Thread Number: 23428
Kirby salesperson worst nightmare
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Post# 262335   1/7/2014 at 22:11 (3,758 days old) by vacuumssuck213 ()        

So imagine your a Kirby sales Rep you go into a demo and there vacuum is just killing the Kirby what vacuum is that ??

Post# 262339 , Reply# 1   1/7/2014 at 23:31 (3,758 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Their? vacuum? I am guessing my Concept one could give it a headache

Post# 262340 , Reply# 2   1/7/2014 at 23:38 (3,758 days old) by caligula (Wallingford, Connecticut)        
Hi vacuumsuck213

caligula's profile picture

I was a training manager for Kirby for over 15 years, and I never encountered that problem.

 

To start with, the office staff booked our appointments, and found out what type of machine we were up against, be that tank, canister, or upright, we also knew the brand, and finally, most important, the age of the machine. Part of my job was training the sales reps on how to 'pull' a machine, by using the features the customers machine didn't have. And, yes, this also applied to older model Kirby's. A Classic 111 could easily pull a D-80, D-50, or older. (Wider nozzle, and so on).

 

The demo was set up with husband and wife watching, and it began with the Handi-Butler. There was a reason for this. To whet the husbands interest with power tools. We got him to drill a block of wood, then sand it, and showed how he could use the buffing pad on the flexible shaft to polish his car, before going into the sprayer, telling him it could be used to kill the bugs attacking his rose bushes.

 

By the time we got to using their vacuum cleaner, they were so dazzled that the Electrolux, Hoover, or late model Kirby didn't matter, they wanted, and needed that new Kirby.

 

As I said at the start of this, the key was training, and that began by watching a training demo,  learning the machine, and finally a section I called "knowing your competitor," where they were taught about other brands. This was followed with several practice demos, then I went out with each trainee and they got 'on the job training.' So another brand 'killing' the Kirby, didn't happen, at least not in the various branch offices I worked for.

 

I hope this sheds some light on how the demo was conducted, and the mind set of the sales staff.

 

Alex Taber.

 

 


Post# 262371 , Reply# 3   1/8/2014 at 03:46 (3,758 days old) by vacuumssuck213 ()        
Most Agreed

I my self personaly did demos for kirby for a few weeks and While I agree that with the multiple tools to my knowledge only kirby provides such as the turbo accessories and no tangle cord air pump/worlds smallest vacuum etc. I am also wondering if any machine has out performed in terms and of deep cleaning. For example if one of my first sales a nice old lady had a riccar ran it across the floor several times And 30 pads pulled from the kirby loads of sand come to find out her children draged in over 50 years ago. After that we were trained to bury the out preformed machine but I tell ya It would have been embarrassing to bury the kirby. So to sum it up baking powder test. Do any vacs have the ability to make the kirby pull a clean pad afterwards

Post# 262374 , Reply# 4   1/8/2014 at 04:11 (3,758 days old) by Turbo500 (West Yorkshire, UK)        
make the kirby pull a clean pad afterwards

turbo500's profile picture
I don't think that really matters. You could vacuum with a Kirby and then go over it with a Dyson and it will still pick up left over dust, because no amount of vacuuming cleans a carpet 100%. Which ever vacuum goes second is always going to pick up something left behind.

Post# 262379 , Reply# 5   1/8/2014 at 05:28 (3,758 days old) by tophatjohnny ()        
Kirby's Are Great

And while I was a victim of the poor kid (saying he was putting himself through school) I still have my Kirby as my basement utility vacuum. My Patriot just walks all over my Kirby, but hey, my Patriot does not turn into a shampooer!!

Post# 262393 , Reply# 6   1/8/2014 at 08:12 (3,757 days old) by Blackheart (North Dakota)        
Well...

blackheart's profile picture
The only thing i could think of that could truly challenge a new Kirby would be an old one I still think it's weird that my heritage II and Legend II moves more air on the hose than my G6 but it's probably due to the motor having the drag from the transmission or the higher filtration outer bag.

Post# 262410 , Reply# 7   1/8/2014 at 11:08 (3,757 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
Never saw it.

I demo'd and sold Kirby back during the Tradition model. There were some machines that were easier to show up, but the Kirby was always the top performer because which ever one goes first loses.

The only homes where the Kirby pulled smaller amounts, not clean pads, were homes that were vacuumed everyday, and had little traffic. I have pulled dirty pads from carpets that were only laid a day before.

I always did very well with the salt/sand test. The Kirby would win this one every time. (I know there will be uproar about that comment). I was demoing a brand new machine with all new parts/belts and an empty bag/dirt meter against a used machine with a worn belt and usually a full bag.

The only true measure is to put in a set, weighted amount of sand and then weigh what is pulled out. The salt/sand test is impressive as is the bed/mattress test.


Post# 262425 , Reply# 8   1/8/2014 at 12:39 (3,757 days old) by rainbowvacfane2 (tracy ca)        
I killed a Kirby

rainbowvacfane2's profile picture
With my sanitaire sc886 that uses Kirby bags

Post# 262426 , Reply# 9   1/8/2014 at 12:52 (3,757 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
You killed a Kirby

During a Kirby demo, with the Sanitaire going first?
The Kirby demo is to show what "your"machine left behind. Every machine leaves something behind, so for the Kirby to win they only have to pull something and I can show "this is what your machine left". For your machine to win or the Kirby to be killed during this demonstration there will be nothing on the pad when the Kirby finishes.

This, of course, is impossible, because if I pull a clean pad then I am going to put something there for your machine to miss. This is a Kirby demonstration, I am going to win.




Post# 262427 , Reply# 10   1/8/2014 at 13:02 (3,757 days old) by kirbymodel2c (Nottingham, England)        
Hi,

kirbymodel2c's profile picture

Hi, I've never had a problem or worried about another vacuum out performing the Kirby when I did the demo. No matter if it was up against a Dyson, Filter Queen, Tristar, Sebo or another direct air machine like a Senior or Sanitaire. I'd just keep pulling the pads till there was nothing left to see. It was also the high quality and versatility as well as  the high performance that helped differentiate between the Kirby and the vacuum you was up against.

 

JamesSmile

 


Post# 262433 , Reply# 11   1/8/2014 at 14:10 (3,757 days old) by jade_angel (Fort Collins, CO)        

I suppose another question might be, against which vacuums does the Kirby wind up looking the most impressive? Patterns of use matter, too, and that's harder to tell, but I imagine you'd pull up a lot more fuzz behind a Dyson DC01 used weekly, than behind (say) a Sebo D4 used daily.

Post# 262436 , Reply# 12   1/8/2014 at 14:37 (3,757 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        

which vacuums does the Kirby wind up looking the most impressive?

From personal experience, there is one high end vacuum that consistently walked out of the house with me. Remember these were the days before Dyson so it isn't that one. The name itself I will not give for fear of a lynching, and I do not want to take away from an excellent machine in itself. Most of the blame fell with the user not properly maintaining the machine and believing that as long as the machine was running the bag/suction was still ok.

If a machine is used frequently and correctly they are capable of keeping the carpets and rugs in good shape. A machine that is used is far more beneficial than one that stays in the closet. If Granny uses her Oreck everyday, she is getting far more benefit that if she uses her Kirby, Rainbow, Dyson once a month.



Post# 262445 , Reply# 13   1/8/2014 at 15:36 (3,757 days old) by caligula (Wallingford, Connecticut)        
Hi vacuumssuck213

caligula's profile picture

Some Kirby branch offices did 'bury' the customers old machine, none of the offices I worked for did it, but they did hold a 'smash a vacuum' day every few months. The sales staff and so on would meet in the parking lot, and take a sledge hammer to the Electrolux, Eureka, Hoover, or other machine on the 'execution block.' Being a man who loves ALL vacuum cleaners, I couldn't condone this, and because it was held on a Saturday afternoon, I never attended. I also made it clear to my manager that I didn't want to know the details at the Monday morning sales meetings, so it was never brought up.

 

As for the side by side test of their  Electrolux (or and other brand) and our Kirby, was to do 50 strokes (25 front, 25 back) then make 2 passes with the Kirby. The idea was to show that we could pull more dirt. What the customer didn't know was that it also works in reverse. That's right, if the Kirby did the 50 strokes first, that old Electrolux would pull more dirt. So that's one thing we didn't tell our trainees. Bottom line, if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with b.s.!

 

But by far, the best trick was the mattress test. That's too disgusting to go into here, but it worked, and I closed more sales right then and there, then with any other part of my demo.

 

Demoing Kirby's was a magic act, a bit of theater, with show and tell added for good measure. If you like your product, tell them the truth (okay we'd bend it a little) and offer them a great deal, you usually made a sale.


Post# 262447 , Reply# 14   1/8/2014 at 15:42 (3,757 days old) by electromatik (Taylorsville, North Carolina, U.S.A.)        

I would say you could "kill" a vacuum if you show the owner enough dirt. Rainbow people will tell you that dirty water sells Rainbow's. I saw a demo of a Rainbow on Youtube once that showed the salesman vacuuming with the owner's machine 50 times. He then went over the exact same spot and vacuumed 10 times with the Rainbow and pulled out a black cloth with a pile of dirt on it. The owner exclaimed "oh my gosh!" She was instantly convinced her old vacuum was not cleaning as good. I don't regard the Kirby as universally the "best." I hate uprights and no upright can do all the things a canister can do as well as a canister. There is always something inferior about uprights. Even Kirby's attachments don't impress me nor does the hose. I will say that a direct air machine like Kirby is very good at removing dirt from a carpet. I'm not convinced it's because it's direct air though. I rather think it has more to do with the manual height adjustment and the weight of the machine pushing the nozzle deeper. They are hard to beat on carpeting for sure.

Post# 262449 , Reply# 15   1/8/2014 at 15:53 (3,757 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
I enjoy my canister cleaners, getting around tight places,tools, ect. However if I am going to deep clean, like before a shampooing out comes the dirty air upright. That much air flow and deep agitation NONE of the powerhead canisters I have tried can match.Just my own experience of course. I have some dark blue commercial carpet in the garage, near the kitty litter box, wow can you tell what beats the carpet and what doesn't.

Post# 262471 , Reply# 16   1/8/2014 at 18:16 (3,757 days old) by man114 (Buffalo NY)        

The newest Rainbow should give a good go, did the Rainbow demo vs. new Kirby about a month ago. The Rainbow killed the Kirby with a new bag at that on a demo standpoint. 50 strokes back and forth on the carpet with the Kirby, did 3 inches of that same carpet, 1/2 inch of dirt on the test cloth. Granted that is how it is supposed to work, but 1/2 inch was might impressive for 3 inches of a single stroke. I suppose if you did a very good cleaning with any quality vacuum the demo is going to be a lot less impressive.

Post# 262486 , Reply# 17   1/8/2014 at 20:20 (3,757 days old) by Vacuumfreeeke ()        

When I sold the Ultimate G, we were killed by a green, plastic, bagless Dirt Devil Vision... Seriously, the Kirby got nothing in the home that was regularly cleaned with that machine and the Dirt Devil wouldn't quit pulling stuff up... I was horrified and shocked all at the same time!

Post# 262487 , Reply# 18   1/8/2014 at 20:30 (3,757 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        
man114:

sptyks's profile picture
1/2 half inch of dirt on a 3 inch section of carpet - I find very hard to believe.

You said the Kirby had a new bag, but you forgot to mention it wasn't plugged in!


Post# 262516 , Reply# 19   1/8/2014 at 23:42 (3,757 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
Perhaps it had a worn belt or brush?

Post# 262526 , Reply# 20   1/9/2014 at 02:36 (3,757 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

I think the worst nightmarte for any vacuum salesman-not just Kirbys-is the client you just demoed the vacuum to doesn't have the credit to buy it-honestly-the customer wants it badly- You the salesman knows he wants it-but no agency will lend him the money to buy-so sadly you have to pack the machine up-this happened a few times while selling TriStars.
I have both a Patriot and a Miracle Mate-'fraid my Kirbys kill them everytime I try on my carpets-BUT-the Patriot or MM kills the Kirby when you use them as hand tool or bare floor tool canisters over the Kirby's "canister".-and no worries with the MM or Patriot if you pick up that coin,pebble,or nail with the hose.I can make use of BOTH types of machines.


Post# 262540 , Reply# 21   1/9/2014 at 06:01 (3,757 days old) by man114 (Buffalo NY)        

No lie on the half an inch. Mostly dog hair. The Kirby was plugged in, and I'd never have believed it if I didn't see it. The carpet was a dense pile manufactured wool area rug in a dining room. The carpet hadn't been vacuumed in a bit, the lady admitted she had been too busy to move the table. She owned two Kirby's (Ultimate G and Sentria) and said she knew how the demo worked since she had two Kirby demos done before. So she put a fresh bag in using the Ultimate G and proceeded to do the end of the carpet that stuck out, and even lifted the carpet and vacuumed underneath it. She thought it was pretty clean so my wife who was doing the demo (as I mentioned before my wife and I sell them part time as a team because my wife believes it helps he asthma, and despite what I believe is an insane cost having paid $20 at a thrift store for my E series she insists it is worth full price) for her put the test cloth on and literally as soon as the powerhead was turned on, she pulled it back three inches and you could hear that it was clogged, and really there was half an inch of dirt, albeit mostly dog hair. She then of course wanted to vacuum the whole rug, which looked fantastic when she was done, the mud on the bottom of the rainbow pan was literally 1/4 inch thick. It was quite impressive, even owning two Rainbows and maybe 5 Kirby's myself I was quite surprised. I imagine if you had a newer Rainbow the Kirby demo will be much less effective.

Now we have done test demos at home for practice using Kirby's, Fantoms and even Rainbow vs. Rainbow, you can still pull test cloths even on two identical machines, a lot of that is what sells the buyer but no one ever reverses the demo in a home and does it.

The moral here is the better the vacuum you use the less likely the Kirby demo will be impressive.


Post# 262541 , Reply# 22   1/9/2014 at 06:07 (3,757 days old) by man114 (Buffalo NY)        

Additionally the Kirby was in excellent condition and it did not sound like it was bogging down. If anything it sounded like the brush was too aggressive like it was really pounding the carpet.

Post# 262578 , Reply# 23   1/9/2014 at 13:53 (3,756 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
Those who claim to have killed a Kirby

Are missing the scope and intent of the thread, or at least the literal way I am reading it.
Lets go back and read the thread heading together.
"Kirby salesperson worst nightmare"
I second that the worst nightmare is doing a two hour demo and then they don't have the funds or ability to purchase.

Now the text of the OP:
"So imagine your a Kirby sales Rep you go into a demo and there vacuum is just killing the Kirby what vacuum is that ?? "

Now my contention is for Man114 and the others.
In a KIRBY demonstration the homeowner's present machine is the machine that goes first. (remember the one that goes first loses). The Kirby then goes after the homeowner has made 30-50 passes, and in some cases you may help them out and do another 25 or so. Then the KIRBY rep will make One pass forward and one backward and show the dirt that was remaining. Kirby won the KIRBY demo. In order for the Kirby to be Killed as I posted previously would be if they pulled an absolutely clean pad, meaning the previous machine left nothing behind. This is not and rarely is the case the Kirby will always win in a KIRBY demonstration.

Not detracting from Kirby, or any other machine out there, it is simple physics and vacuum efficiency. A carpet can hold 1 1/2 time is own weight in dirt. No vacuum is 100% effective, some better than others, but none are 100% there is always going to be something left behind.

Many who are operating a machine, be it Kirby or otherwise do not use the machine to it's greatest efficiency. I have seen Kirby users adjust their machines in many manors other than the correct one where you go one step after the motor changes tone. I have seen some, like my sister, that just adjusts it all the way down "So it will really deep clean." In effect shutting off the suction completely. OR Too high, in which case they are just wasting electricity.



Post# 262594 , Reply# 24   1/9/2014 at 16:47 (3,756 days old) by vacuumssuck213 ()        
not killing but impaling

What I am hearing is what everyone says Kirby's are smoke and mirrors pure and simple the use of basic physics is what makes this possible that Kirby is the most wonderful machine so one could argue my worlds largest retail bought bissel is just as efficient lets not go into specifics on the title after so many passes what vacuum made the Kirby pull its unusual lightly dusted pad.

Post# 262598 , Reply# 25   1/9/2014 at 17:11 (3,756 days old) by man114 (Buffalo NY)        

Actually that is what I said in my post, the last vac to pull wins because dirt is always left behind. The Rainbow demo is the same and it always wins. If the vac it is up against isn't maintained it makes matters worse. You could do the test with a Kirby and pull a cloth with the Fantom. My contention was what would make the Kirby seem less impressive in the demo, that would be a higher end competitor, I used Rainbow as an example, but you can substitute any number of other high end vacuums.

Post# 262608 , Reply# 26   1/9/2014 at 18:18 (3,756 days old) by kirbymodel2c (Nottingham, England)        
Hi,

kirbymodel2c's profile picture

Hi, I Strongly disagree the the Kirby is "smoke and mirrors" It's more than capable of deep cleaning a carpet better and quicker than most vacs out there and with out damaging the carpets. If you look at the CRI (Carpet and Rug institute) to which Kirby got a Gold level approval.

To say a Kirby's no better than most of the crap out there is stupid.

Yes I accept the Kirby demo is biased towards the Kirby but so is every demo whether it's by a Rainbow,Filter queen,Tristar dealer or every TV ad/infomercial for regular off the shelf brand. (Dyson,Hoover, Bissell etc.)

When doing a demo there was no vac we worried about coming across. Whether or not the machine was high end or low ends made no real difference. What brand another vac was generally made little difference to what showed up on the pads.

We would also keep pulling the pads till nothing appeared which depending how dirty the carpet was in the first place would depend on how may pads this took.



Regular daily vacuuming keeps the carpet cleaner than running a vac once a week. Getting the dirt before it gets ingrained in the carpet. Which most vacs leave behind once it's worked it's way to the bottom of the pile. Saying that I've seen some other machine struggle with surface litter!

At least Kirby deep cleans. It's not a "miracle machine" it's just a well engineered machine the deep cleans quicker and better than most and doing this efficiently a possible. "Who goes last wins" is true but it doesn't mean a Kirby won't deep clean better than most.

 

JamesSmile


Post# 262609 , Reply# 27   1/9/2014 at 18:46 (3,756 days old) by floor-a-matic (somewhere)        

Has anyone tried to compare the new Kirby Sentria vs older Kirby (Classic, Sanitronic, 516 etc)

 

I compared my Classic 1CR & TriStar CXL with VGII; & I filled the TriStar bag 100% full.  My guess is could that be because my Classic 1CR has a generic paper bag conversion?  My Classic came with the Eureka F & G style conversion bag

 

When a Kirby sales rep showed the new Sentria, my old Classic 1CR outperformed the new Sentria despite the 1CR being equipped with generic conversion bag & 4-row brush




This post was last edited 01/09/2014 at 22:55
Post# 262615 , Reply# 28   1/9/2014 at 20:01 (3,756 days old) by super-sweeper (KSSRC Refurbishment Center)        
Yes!

super-sweeper's profile picture

Those conversions brought the air-flow and performance down so low, bags tended to burst from the Kirby's power!


Post# 262629 , Reply# 29   1/9/2014 at 23:02 (3,756 days old) by vacuumssuck213 ()        
something we can all agree on.

Okay so we can all agree Kirbys are impressive machines but what vacuum or vacuums can we agree are a no demo nessasary sell most brands have a clunker what vacuums were major fumble present or past I honestly think the bissel powerforce is a pretty good example


Post# 262630 , Reply# 30   1/9/2014 at 23:04 (3,756 days old) by caligula (Wallingford, Connecticut)        
Hi Kirbysthebest

caligula's profile picture

The demo you speak of sounds like the fault of the office staff that booked the appointment, and you should never have gone to that house/apartment.

 

Each branch office is different and each A. D. (area distributor) can make his own rules, but even so, he has to follow certain rules set in the 1920's by James B. Kirby, who was not only a great inventor, but a genius when it came to designing the demo of his products.  While the demo changed to accommodate each new model, and attachment, the basic demo is still the same as that of the Vac-U-ette.

 

To start with, the person booking the appointment asks if one or both people are working, and gets the basic income. Next it is made clear that both need to be present, and are sized up by the Kirby person booking that appointment. In the conversation, the age, brand and type of vacuum cleaner they own is discussed, and are finally told. "While you are under no obligation to buy, the Kirby representative is going to try to sell you the new Kirby model---." 

 

If you were on a demo with deadbeats, showing them the machine could easily have lead to future demo's (with sales) by 'word of mouth,' and leads. If however, those leads were people in the same financial situation, then the fault was clearly in the person booking the demo, who didn't size up the prospects correctly.   


Post# 262654 , Reply# 31   1/10/2014 at 07:40 (3,755 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
there is no smoke and mirrors

Any demonstration of any machine be it Kirby, Filterqueen, Electrolux, Fairfax, Tristar, Rainbow. The machine being demonstrated is the machine that is going to be shown in the best light.

Kirby is a superior machine through Quality,Reliability and Performance. If you are happy with a Bissell Power force, then that is the machine for your. However, I will challenge you to come back after that Bissell has cleaned a 3,000 sq ft home, daily for 40 years and tell me about your experiences with it. There are many Kirby owners that can do that and usually with no or minimal repairs.

My Kirby Omega was purchased new on May 30, 1975, though it went into semi-retirement in December, 2003 the machine is still running with only changes in the belt, brush roll and one fan (my fault). It even still has the original light bulb that is working.

Someday if I want to have the machine refreshed, rebuilt and brought back to new condition under my original purchaser agreement to rebuild I can do so for $49.50 plus shipping cost. Now I would call that a Quality machine that is repairable, Reliable as it is always ready for action, and it is versatile and Performs the job it was designed for flawlessly.

Now there are some requirements for keeping that machine in peak condition, actually this applies to all appliances, but we are speaking about the Kirby now. You must take care of it, maintain it like a quality piece of equipment. Empty the bag, on this machine it is recommended after every use. Change the belt when you notice the brushroll is not turning like it should. Clean the brushroll and adjust it on a regular basis. Don't use the machine for other than it's intended use i.e. cleaning out the fireplace or the aquarium.

You wouldn't purchase a Rolls Royce and then go mudding in the woods anymore than you would drive your red neck Pick up to a formal ball. Why would you leave your Kirby on the front porch in the rain?

Caligula:
When you had a pre-qualified appointment they were the best, but there were times you worked crew in a neighborhood. You may do 10 demo's a day for whomever would let you in the house. Those were usually the ones that loved the machine but couldn't afford to buy a Dirt Devil.

Surprisingly, and I have heard this from other dealers as well over the years. You are more likely to make a sale to Irma and Bobby Joe at the trailer park than you are to Buffy and Roger at Willow Brook Estates. Irma and Bobby Joe may see it as a status symbol, or a good long term purchase. Roger and Buffy don't care.




Post# 262658 , Reply# 32   1/10/2014 at 10:08 (3,755 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)        

suckolux's profile picture
another nightmare?? How about the third party shoot down? I was that person last month.Sorry.

Post# 262665 , Reply# 33   1/10/2014 at 10:29 (3,755 days old) by ralph123 (Little Rock, AR)        
killing a Kirby

Having the carpets professionally steam cleaned and vacuuming regularly can make the Kirby salesman's job considerably more difficult.

So did any customers just say no to the vacuuming a spot 50 times? If I had the misfortune of a demo, I think I would refuse. It's a waste of time and misleading at best.

Regarding the Kirby pads, it seems like a trick given that the performance of the vacuum with pads will likely be better than the performance with an air restricting bag. It doesn't actually demonstrate how the Kirby will perform under normal operating conditions, so it is not a valid test.


Post# 262673 , Reply# 34   1/10/2014 at 11:51 (3,755 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        

Actually--the pads have a smaller surface area and are more restrictive than the bag when it comes to airflow. This is why we had another item in our arsenal The Baird Meter that allowed us to use a 24" square cloth to capture the dirt pulled from the carpet. Like I said I have pulled dirt from a brand-new-laid-that-day-carpet. It was not manufactured in a clean room, it was not stored in a clean room, and it was probably hauled in the back of a pick up before it was delivered. Then it was walked on by the installers while being installed. You can pull dirt.

Yes, even a new or newly cleaned carpet is not absolutely clean, there is still dirt that can be pulled.

As for them declining to vacuum, they do, so we would do it for them. And if they are savey they will say "no vacuum is 100% which is a fact, then we will show how much the Kirby continues to pull and do a series of 2 passes or a total of about seven new pads in the same area, each pad getting cleaner to demonstrate that yes the Kirby is not 100% but if you make the a week of just two passes you pulled all the dirt where their vacuum left Tada this much after 50 passes.

The Kirby is a direct air machine, it is designed to clean that carpet, and has been pointed out has a Gold seal from the CRI.

Cost???
Do some math.
You buy a $200 big box machine every year or two. In 10 years you have had spent $1,000 on these machines you threw away, the Kirby is still running, and can be sent in for a rebuild when needed.

The Kirby demo is not only about showing the performance of the machine but building the value of the machine.
How many things it can do, and the number of machines it can replace.
How much dirt it can pull, thus prolonging the life of your carpets and furniture,
How durable it is thus saving you the cost of replacing every few years.
How Reliable it is, solidly built, serviceable when needed/



Post# 262674 , Reply# 35   1/10/2014 at 11:53 (3,755 days old) by ultralux88 (Denver, Colorado)        

ultralux88's profile picture
I'm betting my NSS Pig would put the Kirby to shame!

Post# 262677 , Reply# 36   1/10/2014 at 12:02 (3,755 days old) by ralph123 (Little Rock, AR)        

"I'm betting my NSS Pig would put the Kirby to shame!"

Not likely, because the test is rigged for the last vacuum to win.

"Actually--the pads have a smaller surface area and are more restrictive than the bag when it comes to airflow."

Regardless, it is not representative of normal operation. In addition, you keep changing pads, so it is not like using bags.


Post# 262680 , Reply# 37   1/10/2014 at 12:23 (3,755 days old) by sptyks (Skowhegan, Maine)        
Just to set things straight....

sptyks's profile picture
Ralph123:

It's obvious you have never used the Kirby Dirtmeter. Otherwise,you would know that the test pads are made of similar material as the bags and they most certainly do restrict the airflow! You can tell this by attaching the dirtmeter with NO pad installed. Then turn on the Kirby and place your hand underneath the dirtmeter and feel the powerful blast of air against your hand. Then turn off the machine and install a test pad into the dirtmeter and turn on the machine again and then feel the obvious reduction of airflow against your hand. So it is not so that the performance of the Kirby with a dirtmeter will be better than with a clean newly installed bag.




This post was last edited 01/10/2014 at 12:41
Post# 262694 , Reply# 38   1/10/2014 at 14:03 (3,755 days old) by Blackheart (North Dakota)        
EH....

blackheart's profile picture
When it comes to carpet cleaning i don't believe the NSS could beat the kirby because it lacks agitation as a straight suction machine. Now if it were paired with a good power nozzle i'd give it a maybe.

As for the dirt meter yes it definitely does cause restriction i have two types of pads ones which came with the meter that are lower filtration and some that came with my Riccar/Simplicity meters which are very similar to the material used in hepa bags. to give an idea of how restrictive they are i used my G6 with it's hose and the baird meter.
With a new (or close to) new bag it's pulling a 6.5
With the meter in place and the lower filtration pads it's pulling between 4.5 and 5
With the higher filtration pads it pulls about a 4.5

With the lower surface area the air cannot flow as easily and it also becomes clogged up much quicker so you do have lower performance with the demo tools in place.


Post# 262712 , Reply# 39   1/10/2014 at 17:58 (3,755 days old) by caligula (Wallingford, Connecticut)        
Hi Kirbysthebest

caligula's profile picture

I was one of the lucky people who rarely worked in the field. My area distributor was Will Hart of Oak Park Kirby. Oak Park was a suburb of Chicago, and my job was to assist in hiring the new recruits and training them on the demo process. After I took them on two weeks of demo's where I did one, and the trainee assigned to me for that day did the next, I fine tuned them, then turned them over to another Kirby trainer who did the 'field' training. However, while some of my trainees knocked doors, that was not the bulk of our demos. Ours were from home shows, grocery give away's, free carpet shampoos, and so on. In addition, I trained our phone crew to set-up demo's following the procedure I stated earlier.

 

In addition to working for Will Hart, I was also asked to go to San Diego, California in September 1979 to January 1980 to fill in for the trainer at Pacific Coast Kirby when the trainer suffered a slight stroke.  My last Kirby office was for distributor John Adams of Lombard, Illinois, my job there was to help him build his sales crew. However, in each case, I worked mostly in the office, or one on one with the new trainees.


Post# 262713 , Reply# 40   1/10/2014 at 18:18 (3,755 days old) by Kirbysthebest (Midwest)        
We were in Illinois at the same time

Just different parts. I was working the the Macomb area. I loved fair season and homeshows. Tommy Baird in Springfield had a crew that had twin girls in a Corvette that sold more machines than anyone in our division that year.

I had one time that I sold the machine so well that the lady of the house was crying because of the dirt. I gave it to her for my cost, I felt so bad. She was such a sweet lady, they were friends of my step-father so I knew she wasn't putting on, and they were farmers so they were not rich people.


Post# 262727 , Reply# 41   1/11/2014 at 00:05 (3,755 days old) by caligula (Wallingford, Connecticut)        
Hi Kirbysthebest

caligula's profile picture

I was born on September 2, 1950, in Wallingford, Connecticut, about 40 miles away from the Electrolux factory which was in Old Greenwich. In September of 1972, when I was 22, I got a job offer to work for the Indiana Dunes National Park in Chesterton, Indiana, which was only 50 miles from Chicago. Fate stepped in and I wound up in Dubuque, Iowa, where I started as a salesman for Kirby. In 1977, I ended up in Oak Park, Illinois as a training manager for Kirby, and stayed in that area living in nearby Naperville, turning my home into the headquarters for the V.C.C.C. producing the newsletters till May of 95 when I relocated to San Diego, California, and got out of the vacuum cleaner business and into nursing, dealing with hospice care. In January of 2011, I ended up here in Northern Pennsylvania. I'm now retired, and starting to get back into vacuum cleaner history and restoration.    


Post# 262750 , Reply# 42   1/11/2014 at 03:03 (3,755 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

When selling the Tristars with a freind-we did the "door Knocking" thing-was just before prospects could schedule a demo of ANY DTD premium vac over their websites.When door knocking you run into prospects rich or poor.The rich ones most likely have a cleaning or janitorial service clean their homes-so right away they are not good prospects.So you try the "middle" neighborhoods.
I feel the Kirby can do better than ANY straight suction machine-agitation by its roller brush is the diffrence maker-same light as comparing any straight suction machine against any roller brush upright or even canister.I do like my Kirby and Pig TOGETHER!!The Pigs huge bag will take along time to fill.When vacuuming new carpeting you do get SOME dirt-but mostly fluff.I vacuumed afreinds newly installed carpet with one of my Royals and the cloth dump bag-Was just as well-I had to dump it several times!And the cloth dump bag is GREAT while picking up Host,Capture,or other dry carpet cleaners.Bet the Kirby and NSS lashup would be GREAT for doing fresh,new carpet or picking up Host type cleaners.Esp if you use the dump bag on the NSS-that will hold something like TWO BUSHELS of fluff!
Yes,we can say just about ANY DTD Premium vac will be still going long after that TTI Hoover,Dirt Devil,Eureka or whatever plastivac has bit the dust literally and sent to its final internment at the landfill-its FINAL emptying!And getting reduced in size in the back of the trash truck!


Post# 262812 , Reply# 43   1/11/2014 at 13:45 (3,754 days old) by caligula (Wallingford, Connecticut)        
Two things I hate about selling vacuum cleaners.

caligula's profile picture

While I have always loved the demo process, I'm not fond of door knocking, and hate closing a sale.

 

The door knocking problem goes back to 1968 when I was working for Electrolux, and promoting the new 1205. I'd just been trained, and loved the demo. I was also a seventeen year old kid obsessed with vacuum cleaners, so I was eager to hit the street and tell people of the 1205. The first door I knocked on was that of an older woman, and as I started to go into my pitch, she closed the door in my face! I was crushed, that killed it for me, like popping a balloon. That feeling of rejection never left me, and while I've had a lot of good sales with both Electrolux and later Kirby, the fear was always there. Fortunately, I became a trainer for Kirby. As my manager knew this phobia, I never knocked doors, and only went on preset appointments.

 

As for closing, people who know me say that I'm too kind to be a salesman. I loved to demo, and did in a way that mixed showmanship, theater, and excitement of showing a great product to people. Then, after setting up a great display, with test cloths everywhere, I went for the close. I was gripped with fear as I wrote down "549.00 complete," and handed it to the husband. Reaction was mixed. I wanted to hug the guy who reached for his checkbook, and secretly cursed the guy who said "we can't afford that!" This meant fighting to get the sale, which I did, and usually got the sale. But the worst, the very worst was when I had a trainee with me, and had to swallow my fear. I've used every sales technic in the book, and worked my butt off landing sales, while not letting my trainee know how scared I was.


Post# 263268 , Reply# 44   1/14/2014 at 04:33 (3,752 days old) by tolivac (Greenville,NC)        

But then--is the sale where the customer is writing you a check--even asks without question "how much" BEFORE you even set up to demo and take the vacuum out of the box-in that case you switch gears and show the prospect the differences between the new vac and their old one and how to use it.It was in New Bern,NC where we ran into two prospects that bought before the machine was pulled out of the box-avid TriStar owners-same manner as avid Kirby,'Lux,Filter Queen,or Rainbow owners.The prospect even serves you soda or coffee and a snack!!

Post# 263344 , Reply# 45   1/14/2014 at 17:30 (3,751 days old) by ralph123 (Little Rock, AR)        

I would think a vacuum collector / vacuum expert would be the Kirby salesman's biggest nightmare. Imagine the look on the Kirby salesman's face when he finds out that he will have to do the cleaning test against all 100 of his vacuums. Or the vacuum expert who knows that the last vac loses and insists that his vacuum gets to go after the Kirby for a rematch.

Post# 311002 , Reply# 46   1/5/2015 at 15:58 (3,395 days old) by floor-a-matic (somewhere)        

Straight suction Compact outperforming a Kirby? I was vacing carpet with a Compact C8 (using metal rug tool) & got a nearly full bag of dirt


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