Thread Number: 16261
Miele S2 Versus Miele S5 |
[Down to Last] |
Post# 173462   3/16/2012 at 09:32 (4,423 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 173474 , Reply# 1   3/16/2012 at 10:25 (4,423 days old) by Sanifan ()   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
It has a higher number. It has to be better! :P |
Post# 173514 , Reply# 5   3/16/2012 at 17:52 (4,422 days old) by joshdonnell ()   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Id rather store the filth then mess with a water bucket. When you buy a water vacuum all your really getting is a bucket with a motor really. I could do better . |
Post# 173524 , Reply# 6   3/16/2012 at 18:53 (4,422 days old) by pr-21 (Middletown, OH)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 173526 , Reply# 7   3/16/2012 at 19:02 (4,422 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 173547 , Reply# 9   3/16/2012 at 20:54 (4,422 days old) by piano_god (British Columbia, Canada)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
While the S2 uses the GN bag shared with the S5, the bag chamber will not allow the bag to inflate to its full potential. And, as Bud mentioned, the S2 is not a sealed system. Also, the S2 shares the same motor with the S6 and S7 machines, while the S5 employs a larger motor. For the same price point as the S2, the S6 is a better constructed machine and it's sealed. Its only downfall is the use of the smaller FJM bag...
No matter what type of vacuum (paper bagged, reusable cloth bag, melt blown polypropylene bagged, filtered bagless, cylconic bagless and water-filtered) some form of filth will always remain in the machine and in its filters. We must not forget the attachments and hose which will also accumulate filth, even after one use.
As for vacuums used in the most demanding of situations, those used for dry hazardous material recovery or in cleanroom environments, they all share one similarity - they're bagged... |
Post# 173561 , Reply# 10   3/16/2012 at 22:23 (4,422 days old) by aeoliandave (Stratford Ontario Canada)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
I, too, could not understand Miele risking it's good name by entering into the low end market to artificially increase sales. But then I am not one of the avaricious stakeholders of Miele Corp seeking to rape profits in this disastrous doomed from the start Globalization Economy model that has plunged our world into the sorry state it is now in...until I delved into the situation a mite bit deeper
"Review - Miele S2 Series Econo Line Canister Vacuums
This last statement pretty much asserts that Miele believes - and trusts - that the bumperless thin plastic carcases will fail quickly and perhaps they believe that this will drive the majority of owners to upgrade? I don't think so...
It would not surprise me to learn that Miele has sub-contracted the manufacture of the S2 to the PRC.
A long standing, successful and well-respected Vacuum Cleaner Dealership in London Ontario Canada is McHardy Vacuum; they pull no punches comparing the S2 to the rest of the Miele line-up.
Entry level? The S2 Contour retails for $499.99 at Sears Canada while Costco has it listed at $399. Canadian Tire has the S2 Momentum for $599.99 while Future Shop will sell you either the Contour or the Momentum for the above prices. From a quick Canadian survey it would appear that the S2 is not available at Miele vacuum Shops but being dumped at the Big Box stores here. I smack my forehead at the gullibility of the uneducated consumer.
I also noticed that in Canada the Dealership's Contour and Momentum models are in fact the superior S4. Some hapless folks will be confused by the same model names and flock to the Big Box for a perceived 'deal'. McHardy does indeed guarantee to match any other price but since they don't sell the S2...well, Miele is doing legitimate shops a dis-service duplicating the model name on two decidedly different quality machines. Meile Canada will say it is not competeing with Vacuum Shops but they are engaging in deception through mis-direction.
This blog comment pretty much sums up the important differences - "needs to be a simple, reliable work horse,store compactly, do its job well. would like on-board storage. do not want electric wand/telescope. will buy parquet floor attachment. miele- s2 Olympus- cheapest, lightest while using the largest bag. i really thought this was a perfect first vacuum but it lacks on-board storage and does not store upright/compactly. made in china? skimped on finish and uses lesser quality attachments, uses the largest bag but is it able to fill it up within the compact canister? s5 ariel or pisces- basic s5 models. hepa filter, non electric wand, uses largest bag and stores compactly. finish and quality of materials is better than the s2 class, but is it more than $200 better quality/materials vs the olympus? skipping the s4 group b/c they use a smaller bag but is midsize?
The Public at large is not as universally stoopid as Miele could hope!
Dave CLICK HERE TO GO TO aeoliandave's LINK |
Post# 173566 , Reply# 12   3/16/2012 at 23:18 (4,422 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Thank you so far for the replies. My honest opinion:
The S2 was designed to offer buyers on a budget, a cut price S5 - but I never really thought the S2 should ever have been released - not when the S4 and now, S6 is still the smaller canister in the family and relies on the smaller FJM bags, which also competes on capacity with Bosch, Sebo, Hoover et al. The same FJM in the S4 and S6 measure 3.5 litres whereas the older S300, S500 et al series allows a bigger capacity to 4 litres - and gave buyers the premium feel without sacrificing Miele "standard" features. In the UK for example, before the S2 came to market, Miele solely relied on their S281, S371, S381 (shown below), a hardy, heavy robust vacuum cleaner that kept the tools inside and relied heavily on older model design. I had that one for many years before a friend in need, needed a vacuum to replace her long standing 1990's S571, a model that I already owned and so we swapped over, with minor repair to mouldings and pedal replacements I did myself. I like the older Miele models - everything is on board instead of flexible, silly plastic holders that clip to the hose end, sit externally and whether they are designed to lock in by pushing them far enough, they're still liable to fall off when or if the vacuum cleaner knocks against a skirting board or a wall or whatever. I don't know what the situation is in the U.S where the S2 is concerned - but against the S500, S300, S4, S6 and S5 series, the S2 budget range comes with far shorter suction pipes, and they're not telescopic height adjustable - and I initially thought they were all the same. So when it comes to recommending, I stay clear of the S2 - for the cost prices that start on average at £149-00 against the normal £199 (John Lewis are currently doing a special discount deal at £149 currently for the bas S5211), you're getting a bit more with "standard features," like tools that can be safely hidden away, slightly longer telescopic "one piece" suction pipes that extend to 2, 1 metre more on the power cable length - and uses the same dust bag. I thought Miele were the best however until I discovered the other German brands, Bosch and Sebo. Bosch is the cheapest out of the 3 with SEBO being in the middle and Miele's endless run of non-essential canister models that change per floor head spec and colours. Sebo's attention to "actual use" could teach Miele a thing or two from lighter 500g telescopic tubing and longer hose lengths, which in effect, when in use, you've got a lighter principle when it comes to handling. If Sebo and Bosch can make telescopic height adjustable tubes that weigh less than 500g whereas the Miele tubes are unnecessarily heavier and shorter hoses against Sebo's bigger length, several of SEBO's canisters may not look good, but they have a better design generally for use. Miele's only lightweight component, for the meantime is the basic "fibreteq" suction only-pedal floor head that comes with the base S2 models but when you have heavier suction pipes for that to lock onto, it doesn't make much sense. The downside to Bosch is that everything fits friction style, so if you haven't jammed the tools, the pipes and the floor heads on firm enough, they're liable to fall off - and taking them on/off when required to use the smaller, cheaper produced cleaning tools isn't as easy. Bosch hoses are also pretty small on length but the mains power cord lengths are usually longer than Miele. Miele's biggest mistake is not updating their stick vacuums - and ceasing production of selling them in the UK. Other European countries seem to love the mains powered stick vacuum idea and it looks as if Miele are cost cutting for the sake of not producing a model that would give buyers more versatility as well as another upright in the range that would not inflict damage to S7 sales. The D'Art was a fantastic, if not unique idea but many of the models suffered from clogging because of the its "L" shape suction channel - plus they were all suction only models, which kind of defeated the purpose based on its general design. |
Post# 173573 , Reply# 13   3/17/2012 at 00:12 (4,422 days old) by piano_god (British Columbia, Canada)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Costs are reduced as the S2 is made on a fully automated assembly line at Miele's plant in Bielefeld, Germany. This vacuum is NOT made in China.
The S2 is an excellent vacuum in the department store setting. While it is not sealed and has a reduction in components and less plastic, it still retains high-quality components and Miele's in-house manufactured motor. Truth be told, it's probably one of the best built vacuums available at a department store in Canada.
Canadian Tire's S2 Contour is $100.00 more because it comes standard with the STB 205-3 Turbobrush.
I own a S2 Momentum and while it is not my favorite machine out of the ten Miele's I own, it still is an excellent vacuum. While not as refined as other Miele's, it does exactly what it was designed to do and does it well.
The whole Contour, Momentum and Continuum names through multiple lines does get rather confusing, though... |
Post# 173612 , Reply# 14   3/17/2012 at 02:34 (4,422 days old) by pr-21 (Middletown, OH)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Someone mentioned Mchardy's vacuum. I have bought from them and they indeed are a great vac shop. Since I live in Ohio, I knew it would void the warranty on the Miele S5 Venus and S5 Jupiter, that I purchased at separate times. Graham could not have been more helpful and made sure I knew about the warranty issue before I purchased. The shipping was fast and very reasonable. I had each one of them within a few days, which is almost unheard of when coming from Canada, due to custom checks......If I remember correctly, they used Fed Ex.
Anyway another point to this is someone mentioned so many models. Miele Canada only shows 3 S5's on their website. Maybe Venson they are going to change that in the US as well or do people in the US drive all these colors. I will admit that I bought the Jupiter from Canada partly due to the Blue Color, the Capricorn here was silver and I do not like that color at all. One other thing, Miele came out with a smaller turbo brush that is only sold in their new car care kit for $150.00 in the US. McHardys has it for sale separately, which I am going to buy sometime soon from McHardy's. I already have the other tools in the car care kit.... Sincerely, Bud Mattingly |
Post# 173651 , Reply# 16   3/17/2012 at 08:38 (4,422 days old) by gsheen (Cape Town South Africa)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
One of the reasons manufacturers offer a huge line up is that not every store is going to carry every model and that some models may be exclusive to certain stores. ( especially the upmarket stores) We also have an insane amount of Miele canisters on our market some the same machine with different model no and the only difference is the colour. Its marketing that's all
|
Post# 173656 , Reply# 17   3/17/2012 at 08:47 (4,422 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Luckily the UK doesn't suffer from excess S2 models - we originally had 2 (red model and a blue model) and then exclusive colour models came in, like a all in white model (similar to the one shown on thread 173561.) and now a black/grey model. Just colour changes and price hikes!
One of the things I hate about the S2 is when you open the main door and just push the door slightly back a bit more than it will go - you'll then see the suction control dial and its panel bend inwards!! |
Post# 174266 , Reply# 19   3/21/2012 at 10:01 (4,418 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
I dont think its incredibly well built - as Bud points out - it isn't sealed and this was one reason to why I created the thread as well as holding a genuine interest. I'm also a fan of the S4000 range and didn't take to the S2000 in the UK. S2 models start at around £109 against Bosch models that are similar on capacity, yet better built. Cheapest canister vacuum is £60 from Electrolux.
The plastics are thinner than those on the S4, the bag doesn't inflate out properly, the mains cord is shorter. As someone else has pointed out, I don't think it adds to Miele's reputation as building quality vacuums. Miele did well with the S4. They should have stopped then instead of confusing model names like the S6 (buyers who have existing S5 models may assume the S6 is the replacement, instead of it being the S4's successor.) |
Post# 174305 , Reply# 21   3/21/2012 at 18:41 (4,417 days old) by joshdonnell ()   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Mieles the best screww the rest haha |
Post# 174317 , Reply# 23   3/21/2012 at 22:22 (4,417 days old) by joshdonnell ()   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
1    
Rainbows cant filter everything . No vacuum can |
Post# 174341 , Reply# 26   3/22/2012 at 07:03 (4,417 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Koobam
Shame you don't put your money where your mouth is. Miele motors don't last forever. Mine didn't last on my S4 and I've heard similar stories online from owners where moisture, damp rooms where a Miele vacuum is stored over time can get damaged. The motors aren't well built for protection. William Miele don't really make upgraded dust bags - all the current machines above 1600 watts (you'd have to find the U.S equivalent) now use sythetic high filter disposable dust bags. Machines with the lower wattages use paper bags from Miele but liable to burst if you try them in the current machines. Maybe in the U.S where the models are more selective over specs, but the S2's in the UK suffer from 2 separate suction pipes that are shorter in height compared to the S5 & S6 standard, lighter suction only floor head, and a shorter amount of power cord. I think the hoses are slightly smaller too. Certainly if I was ever in the market for the S2, I'd have to kit the machine out with better tools to custom build my needs - but then we have that opportunity in the UK to custom build thanks to Miele selling the products and accessories online - therefore you can also upgrade the filter system easily - but of course it costs - to your needs. If the U.S had a high spec S2 model, there could be a question in justifying why you would buy the base S5 model over a high spec S2, and thus no wonder there would be some confusion. Clearly owners on here know of the differences - the bag chamber that holds the bag in the S2 is smaller than the S5, thus the bag won't inflate to it's fullest size, making it last longer. The S2's are a good design - on paper - but even the S5 is saddled with a short amount of cord compared to rival brands. |
Post# 174351 , Reply# 27   3/22/2012 at 08:50 (4,417 days old) by williamr1248 (USA)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Sebo fan, Thanks for your input. When I go back and look at the picture you can see the bag somewhat folded at the back of the compartment. |
Post# 174368 , Reply# 28   3/22/2012 at 12:36 (4,417 days old) by joshdonnell ()   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
A miele motor will last 20 years if you take care of it . Maybe yours didnt ad long because you didnt take care of like changing the premotor filter Or the bag |
Post# 174435 , Reply# 29   3/22/2012 at 21:18 (4,416 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Nope Josh - filters were fine- elderly relative in my home picked up what she thought was grit by the door following heavy winter. It was snow encrusted grit - result being bag got totally wet, when the cylinder/canister was stored upright, gravity laws intervened, water hit the base of the bag and dampened the useless thin motor filter - hey ho - no surprise to find motor totally guffed once the filter got damp. Lesson learnt the hard way and a perfectly good S4 totally ruined!
|
Post# 174443 , Reply# 30   3/22/2012 at 22:00 (4,416 days old) by Koobam ()   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
That's YOUR fault. One time I crashed a car, it actually got damaged - absolutely awful car because it wasn't impervious to user error. Frickin' physics and science man...just not fair :/ |
Post# 174484 , Reply# 31   3/23/2012 at 04:32 (4,416 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 174509 , Reply# 32   3/23/2012 at 09:03 (4,416 days old) by joshdonnell ()   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Well if youtake care of it will last. I know mine will because i take car of mine! Unlike some people |
Post# 174656 , Reply# 33   3/24/2012 at 06:12 (4,415 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 234054 , Reply# 35   5/26/2013 at 08:08 (3,987 days old) by Morax ()   |   | |
This post has been removed by the webmaster. |
Post# 234056 , Reply# 36   5/26/2013 at 09:34 (3,987 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 234065 , Reply# 37   5/26/2013 at 12:27 (3,987 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
Well I finally sold the S2111 I had. I couldn't wait to get rid of it. Another couple of weaknesses soon became apparent with this vacuum compared to the better S5:
|
Post# 234070 , Reply# 38   5/26/2013 at 13:50 (3,987 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 234083 , Reply# 39   5/26/2013 at 15:18 (3,987 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 234084 , Reply# 40   5/26/2013 at 15:22 (3,987 days old) by suckolux (Yuba City, CA)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 234135 , Reply# 41   5/27/2013 at 05:00 (3,986 days old) by sebo_fan (Scotland, UK, member AKA ukvacfan, & Nar2)   |   | |
Checkrate/Likes
 
     
|
Post# 238910 , Reply# 42   7/4/2013 at 06:29 (3,948 days old) by wcmommy ()   |   | |
This post has been removed by the webmaster. |