Thread Number: 18525
Rainbow Performnce |
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Post# 203597 , Reply# 1   10/12/2012 at 21:55 (4,184 days old) by KirbyUltimateG (Troy Ohio 45373 USA)   |   | |
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Hi Adam. I would get the 1st E-Series Rainbow. That is closest to your Rainbow SE PE. Rob |
Post# 203599 , Reply# 2   10/12/2012 at 22:44 (4,184 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 203601 , Reply# 3   10/12/2012 at 23:20 (4,184 days old) by adambomb (Undisclosed )   |   | |
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Thanks y'all! How does the E compare to the E4? |
Post# 203613 , Reply# 4   10/13/2012 at 05:54 (4,184 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY)   |   | |
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Post# 203655 , Reply# 6   10/13/2012 at 19:05 (4,183 days old) by joshdonnell ()   |   | |
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Im shocked that you got one . Manly becuase you told me you didnt like them . Becuase you had one your teacher gave you hated it . But i can see not anymore . Congrats |
Post# 203663 , Reply# 8   10/13/2012 at 22:12 (4,183 days old) by adambomb (Undisclosed )   |   | |
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What model Rainbow do you have? |
Post# 203664 , Reply# 9   10/13/2012 at 22:15 (4,183 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 203674 , Reply# 11   10/13/2012 at 23:39 (4,183 days old) by kirbylux77 (London, Ontario, Canada)   |   | |
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If the current black Rainbow E4 is so good, then WHY is there talk that it's replacement is coming out soon?!
Besides a new hose handle, wand, lighted powerhead, lighted basin & dolly, it's pretty much the same as the other E-Series models. And maybe I am being too skeptical here, but IF, in the unlikely event I changed my mind & bought a Rainbow, I would be purchasing the first E-Series, as it uses a motor with carbon brushes & the HEPA filter isn't a Washable HEPA filter, like today's models are. I'm not willing to invest money in a switched-reluctance motor when the technology hasn't been proven long-term to be reliable. As a matter of fact, a good reason to get an older model E-Series is that you could put any powerhead you want with it, perhaps a Wessell EBK340 or Eureka Express powerhead, & get rid of the Rainbow powerhead if you wish. All you would need to do is install the Rainbow powerhead cord on the new powerhead. Rob |
Post# 203679 , Reply# 12   10/14/2012 at 03:05 (4,183 days old) by adambomb (Undisclosed )   |   | |
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Dan: I plan to :) Josh: I've heard great things about the Hyla. I say go for it. |
Post# 203690 , Reply# 13   10/14/2012 at 09:49 (4,183 days old) by kirbyloverdan (Egg Harbor Twp . NJ aka HOOVERLOVERDAN ❤️)   |   | |
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Post# 203778 , Reply# 14   10/14/2012 at 21:47 (4,182 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY)   |   | |
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What else can be done to improve the Black Rainbow? They've pretty much addressed most everything I can think of.
As far as the washable hepa filters and switch reluctance: The hepa filters past the E series one speed can either be washed and or replaced the same as a one speed. Mine is the Gold 2 speed and I have had no trouble with the motor. I will mention ONE thing they can improve upon. Those little clips on the end of the hose that snap into the main unit. Those need to be made of something unbreakable. One day I was carrying the hose over my shoulder walking into another room and the end of the hose tapped the side of the wall in such a way that it broke part of the clip off. It was the non electric hose |
Post# 203786 , Reply# 15   10/14/2012 at 22:15 (4,182 days old) by kirbylux77 (London, Ontario, Canada)   |   | |
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Mark
Well, for starters they need to go back to making the HEPA filter non-washable. The FIRST E-Series E1 models apparently call for a different HEPA filter that is non-washable than the second E-Series E1 models that switched to the Ametek motor with carbon brushes. And they need to DRAMATICALLY improve the waterlift & airflow ratings!! Seriously, both the E-Series & E2 Gold machines with switched reluctance motors I have tried, I have been unimpressed with....I think even the D4 had better suction than they did! And I'm not a huge fan of that new powerhead....they need to come up with a better design. By the way, speaking of the powerhead....this is what I have heard is the cause for the re-design & release of a new model. I have heard they are having problems with the new powerhead. Rob |
Post# 203807 , Reply# 16   10/15/2012 at 07:10 (4,182 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)   |   | |
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I bought a new Rainbow a couple of months ago and so far I am very pleased with it. I have deep pile carpeting and the power head works very well although I think the side rotating brushes could extend further out. Because of the weight of the power head, it feels solid, unlike the FQ power head Just having one hose, the quick connect wands and the lighted water basin are great features.
Gary |
Post# 203886 , Reply# 17   10/15/2012 at 20:53 (4,181 days old) by floor-a-matic (somewhere)   |   | |
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@Joshdonnell Is your E Series single or two-speed? I'm not so sure about buying the new E3; but what problems are going on with the new model? |
Post# 203900 , Reply# 18   10/15/2012 at 22:05 (4,181 days old) by pr-21 (Middletown, OH)   |   | |
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The only thing I noticed was on the goodvac site. They have changed the belt a few times. I am still on my original belt with no problems and have had the machine for about 3 months or so...The width is the only difference if you read the goodvac website. I did purchase a few that goodvac said was the latest, however when I bought my Rainbow, I got a few extra belts and they were identical to the ones I bought from Goodvac. This is by far the best power nozzle since the ones that looked like Eureka power nozzles.
Sincerely, Bud Mattingly PR-21 |
Post# 203901 , Reply# 19   10/15/2012 at 22:22 (4,181 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY)   |   | |
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I have heard of NO problem with the Black Rainbow at all. I know several people who have had them over a year. If you do run into problems, they have very LONG warranties. Rainbow pays MUCH attention to detail. That's ALL they make are Rainbows in the Michigan plant. Do not worry. Buy the Black Rainbow, take care of it and you'll be happy! Trust me.
Just be aware they take a wee bit more to get used to as you already know. Once you get into the groove, it's not a problem. And the suction may not be 100's of inches of water lift, but at least it's constant, 100 % as if you just put a fresh bag in the entire time you ever vacuum with it. |
Post# 203926 , Reply# 20   10/16/2012 at 02:22 (4,181 days old) by adambomb (Undisclosed )   |   | |
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puts Kirby's warranty to shame! New Kirby Sentria II - Three Year Limited Warranty New Rainbow Black - 8 Year Warranty, the first 4 cover it bumper to bumper! Kirby should have done that a LONG time ago, since they're so reliable. |
Post# 203959 , Reply# 22   10/16/2012 at 14:52 (4,180 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY)   |   | |
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Post# 204003 , Reply# 25   10/17/2012 at 02:19 (4,180 days old) by kirbylux77 (London, Ontario, Canada)   |   | |
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You bring up a VERY GOOD point when you mention Waterlift ratings....and for me, along with the filtration, it's a primary reason NOT to buy a Rainbow. When you use a new canister vacuum with 100" waterlift, like any Miele after 2004 with the Vortex motor, Sebo D4, Perfect metal canister....the list goes on from there....Yes, you WILL lose suction using the HEPA cloth bags, no doubt about it. BUT, if you filled up the bag over a month's time doing weekly or twice-weekly vacuumings, & then changed the bag when it was full & suction was low, before you put your next bag in, put a waterlift gauge on it. Chances are VERY GOOD that vacuum will be pulling AT LEAST 65-70" Waterlift through the hose. In other words, that bagged canister vacuum would still be cleaning as well as your Rainbow, & before that when the bag was new, it would be signifigantly outcleaning the Rainbow.
As for the smell from the Kirby bags- well that's just a natural advantage ANY bagless vacuum has,regardless of whether it uses water or not. You're disposing of the dirt each time you vacuum, empty the bin & clean your primary filter, assuming this is a filtered bagless vacuum & not multi-cyclonic or water filtration. Plus, the one advantage HEPA Cloth bags have over ANY bagless vacuum that uses a HEPA filter for the exhaust is the fact that every time you change your bag, you get a new filter. And for those vacuums that use both a HEPA Cloth bag & True HEPA exhaust filter, the HEPA Cloth bag is what's doing the majority of the filtration. As long as you're changing your bags when you're supposed to, you shouldn't be having a problem with smells, & if so, you can always look into scent tablets or perhaps pick up a little bit of carpet deodorizer. I never have been, and never will be, convinced that Water Filtration vacuums are best. What convinced me is when I owned my Rainbow D4 Performance Edition many years ago....actually seeing the dirt on the Separator, it just makes no sense that the Water Filtration is doing the job it claims. Even if it does filter ok, it's just a good alternative to using filtered cyclonic vacuums & not cleaning a messy pleated primary filter, or having to deal with a dust cloud that can happen with dry bagless vacuums. The E Series models also have the disadvantage of using a Washable HEPA filter, which NEVER filters as well as a True HEPA disposable filter, & DOES lose it's efficiency with each washing. I will always believe that a bagged vacuum, either HEPA Cloth or paper bags, along with a HEPA exhaust filter on canisters, is the best approach to achieve superior filtration results. Rob |
Post# 204008 , Reply# 26   10/17/2012 at 05:22 (4,180 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY)   |   | |
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Kirbylux - I don't know what to tell you. How can the water not be filtering the dirt if I have a white hepa and clean smelling (on both sides) filter and clean fans on my Rainbow after over six years? After I'm done cleaning, I do clean the separator, but there's never any dirt on it when I do clean it........I've had those bagged vacs with super strong suction and I like them, but I do have to say that after cleaning top to bottom with the Rainbow vs the bagged vacuum, there is a difference. Can't explain it, but there is......I've never owned an SE Rainbow......Improvements perhaps over the years?
I do not have buyers remorse and I have not convinced myself that it's an awesome vacuum just because I paid so much for it. I would completely admit to that if that were the case. But after using it and being the super clean freak that I am, can tell you that it is an awesome vacuum..But it's not for everyone...There's NOTHING wrong with bagged vacuums. They are great, I love my Epic 6500....I just read so many negatives about the Rainbow and most of them have not been true at all and it URKS me. Joel - You know what you can do to keep the bag from smelling? Take some Rainbow D&A (green) and soak a cotton ball with it and suck it up. There is something in it that kills bacteria and the bag won't smell for a long time! I think there's this stuff Kirby sells someone was telling me about called Odorific or something like that. I'm guessing it is the same thing. Both should work. |
Post# 204073 , Reply# 28   10/17/2012 at 22:33 (4,179 days old) by rainbowjoel (Dexter NM)   |   | |
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I know you mean. I have cwp brush roll and original brush roll. I like little stiffer like other Hoovers. |
Post# 204080 , Reply# 29   10/18/2012 at 00:04 (4,179 days old) by kirbylux77 (London, Ontario, Canada)   |   | |
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I can honestly say that my Rainbow experience has been far different than yours then. Back when I had my Rainbow D4 Performance Edition, I had it as well as my Fakir S220 German-made canister vacuum that has self-sealing paper micro-filtration bags & Encapsulated True HEPA filtration (meaning the HEPA is before the motor). I have a Eureka Express PN, Plastiflex hose & Dirt Sensor lower wand I use with it. I was sharing a house with 3 other people at this time, & the house had light brown, cut medium pile carpeting in the living room, dining room, & all the bedrooms. I used the Rainbow as my main vacuum when I vacuumed every couple of days, as I wanted to save money on bags, & didn't mind the setup & cleaning. This house needed it BADLY once every couple of days, due to the amount of foot traffic & sand. Now, once every couple of weeks, I would take my Fakir S220 out & use it....EVERY TIME I used it, I wound up having the Dirt Sensor go off CONSTANTLY when cleaning the living room & dining room, where the heaviest traffic was, On top of that, the bag would be 1/4 full of sand & fine dust....and these rooms would have JUST BEEN VACUUMED with the Rainbow. This was only to make sure everything was getting picked up. Now, bear in mind I was using the Rainbow properly, filling it to the proper level, changing water every 20 minutes, & cleaning it's Separator after each vacuuming. I never was impressed seeing the dirt on the Separator, & even less so with seeing the dirt in the bag on my Fakir canister. Just to give an idea of performance here....the Fakir canister I have pulls 90" Waterlift, Rainbow D4 60" Waterlift.
As far as your assertion you have never seen dust on your HEPA filter & it remains white & clean smelling, & you never see dust on your Separator or in your motor fans....don't take this the wrong way, but since you are a Vacuum Collector, you would have taken FAR BETTER care of it than the average consumer who probably just follows the instructions & maybe even some who downright abuse their Rainbow vacuums. Therefore, your results you have seen with yours are irrelevant when we're talking about dust emissions & what is actually getting to the HEPA filter. In my town, whenever we do see an E Series Rainbow come in for repairs, they ALWAYS have lots of dust on their HEPA filters, even if the Separator is clean. The fact of the matter is, THERE'S A REASON why Consumer Reports always gave Rainbow the lowest scores for dust emissions when the D3 & D4 were out....in my opinion, Water Filtration does NOT work as well as Rexair would have everyone believe, & it does let out a LOT of dust. Come on now! Can you NOT see that Rexair putting the HEPA filter on the E Series was basically an admission they KNEW their system was flawed?! Why would they go from 1936 to 1998, go all those years with water alone, & then suddenly add a HEPA filter to it? It's obvious that Consumer Reports's testing trapped them in a corner....and they knew it. Mark, tell ya what....if you REALLY think your Rainbow is doing the job you think it is, try using ONLY your Rainbow for 6 months. Then give your carpets a thorough cleaning with your Electrolux with a fresh bag installed....and be prepared to be disgusted with the results! I respect your decision to use Water Filtration vacuums as your primary vacuum of choice, but until Rainbow DRAMATICALLY improves the Waterlift rating on the E Series, I won't even consider using one in my home, & I'll stick with Electrolux & high-end European canisters with HEPA bags & filters. Rob |
Post# 204081 , Reply# 30   10/18/2012 at 00:08 (4,179 days old) by kirbylux77 (London, Ontario, Canada)   |   | |
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Oh, and one thing I nearly forgot....I agree with Josh when he says the Kirby is built better than the Rainbow. I have always felt the E Series was very plasticky & didn't have the feeling of quality. And like I said before, I don't like that the Switched Reluctance motor hasn't been in the market longterm with a proven track record of quality & reliability. For my home, Kirby is the way to go if you want a quality, long-lasting lifetime system.
Rob |
Post# 204082 , Reply# 31   10/18/2012 at 00:33 (4,179 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY)   |   | |
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I'm not a collector. I actually use my vacuums........I rotate with the Rainbow and the Lux......But I will tell you that I used my Rainbow only for way over six months before without using any other vacuum, especially the first two years, and I used it a LOT. I still do, but not as much as I did the first two years......and when I used the bagged canister, it still took a long time for the bag to fill. The Rainbow WAS doing it's job. Had it not been, I'm sure that all the dirt that you say was staying in the carpets and not getting properly cleaned would have eventually caused a dusty mess in my house just simply from walking on carpet and stirring dust up.
The E series has a different material and style separator than those earlier SE or D3 rainbows. I do remember those separators would get dirty and dirt would stick to them. My Grandma had a D3 in the 80s and I vividly remember cleaning it and it was a pain......However, we abused the hell out of that Rainbow. We didn't change the water and it would get thick.......I guess we didn't know any better. I honestly can't remember changing the water EVER when we vacuumed..... Whatever material these E series separators are made of are different. Nothing sticks to them........OR.......If it does, it takes a LONG time for dirt to accumulate on them if you never clean them... And regarding suction.........At least on my Gold 2 speed, the suction is more than adequate. It has a 14 foot non electric hose that I use and as an example, when I vacuum the blankets the cats lay on it tries to inhale them the suction is so strong. I'm not really doing anything special. All I do is change the water, which NOW I usually only have to change it two to three times MAX to clean the entire house, clean separator and basin and put everything away. I've examined my hepa filter VERY carefully because I find it so hard to believe that it can still be good after all this time. Even Rainbow says the have it checked and possibly replaced after two years.......I bought a new hepa on Ebay for 15 dollars for my Rainbow. It's generic. I can't tell a difference at all.......But I put the new one on to see if the performance would change at all. No noticeable increase in airflow, the machine still runs cool, air pours out the back of the filter as if it was still new, so I put the old one back on and have the new one ready to use if I ever need it....... Now with all of that being said.........Sometimes I DO NOT enjoy using it! Sometimes I don't even WANT to vacuum, period. I get tired of it. But the neat freak in me has to vacuum every day or at least every other day. JOEL - I don't SOAK the cotton ball to the point that it's dripping wet. I just put a few drops on it. SORRY to the OP.....Still on the topic of Rainbow vacuums, but I went off in another direction. |
Post# 204091 , Reply# 32   10/18/2012 at 07:06 (4,179 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)   |   | |
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Rob,
With respect to Rainbow adding the Hepa filter....almost every vacuum manufacturer added a Hepa filter, including Electrolux, to their machines as that seemed to be the 'in' thing of the time so why wouldn't Rainbow do the same thing? I don't think it has anything to do with them being cornered by Consumer Reports. I've used my black Rainbow for 2 months now on a weekly basis and all I can say is that I'm pleased with it. To each their own. Gary |
Post# 204093 , Reply# 33   10/18/2012 at 07:31 (4,179 days old) by eurekastar (Amarillo, Texas)   |   | |
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Post# 207200 , Reply# 41   11/20/2012 at 05:19 (4,146 days old) by mark40511 (Lexington, KY)   |   | |
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of people having to change their PN belt a lot.........It's so strange that every vacuum I've ever owned, I've never had to do this. I've never felt a slip or any sign that it needs changed......The Kenmore, the Phantom upright I had, the Rainbow, the Electrolux, all of them.......I've never had to change a belt.........Wouldn't there be some sort of obvious sign that they need changing? If there is, I haven't seen it on any vacuum I've ever owned.......I even changed my Rainbow belt once thinking it MUST need changing by now, and after changing it, there was absolutely no difference..
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Post# 207205 , Reply# 43   11/20/2012 at 07:10 (4,146 days old) by countryguy (Astorville, ON, Canada)   |   | |
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I like the wheels on the new Filter Queens. I find it rolls very easily on floors and carpet. And if the wheel is positioned right under the hose inlet then it should never tip over when pulling it. The problem I have with the dolly on the Rainbow E4 is that the middle set of wheels are always getting hung up on the cord.
Gary |