuum can pick up even a speck of dirt that was "missed" by the first vacuum, that they've somehow won. However, that is flawed logic. That is the whole point of last vacuum always wins. Salespersons aren't interested in a fair test, they are interested in selling vacuums.

In order to demonstrate that the dtd vacuum picked up more dirt, you would have to run a fair and unbiased test. Each vacuum would be used for the same amount of time on similarly dirty carpets, under similar vacuuming conditions. You would have to compare the dirt picked up by each. If the dtd vacuum is a Rainbow, you may even need to penalize the Rainbow for the extra amount of time needed preparation and clean up. If it takes 1 minute to prepare a Simplicity vacuum and 5 minutes to prepare a Rainbow, a fair test might even given the Simplicity an extra 4 minutes of cleaning time, but that's debatable.


Post# 263643 , Reply# 9   1/16/2014 at 22:03 (3,751 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
Ralph

 I think your needle is stuck.
I also wrote it is the job of a sales rep to build value.
When you watch a demo you will see this is what they are doing, as well as pulling dirt.

You downplay the negatives like time setting up, as being so worth the effort.



Post# 263953 , Reply# 10   1/18/2014 at 16:48 (3,749 days old) by kirby519 (Wisconsin)        

Another thing DTD sales depend on is that your current machine hasn't been maintained. worn out belts, agitators, bags / filters in need of cleaning. All these things add to the awesomeness of how well a brand new vacuum performs.

Rainbow and / or Kirby can not vacuum enough dirt out of the carpets here to make any claim that thier machine works better than my current Kirby Heritage II. (purchased new in 1997) I keep up with the "maintenance on the machine like the rest of us here do. Therefore my machine can keep pace with theirs at any given time. I also vacuum several times a week. Many with a "High end vacuum" take it for granted that it will get all the dirt when used only for "the weekly / monthly deep cleaning". Not true. Regular vacuuming is what it takes to keep up with the dirt with any vacuum. And the DTD sales force knows this. I have vacuumed my entire apt with a rainbow after a month of regular cleanings with my kirby and the water in the pan was barely cloudy. That was doing the end of the month detailed cleaning I do. Corner to corner ceiling to floor and anything in between.

It is a visual thing. While they wow you with what they can vacuum out of a carpet and all the things the vacuum can do. You are not thinking about when the last time you changed a bag, cleaned a filter, replaced a belt or agitator or even that the rug may not have been vacuumed in several days.

Many dont think about " the maintenace of the machine" that is why there are so many "non working" vacuums at the curb or in the local thirft stores. Do the basic maintenance and replace the agitator. You have a great working vacuum some one else paid good money for and tossed to the curb over a broken belt.


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